Raw and Dried together?????

[bluegirl]

I think if your has an iron cast stomach and you haven't seen any disagreeable side effects so far then I'd be inclined to do the same as Vera. I agree dogs are scavengers and given freedom of choice they'd wolf anything down without giving it a second thought and probably for most of those dogs there would be no consequence at all.

I did once follow the hay system diet which has similar theories that our own food is digested at different rates and certains foods should not be eaten in the same meal as others ie don't mix carbs with proteins. I must admit it was hard to follow the diet because it went against most of what we do today and the diet wasn't designed to loose weight just really to help you to be more healthy or help regain health. I did feel some difference but  not enough to stay on the hay system so I agree that foods digest at different rates and that some foods don't work well with others but I don't believe it is damaging to us (or dogs) just slightly less beneficial perhaps.

[Marina and Saartje]

If you feed a complete fresh frozen food the bones inside are so small they will digest, if you  feed kibble and raw together, but if you feed raw bones like goatribs or chicken it's better to separate. But why do you feed the kibble if you know she doesn't like it? Leave the kibble and feed fresh only, that's my opinion.

I feed raw minced tripe and chicken and Autarky complete, they also have chicken wings usually as a treat. Is there "enough" in the raw food alone?

In the Netherlands there are is plenty of choice of complete frozen fresh food. It's a mix of raw bones, organs musslemeat and sometimes vegetable mix, you don't have to add anything, all they need is inside and mixing with kibble isn't nessecary at all..  Maybe one of the members from the Uk can advice you on wich brand is complete.

[LynneB]

If you feed a complete fresh frozen food the bones inside are so small they will digest, if you  feed kibble and raw together, but if you feed raw bones like goatribs or chicken it's better to separate. But why do you feed the kibble if you know she doesn't like it? Leave the kibble and feed fresh only, that's my opinion.

I feed raw minced tripe and chicken and Autarky complete, they also have chicken wings usually as a treat. Is there "enough" in the raw food alone?

In the Netherlands there are is plenty of choice of complete frozen fresh food. It's a mix of raw bones, organs musslemeat and sometimes vegetable mix, you don't have to add anything, all they need is inside and mixing with kibble isn't nessecary at all..  Maybe one of the members from the Uk can advice you on wich brand is complete.

I do not know of any complete fresh frozen food, any ideas anyone?

[Jane S]

I do not know of any complete fresh frozen food, any ideas anyone?

These two links might help:

http://naturesmenu.co.uk/

http://www.naturalinstinct.com/

[praia]

When I have to feed kibble I never mix with raw in the same meal.  I  don't do it, because that's the advice I've always gotten from fellow raw feeders.  The understanding is that the reason why dogs can eat raw food and not get sick is because their digestive systems process the raw food too quickly for the bacteria to have time to cultivate in their systems, which is why I've never worried about salmonella with my own dogs.  However, once you mix kibble in there the time to digest the food is slowed down allowing more of the bacteria to establish themselves inside the dog's system. 

Has this theory been proven in clinical studies?  Probably not, but it seems a valid enough reason for me and I'm not one to take any kind of chance with my own dogs.  Do whatever you feel is right for your own dog.

[Monstersspaniel]

Carrots work a treat as a replacement for the complete (I presume its biscuit form??)

Give them some/1/2 raw carrot once a day it will help clean their teath and aid in getting rid of bad breath ^^

Id think it would work out expensive feeding raw and dried??

[LynneB]

I do not know of any complete fresh frozen food, any ideas anyone?

These two links might help:

http://naturesmenu.co.uk/

http://www.naturalinstinct.com/

Thanks for that. It's works out VERY expensive (about £15 per day )and as I have 7 dogs, cost would be an issue

[LynneB]

Carrots work a treat as a replacement for the complete (I presume its biscuit form??)

Give them some/1/2 raw carrot once a day it will help clean their teath and aid in getting rid of bad breath ^^

Id think it would work out expensive feeding raw and dried??

WOW...thank you, they LOVE carrots

[Monstersspaniel]

Carrots work a treat as a replacement for the complete (I presume its biscuit form??)

Give them some/1/2 raw carrot once a day it will help clean their teath and aid in getting rid of bad breath ^^

Id think it would work out expensive feeding raw and dried??

WOW...thank you, they LOVE carrots

Also makes a nice healthy boredom buster for a puppy going through teathing.

[lindseyp]

I do not know of any complete fresh frozen food, any ideas anyone?

These two links might help:

http://naturesmenu.co.uk/

http://www.naturalinstinct.com/

Thanks for that. It's works out VERY expensive (about £15 per day )and as I have 7 dogs, cost would be an issue

I feed BARF to my 3 & their weekly food bill works out a roughly £5 - £7.50 per dog (depending what's on the menu  )  Not sure where you are Lynn but I'm in Dorset. I & a few other COLers use this company - http://nurturingbynature.co.uk/   Their meal tonight costs £1.15 + I pay about £2.50 for a bag of chicken carcasses that will last 2 weeks for all 3 of them - BARF doesn't have to be that expensive.   

Carrots work a treat as a replacement for the complete (I presume its biscuit form??)

Give them some/1/2 raw carrot once a day it will help clean their teath and aid in getting rid of bad breath ^^

Id think it would work out expensive feeding raw and dried??

 

Not sure I understand this right Monstersspaniel - surely carrots can't 'replace' complete in any way? They are fine to be given as a treat (which I myself do too) but they have no nutritional benefit to the dog in this form - they will come out the other end as they went in - dogs can't breakdown & digest the cellulose. I feed BARF & a variety of veg makes up part of that but the veg is blixed (virtually pureed) so the dogs can break it down better. ( *I give my three carrots all the time as treats & knowing they have no nutritional value, it does't make up part of their daily meal diet)
Sorry if I've misunderstood what you were trying to say but it didn't sound right, as I interpreted it 

[Mel]

I feed raw from NI. I feed raw because I don't, from what I've read, feel Tali needs the carbs from wheats, grains, rice, etc, which all kibble contain. However that is personal opinion. I think dogs can eat just about anything in truth, however if you are feeding a complete raw meal, either prepackaged frozen, or made up yourself, there seems little point in the expense of adding a complete kibble. I guess, though have no proof, that some complete kibble added to some raw meat will do little more than give a higher protein content to their meal.

As Janes says, 'if it aint broke, don't fix it'.

[LynneB]

I do not know of any complete fresh frozen food, any ideas anyone?

These two links might help:

http://naturesmenu.co.uk/

http://www.naturalinstinct.com/

Thanks for that. It's works out VERY expensive (about £15 per day )and as I have 7 dogs, cost would be an issue

I feed BARF to my 3 & their weekly food bill works out a roughly £5 - £7.50 per dog (depending what's on the menu  )  Not sure where you are Lynn but I'm in Dorset. I & a few other COLers use this company - http://nurturingbynature.co.uk/   Their meal tonight costs £1.15 + I pay about £2.50 for a bag of chicken carcasses that will last 2 weeks for all 3 of them - BARF doesn't have to be that expensive.   

Carrots work a treat as a replacement for the complete (I presume its biscuit form??)

Give them some/1/2 raw carrot once a day it will help clean their teath and aid in getting rid of bad breath ^^

Id think it would work out expensive feeding raw and dried??

 

Not sure I understand this right Monstersspaniel - surely carrots can't 'replace' complete in any way? They are fine to be given as a treat (which I myself do too) but they have no nutritional benefit to the dog in this form - they will come out the other end as they went in - dogs can't breakdown & digest the cellulose. I feed BARF & a variety of veg makes up part of that but the veg is blixed (virtually pureed) so the dogs can break it down better. ( *I give my three carrots all the time as treats & knowing they have no nutritional value, it does't make up part of their daily meal diet)
Sorry if I've misunderstood what you were trying to say but it didn't sound right, as I interpreted it 

Thanks Lynsayp but I am in NE Scotland, the website looks good and reasonable prices but I am too far away . I would be interested to hear more comments on the carrot issue

[LurcherGirl]

I feed raw from NI. I feed raw because I don't, from what I've read, feel Tali needs the carbs from wheats, grains, rice, etc, which all kibble contain. However that is personal opinion. I think dogs can eat just about anything in truth, however if you are feeding a complete raw meal, either prepackaged frozen, or made up yourself, there seems little point in the expense of adding a complete kibble. I guess, though have no proof, that some complete kibble added to some raw meat will do little more than give a higher protein content to their meal.

As Janes says, 'if it aint broke, don't fix it'.

There are dry completes that are grain free, e.g. Orijen, Acana and the one I feed Taste of the Wild.

I don't think adding complete to raw will increase the protein content as most completed are actually lower in protein (though the above grain free ones are often around the same as raw meat). I give raw and kibble because I feel it is the best of both worlds and perhaps less of a chance of missing any nutrients. But everyone has to do what they are comfortable with.

[elaine.e]

I guess, though have no proof, that some complete kibble added to some raw meat will do little more than give a higher protein content to their meal.

There are dry completes that are grain free, e.g. Orijen, Acana and the one I feed Taste of the Wild.

I don't think adding complete to raw will increase the protein content as most completed are actually lower in protein (though the above grain free ones are often around the same as raw meat). I give raw and kibble because I feel it is the best of both worlds and perhaps less of a chance of missing any nutrients. But everyone has to do what they are comfortable with.

My understanding is that complete kibble is generally higher in protein than raw food. For example
James Wellbeloved adult kibbles contain 20 to 21% protein
Arden Grange adult kibbles contain 25% protein
Natural Instinct chicken & lamb (80%meat, 20% fruit, veg & herbs) contains 15.5% protein
Natural Instinct pure beef 18% protein

but to really make a comparison you need to look at the protein levels in the dry content of the food. This link http://www.landofholisticpets.co.uk/Compare%20protein%20in%20Wet,%20dry%20and%20raw%20dog%20foods.pdf is worth a read (it's only 1 page) because it explains how to accurately calculate protein levels and gives examples of a typical tinned dog food (much higher protein than you would at first think), a typical kibble and raw chicken.

Sorry to the OP that this has gone off topic, but it's fascinating and just goes to show how misleading labels can be and what a complete minefield feeding your dog is.

[LynneB]

OMG I am now totally confused This thread has been absolutely fascinating but still not sure if I'm doing the right thing