Author Topic: Dipping My Toes  (Read 10631 times)

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Offline Magic Star

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Dipping My Toes
« on: May 25, 2007, 01:36:14 PM »
I need some advice ;)

Indie is a show type cocker, shes an incredible busy dog!    I would like to start channeling her energies into something more positive, a friend of my hubbies came around today, he has a working cocker and a border terrier who both work.  He was saying that Indie would do well flushing woodcock and beating etc, sooo where do I start, is the BIG question!   Shes not the most well behaved dog, her recall is ok, unless theres something more interesting about ie, sheep!! :005:   

He suggested I get her a dummy and start with that, so what does that entail?  Is it just a case of throwing it and teaching her to bring back?  Where do I start, as i'm clueless :lol:  Also where do I get a dummy?

Thanks :D


Offline Nicola

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Re: Dipping My Toes
« Reply #1 on: May 25, 2007, 02:29:47 PM »
I'm sure you'd have loads of fun training Indie in this way Em  :D

If you want to try her with beating on a shoot she will need to be whistle trained for stopping and for recall. I have a 210 for Alfie and a 211 1/2 for Tilly. To go on a shoot they do need to be very well behaved and under control for safety reasons - there are people firing live ammo so you have to be 100% confident that she will do as you ask and stop and come back on command and absolutely not chase any game which is flushed as this would be a disaster. This is why I'm glad there are still a few months to go before the season as Alfie is not quite 100% yet!! Depending on the shoot you go on as well some are more relaxed than others and will be more lenient on young or inexperienced dogs and handlers but a dog that doesn't come back or that chases is dangerous, not to mention disruptive for the shooters. Has she been introduced to gunfire? This is also important, she should also learn to 'drop to the shot' so that when a gun fires she automatically sits or lies down.

For beating she should quarter the ground in front of you and hunt with her nose, not her eyes. I use two pips on the whistle and an arm signal to change their direction when they have gone far enough one way, although Alfie is now getting to the stage where he will do this naturally. If they do flush anything they must stop and lie down instantly until you invite them to start hunting again.

Dummies are used for retrieving work, I have 5 of them here, 2 canvas, one canvas floating, one fur and one feather, but I very seldom let the dogs use them, maybe only once or twice a week to keep them fresh. I know they can retrieve and so I try to keep it as much of an 'exciting treat' for them as possible so that when they do get to do it they're totally fixated on it. For starting retreiving training a tennis ball is just as good a thing to use. You must train Indie so that she will sit or lie still while the ball is thrown but that she marks where it lands so you can then send her on to find it. She must NOT run after the ball/dummy until you release her to go.

For my two the command I use is 'go on' and then 'seek it out'. I started teaching them this in the house by playing with a tennis ball with them then hiding it and encouraging them to find it. I would shut Alfie in the kitchen and hide the ball in the living room then open the door and release him then encourage him by saying 'seek it out' in a very high pitched voice and really going overboard on the praise when he found it. The best way to train them is to make it into a game, they should enjoy themselves at all times and you will really see that tail go!  :D  When the dog brings you back the ball/dummy/game they should hold it, sit in front of you and present it by tilting their head back, they should NOT let go of it until you have your hand on it and you ask them to leave it. Teaching a good hold and present can take quite a long time, I'm still doing it with Alfie!

You can get gundog equipement from country stores or any of the following...

www.gifts4gundogs.co.uk
www.scottcountry.co.uk
www.sporting-gundogs.com
www.canineconcepts.co.uk
www.countryloversstore.com

Some good books you might want to try are 'Gundog Training Made Easy' by Eric Begbie, and 'Training Spaniels' by Joe Irving. The first one in particular is a series of broadsheets and it is very short, concise and easy to follow.

Good luck and let me know if you decide to go for it!  ;)
Nicola, Tilly, Rodaidh and Caoimhe x



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Offline Magic Star

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Re: Dipping My Toes
« Reply #2 on: May 25, 2007, 02:42:37 PM »
 :shades:

Hi Nic

Thanks for the reply hun ;)  OK, I didn't know beating involved guns :lol:  (I know so little about these things ph34r)   I thought, it was flushing birds from the undergrowth :lol: ph34r  while the handlers beat the ground with sticks :rofl1: :wasntme:  There is no way in this earth, that Indie would be any use beating then thats for sure, as shes just not trained that well tbh ;)   So thats a definate no no!   But I could start training her I guess with a whistle to basic flushing, the problem is I do feel that Indie would be good at this, but with a better handler than me, I don't have any faith in my own training ability ::)  At 4 do you think shes too old to be re-trained? 

I'm going to meet up with OH's friend, as he said he would like to see what Indies like when shes out in the terrain, she does track things, but, while shes doing this she does become a bit ignorant t anything I am telling her :005:


Hmmm one to think about I think ;)


Cazzie

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Re: Dipping My Toes
« Reply #3 on: May 25, 2007, 02:43:13 PM »
Well written Nicola im impressed.  :shades:

Offline Jan/Billy

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Re: Dipping My Toes
« Reply #4 on: May 25, 2007, 02:47:20 PM »
  OK, I didn't know beating involved guns :lol:  (I know so little about these things ph34r)   I thought, it was flushing birds from the undergrowth :lol: ph34r  while the handlers beat the ground with sticks :rofl1:

 :rofl1: :rofl1: :rofl1: :rofl1:

Emma I really admire your honesty  :005:



FWIW Billy would be no use either. Although he does an absolute mean "wait" & is brilliant with his nose. We play seek games all the time



Offline Magic Star

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Re: Dipping My Toes
« Reply #5 on: May 25, 2007, 02:50:06 PM »
Emma I really admire your honesty  :005:


 :lol: :lol: ph34r ph34r ph34r

I feel embarrased but thats what I honestly thought it was, I had this idea in my head that the handlers, beat the ground with sticks, to entice the birds out :005: ph34r

Well I have learnt something today thats for sure, it could have been embarassing turning up Beating with a big stick :lol:


Offline Nicola

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Re: Dipping My Toes
« Reply #6 on: May 25, 2007, 02:53:15 PM »
Emma I really admire your honesty  :005:


 :lol: :lol: ph34r ph34r ph34r

I feel embarrased but thats what I honestly thought it was, I had this idea in my head that the handlers, beat the ground with sticks, to entice the birds out :005: ph34r

Well I have learnt something today thats for sure, it could have been embarassing turning up Beating with a big stick :lol:

No you're right hun, they do do this and sticks are useful but the birds are beat/flushed out towards a line of people standing there with big shotguns ready to shoot them  :lol: :lol:  which is why it's vital that the dogs do not chase and lie down at the first sign of activity/gunfire  ;)
Nicola, Tilly, Rodaidh and Caoimhe x



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Cazzie

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Re: Dipping My Toes
« Reply #7 on: May 25, 2007, 02:54:37 PM »
Dont feel embarassed, when you are beating you do have a stick but you flush the birds towards the guns. Also stop under estimating you're dogs they are all capable  ;)

Offline Jan/Billy

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Re: Dipping My Toes
« Reply #8 on: May 25, 2007, 02:54:44 PM »
Emma I really admire your honesty  :005:


 :lol: :lol: ph34r ph34r ph34r

I feel embarrased but thats what I honestly thought it was, I had this idea in my head that the handlers, beat the ground with sticks, to entice the birds out :005: ph34r

Well I have learnt something today thats for sure, it could have been embarassing turning up Beating with a big stick :lol:

No you're right hun, they do do this and sticks are useful but the birds are beat/flushed out towards a line of people standing there with big shotguns ready to shoot them  :lol: :lol:  which is why it's vital that the dogs do not chase and lie down at the first sign of activity/gunfire  ;)


 :lol: :lol:


emma I apologise  :lol: :lol: it's your turn to laugh at me  :005:



Offline Magic Star

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Re: Dipping My Toes
« Reply #9 on: May 25, 2007, 03:06:26 PM »


emma I apologise  :lol: :lol: it's your turn to laugh at me  :005:


 :rofl1: :rofl1: :rofl1:

No need Jan, I think its hilarious and has brightened up an otherwise stressful day ;) 

Cazzie, I know Indie would be capable, but I don't think I am, I just don't seem to be very good at training her ;) ph34r


Cazzie

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Re: Dipping My Toes
« Reply #10 on: May 25, 2007, 03:13:41 PM »


emma I apologise  :lol: :lol: it's your turn to laugh at me  :005:


 :rofl1: :rofl1: :rofl1:

No need Jan, I think its hilarious and has brightened up an otherwise stressful day ;) 

Cazzie, I know Indie would be capable, but I don't think I am, I just don't seem to be very good at training her ;) ph34r

Im always brightened up with peoples funnies on here  :005: And im sure if you put youre mind to it you would be able to train Indie. Will let you know how we all get on at our Pro Training meet with our bunch of cockers. Im sure there will be even more laughs for you.  :005: ;)


Offline Nicola

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Re: Dipping My Toes
« Reply #11 on: May 25, 2007, 03:18:17 PM »

Cazzie, I know Indie would be capable, but I don't think I am, I just don't seem to be very good at training her ;) ph34r

It's all fun though Em, even if Indie never makes it to an actual shoot. This kind of training can be so much fun and really rewarding and bonding for you and her... why not order a whistle and start practising some recall or start hiding toys around the house and garden and encouraging her to find them and present them to you? If she has the instincts, which she seems to, I'm sure she'd love it  :luv: :D
Nicola, Tilly, Rodaidh and Caoimhe x



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Offline Cob-Web

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Re: Dipping My Toes
« Reply #12 on: May 25, 2007, 06:07:03 PM »
It sounds as if it would be great fun to do some training with her......and see where it leads  ;)
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Offline lyn

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Re: Dipping My Toes
« Reply #13 on: May 25, 2007, 09:33:18 PM »
emma, i do think you're underestimating just what YOU can achieve with indie. i think you just might surprise yourself ;) go on. give it a go.

Offline Jan/Billy

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Re: Dipping My Toes
« Reply #14 on: May 25, 2007, 09:35:59 PM »
emma, i do think you're underestimating just what YOU can achieve with indie. i think you just might surprise yourself ;) go on. give it a go.


Yeah I think you should give it a go

Nothing ventured nothing gained , plus you'll get loads of help from COL if you need it