Author Topic: Out of control off lead working cocker  (Read 6747 times)

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Offline Murphys Law

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Re: Out of control off lead working cocker
« Reply #15 on: February 23, 2018, 02:36:55 PM »
Back to basics is the way to go I think.
There is an excellent book, Total Recall, that deals with exactly the same issues you are having and would be well worth a purchase. The worst thing that you can do is blast away on the whistle when there is no chance of it being listened to as the dog very soon learns that it can be ignored.
Get a whistle with a different pitch and start again from scratch.

Offline ips

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Re: Out of control off lead working cocker
« Reply #16 on: February 23, 2018, 02:42:48 PM »
I am late to the party on this only just read it.

Forgive me if I am wrong but you do not mention how you engage with the dog during these walks ?
You seem to be relying on a method to get the dog back into you once you have decided it's gone to far and or lost its head rather than giving the dog something to do "for you" you need to concentrate your efforts into the dog engaging with you that way you will not need to rely on recall.
Allowing the dog to free run has let the genie out of the bottle, dog has now found sights and scent to stimulate it's hunting nature so of course he is going deaf to command. Working cockers are questing breed and will either hunt for you or for themselves but they will hunt the clue is in the name "working". A well bred was will never do walks it will only do hunts
Muddling along in the hope that one day it all makes sense.

Offline ips

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Re: Out of control off lead working cocker
« Reply #17 on: February 23, 2018, 03:07:10 PM »
To give you an idea this is what I do.
I keep her entertained on "walks" I hunt her in cover I constantly recall out of cover and reward by sending her into cover again. I drop blind retrieves I throw marked retrieves I have two identical balls and whilst I am quartering her for one I hide the other so as soon as she delivers the first she is rewarded by being hunted for the second and so the game continued. It's a game to her so she thinks i am the most fun thing in the world even rabbits and birds don't give her this much fun however a game it may be but she is being trained or rather polished the whole time.
This was about two weeks ago just to give you an idea, this is as close as we get to what one may call a "walk"

https://youtu.be/QbXABALwjqA
Muddling along in the hope that one day it all makes sense.

Offline Goddy

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Re: Out of control off lead working cocker
« Reply #18 on: February 23, 2018, 04:17:18 PM »
Just to respond to ips' post - really we do try and engage on the walks.  As I said, she is quite into her ball (for a time) - but even coming back with that is as and when she feels like it - as will run circles "showboating" with it - but not regularly i.e. bring ball back, ball thrown, repeat!  Also, we make lots of fuss when she does come back and are vocal to be exciting, etc! 

Offline ips

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Re: Out of control off lead working cocker
« Reply #19 on: February 23, 2018, 04:36:16 PM »
Are you throwing the ball for her or are you hiding it and making her hunt for it. The latter will be more stimulating mentally. Also drop it without her seeing it and send her back for a blind retrieve. Have two balls or dummies and hide one as she hunt's for one. This is imo an engagement issue you need to find something that floats her boat, is she retrieve or hunt orientated whichever one that is the one to work with. Its a case of giving her what she most desires but in a managed (by you) way.
Muddling along in the hope that one day it all makes sense.

Offline Londongirl

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Re: Out of control off lead working cocker
« Reply #20 on: February 23, 2018, 06:03:48 PM »
I know several trainers who never throw a ball and play ‘fetch’ with their dogs and don’t encourage it. I stopped playing it with Henry about a year ago. It gets him too overstimulated for one thing. And for another, I’m sending him AWAY from me for fun. I know the idea is he will return for you to throw it again, but Henry never reliably did that. Also a showboater! So now we don’t play fetch. It’s a great game for some dogs but it wasn’t working for us.
Rachael (me) and Henry (him)


Offline ips

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Re: Out of control off lead working cocker
« Reply #21 on: February 23, 2018, 06:12:45 PM »
I don't throw in front I toss them left and right for quartering 👍 and never further than 15yds . Lots you can do with balls other than throw em and those ball launchers are the work of the devil 😀
Muddling along in the hope that one day it all makes sense.

Offline Gazrob

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Re: Out of control off lead working cocker
« Reply #22 on: February 25, 2018, 11:28:05 AM »
Hi ips I've had a light bulb moment after reading your tips. My Marley is pretty good 90% of the time however sometimes he loses his head and goes deaf to all commands. I'm now trying to keep him by my side and only occasionally let him do his own thing. I've also started to do marked retrieves however I'm keeping them to around three or four per walk as I don't want him to lose interest in it. I'm struggling with the quartering but I'm trying to keep him quite close now. If I give him too much freedom that's when he starts to lose his head.

Offline Murphys Law

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Re: Out of control off lead working cocker
« Reply #23 on: February 25, 2018, 03:43:14 PM »
Todays walk has made me realise how much I rely on a ball to keep Millie, my wcs, under control. We made an unplanned stop on the field and I was without a ball and whistle.

The little b***** bogged off to an adjacent field, the one I normally use, crossing a busy road on the way. No amount of shouting was going to stop her. Thankfully a car driver saw Millie and slowed down and I manged to stop her, me being very out of breath, before she headed back across the road.
Back to the drawing board for me.

Offline bizzylizzy

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Re: Out of control off lead working cocker
« Reply #24 on: February 25, 2018, 04:02:36 PM »
Todays walk has made me realise how much I rely on a ball to keep Millie, my wcs, under control. We made an unplanned stop on the field and I was without a ball and whistle.

The little b***** bogged off to an adjacent field, the one I normally use, crossing a busy road on the way. No amount of shouting was going to stop her. Thankfully a car driver saw Millie and slowed down and I manged to stop her, me being very out of breath, before she headed back across the road.
Back to the drawing board for me.

Don‘t know whether it‘s  that they can smell spring in the air  ;), but just got back from training and all the dogs have been inattentive this morning,( even the usual „swots“  :lol2:, ) Humphrey‘s had his head in the clouds all week!
Glad Millie came to no harm!