Do you chastise and how?

[Helen]

Yes, I understand that - that made it all the worse, but he would just ignore the happy friendly voices. Fortunately, we don't need to do that anymore...

glad that your whistle is working for you, a whistle has less 'tones' so a dog is more likely to respond to that

[Cazzie]

Just read all this. Hats off to you Pippa what a tremendous translation you have, wish I had this skill.

[Oscardog]

Have been off-line for quite some time - so great to have these responses.  Thanks especially to Pippa for such an informative reply.  It really helped me.

Oscar's 11 months old now and this makes the world of difference. I am trying to perfect a low pitched voice; which sounds disapproving, but is no where near a shout!  He seems to respond really well to that. I tried raising my voice but it got me no where! 

His age also makes a difference now - he's just so ready to please, training is coming on rapidly. I still have difficulty getting to him to come to me in a straight line with a dummy or ball, but without such a toy in his mouth, he is brilliant.  The books say train for short periods every day - so I've tried and it's beginning to pay off.  I have such fun with him now!

[Top Barks]

I have only just seen this and do find it interesting.
For me again you have to do what works with your dog and I do use a gravelly tone of voice to let Bayley know he's out far enough away ( to me it is a non reward marker not punishment). The key is the same as when you interupt any unwanted behaviour in that you have to be able to redirect onto something else more positive and I believe you have to have a conditioned recall in place that you can reward.
As soon as he turns towards me out goes the gravel and the squeaky luvvy tone to my voice kicks in to guide him to his reward.
This technique does not work with Douglas however as he gets stressed very visibly by the gravely voice when I have tried this so we abandoned this for him and just use our whistle recall which works fine.
He will not come anywhere near me until I use a light tone.
So different techniques work for different dogs.
Mark

[cockahoot]

I've read all these posts with great interest becuase at 8 months Izzy is great at her obediance classes although she does seem to have a low boredom level.  Generally speaking she's pretty good at recall when I'm going across the fields, however, she can sniff water a mile away and then just goes deaf on me.  Last week she took off down a badger track and jumped straight into the river which is both deep and quite fast flowing.  I had to drag my other old dog down to the river, tie her to a tree and jump in the river myself to get Izzy out.  When I first got to the river bank I didn't see her and wasn't sure if she had actually gone in or had been swept down stream.  Then I saw her clinging to the edge of the river bank below me.  Problem was I got Izzy out and onto the bank, but could hardly get out of the river myself the bank was so high.  I looked a right royal mess walking home.

I had hoped it had given her a fright but she seems totally uneffected.  She is now on a retractable lead for her own safety and my nerves.  I hate those leads though and don't want her to be on one for ever but don't know how to get her to listen to me when that kind of situation arises.  Nor do I want her to drown.

[Popsey]

Gosh, haven't been online for over year, where does the time go.

I have read this post with interest and Pippa's response is superb.

As a dog owner, you need to find what works best for you and your dog.  Each dog has it's own temperament and you need to work within that, however, Pippa is absolutely correct in her advice that you need to have control of your dog, as situations escalate so quickly.

One of the first commands new puppy or dog owners should work on is "attention" and you can achieve this very quickly with the use of clicker training.  If you can get and hold your dogs attention, you have the basis of steadiness and can then direct them to what you want them to do.

If your dog is doing something you don't like, train him to do something else instead, then the old behaviour normally fades out after time.

One thing to remember, the type of steadiness and control that Pippa describes takes a lot of time, patience and consistancy and is not always what some owners want to do.  So do the best you can within your limits, but know that if your dog is mis-behaving, it is normally because he is allowed to!!

[PippaMattinson]

Oscar's 11 months old now and this makes the world of difference. I am trying to perfect a low pitched voice; which sounds disapproving, but is no where near a shout!  He seems to respond really well to that. I tried raising my voice but it got me no where! 

His age also makes a difference now - he's just so ready to please, training is coming on rapidly. I still have difficulty getting to him to come to me in a straight line with a dummy or ball, but without such a toy in his mouth, he is brilliant

Hi there

How lovely to hear you have made such good progress over the last few months.    Well done to you and Oscar.  Training takes effort and persistence and is likely to owe far more to your input than to his age.  There are plenty of cockers which are totally wild and out of control at 11 months  -  the idea of there being a 'kevin' stage  -  popular on pet dog sites,  is not usually heard of or referred to in working dog circles where training is a priority.   IMHO   Oscar's good behaviour is down to you.

Many thanks for the nice comments.


Pippa

[Cob-Web]

  -  the idea of there being a 'kevin' stage  -  popular on pet dog sites,  is not usually heard of or referred to in working dog circles where training is a priority.   

That is interesting to read, Pippa  As a pet owner, I definitely found Molo harder to train between the ages of about 8 and 14 months and found the whole experience terribly stressful 
What type of training regime would a working dog of this age be subject to ? 

[PippaMattinson]

I definitely found Molo harder to train between the ages of about 8 and 14 months and found the whole experience terribly stressful

I think that is a shame,  I don’t believe training, or any other aspect of raising a healthy dog, should ever be terribly stressful, for dog or owner.   

About eight months is the age at which many serious gundog trainers begin to bring on a young spaniel with some fairly intensive training.  Often in twice daily sessions.   There is no doubt that a young dog is growing in maturity and independence at this age,  but if this independence is counterbalanced with increasing partnership between dog and handler, and a development in the dog’s skills and general education, this should not cause any problems.

VWhat type of training regime would a working dog of this age be subject to ?

A working cocker of 8 to 14 months old should be fully occupied with, and thoroughly enjoying,  a  training programme of basic obedience, accompanied with (controlled) hunting practice and the addition of increasingly challenging retrieving skills. Depending on the time of year the puppy was born,  introduction to shot and game may be included towards the end of  this time period.    I find that of all my gundogs, cockers are often the keenest retrievers, the most attentive learners and the most focused on the handler.   They literally soak up training and love it. 

Actual training regimes vary from one trainer to the next. General observations can be made on the differences in ‘management’ between gundog trainers and many pet dog owners,  but most of these relate to the way in which exercise or ‘free time’ is conducted. 

I am very happy to expand on my own system if it interests you.
Or to answer any questions anyone may have on this subject. 

Hope that helps

Pippa