Author Topic: When does play stop and fighting begin...  (Read 895 times)

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Offline Saffie

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When does play stop and fighting begin...
« on: March 29, 2007, 10:35:26 AM »
Saffie is around 13 months old now and over the weekend we had a friends dog over to stay (he is a working cocker and 2 and a half years old). As always the first few hours are none stop play. But this time they both seemed to be alot more vocal with soft growls and snorting sounds. Also on alot of occassions teeth are being shown and they both look evil. I know if they wanted to they could quite easierly damage each other but I am never sure if their play is becoming more than just play.

Also Saffie seems to be getting a bit jealous inside the house, if playto got any attentions or a fuss then saffie would zoom over and put herself between me and playto. Wish this worked when out on walks but as usual she seemed more than happy to ignor and spend all her time trying to catch up with playtos tail and jump on him.

Playto gets a brother at the weekend and I am worried that Saffie might not be as nice to a 8 week old puppy as she is to playto! We will be making a fuss of Troy (Chocolate working cocker) and do not want saffie to attack little helpless Troy.

Any advice over how and what is the best way to introduce them to each other?

Offline clairep4

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Re: When does play stop and fighting begin...
« Reply #1 on: March 29, 2007, 12:27:01 PM »
Congratulations on the new addition coming!

Here is what happened when we introduced Zorro:

Firstly we took Bella with us to meet him at 6 weeks and she was kinda scared of him (probably cos he kept charging at her like a little bull!). She then came with us when we picked him up (he was 10 weeks as he was a bit of an unexpected addition at the time).

The first 3 days at home were a bit nerve wracking but if you know what to expect it helps - basically the older dog is likely to lay down the law to the pup so that it knows the do's and don'ts of its new home. Bella spent 3 days basically  keeping a very close eye on Zorro and telling him off quite severely if he did anything she didn't like. The tellings-off had a scale (presumably depending on how bad his "crime" was), ranging from just low grumbling at him (for walking too close to her), to rushing at him snarling, flipping him neatly onto his back and standing over him growling for a moment before letting him go. There were all the variations in between these two as well.

Zorro screamed blue murder for the more severe tellings off and sometimes he'd scream and scream and we'd be worried that Bella was going overboard, but 10 out of 10 times when we'd pick him up afterwards he wouldn't even have any of her spit on him so she was clearly not actually touching him at all. We just let them get on with it.

The other things we did were to make sure that Bella got her own space, so we took her for walks on her own, had cuddle times with her upstairs away from him and played games away from him as well, to make sure she knew she was still high in our affections. We used a puppy playpen which we kept in the living room so that Bella could have time out from Zorro if he was harrassing her (and also to teach him that he needed to rely on himself for entertainment sometimes). We also fed them in separate rooms at the start, and they still get their meaty bone meals in separate rooms as Zorro makes a fuss otherwise.

On the morning of day 4, I picked up a string of plastic bones and got Zorro to hold one end, I held it in the middle and Bella grabbed the other end, and tentatively I let go, not knowing whether she'd tell him off for daring to hold onto "her" toy. Thankfully she didn't and they had their first game of tug - they haven't looked back since and they are now so close we can hardly believe it really. Zorro still gets told off occasionally but it really only took a few weeks of Bella letting him know what was acceptable - in fact she's a much better disciplinarian than either of us, he always does as she says which is not the case with us!

Good luck with the new little one...
Claire, Bella & Zorro - the two muppeteers!
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Offline spanielcrazy

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Re: When does play stop and fighting begin...
« Reply #2 on: March 29, 2007, 05:13:18 PM »
If there's a question in your mind then they are probably not fighting. There will be noooo doubt if it turns into a real fight  ;) Just have a look at the "Great Dane" thread in the Other Breeds photo section, it looks like he's going to eat (or neuter  :005:) Jesse, but they are actually having a grand old time.


Is Playto your friends dog (great name!), and they are the ones getting a new puppy?  I would meet in a park or other "neutral" territory, or take Saffie to their house so she will have nothing to guard except herself

It's so hard to predict how any dog is going to react around baby puppies if they've never been around them. Just keep an eye on them, and Saffie is allowed to tell the pup off . Claire gave an excellent description of that, and no harm done to anyone!
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Offline Saffie

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Re: When does play stop and fighting begin...
« Reply #3 on: March 30, 2007, 08:25:40 AM »
Yes it is my friends that are getting a new pup and it will be the first time saffie has met and/or played with a young pup (other than her litter mates). She is a proper bossy little madam around Playto and what ever she wants she will take from him and it then becomes invisible as Playto will not take it back off her!!! I just don't want Troy to be injured because Saffie and Playto perform mock battles and seem to not be able to be aware of anything or anyone else when they are playing. I know Troy will want to join in but dont want him to be flattened in the process. I guess I will have to wait and see what happens and keep an eye on the lot of them. I am also not sure how jealous Saffie will become if I make a fuss of the puppy.

Offline Helen

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Re: When does play stop and fighting begin...
« Reply #4 on: March 30, 2007, 08:39:33 AM »
troy will be a cheeky little git....BUT...he has his puppy licence, and saffie won't hurt him.  it might sound ferocious and there will be telling offs and warnings and maybe a yelp, but as soon as there is a puppy yelp watch playto or saffie back  off.

pups are incredibly resilient, and adult dogs surprisingly accommodating - even if they don't like the puppy i strongly doubt that saffie will hurt him.

she will either play (quite roughly it will seem) or completely ignore him and pretend that small furry thing doesn't exist....


helen & jarvis x


Offline clairep4

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Re: When does play stop and fighting begin...
« Reply #5 on: March 30, 2007, 02:45:31 PM »
troy will be a cheeky little git....BUT...he has his puppy licence, and saffie won't hurt him.  it might sound ferocious and there will be telling offs and warnings and maybe a yelp, but as soon as there is a puppy yelp watch playto or saffie back  off.

pups are incredibly resilient, and adult dogs surprisingly accommodating - even if they don't like the puppy i strongly doubt that saffie will hurt him.

she will either play (quite roughly it will seem) or completely ignore him and pretend that small furry thing doesn't exist....


Absolutely - you only have to see some of the videos on here of pups with adult cockers, pulling their ears as hard as they can and biting their legs and the adults just kinda going  ::) but putting up with it for the most part. And pups pretty much bounce when thrown around by adult cockers, Bella used to just hurl Zorro onto his back, you'd hear his head thudding on the floor and he'd just get up and launch himself back at her with his tail wagging. I think their heads are made of very strong stuff!

On a side note, Bella hit her head accidentally on a table in our living room the other day and being the little fiesty madam she is, she glared at the table and then bit it!  :lol:
Claire, Bella & Zorro - the two muppeteers!
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Offline ali

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Re: When does play stop and fighting begin...
« Reply #6 on: March 30, 2007, 03:00:33 PM »
Also on alot of occassions teeth are being shown and they both look evil. I know if they wanted to they could quite easierly damage each other but I am never sure if their play is becoming more than just play.

i have no experience on introducing a new pup but i was just gonna add on the issue of showing their teeth to each other that we've noticed barkley (who's 15 months old now) recently starting to do this quite a but whilst playing with other dogs. it's always harmless and i think just another form of play but he definitely didn't do it a few months ago and now does with some dogs when they're really getting into it. :)
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