Author Topic: 2 Best Friends Fallen Out  (Read 2426 times)

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Offline LouiseAS

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2 Best Friends Fallen Out
« on: April 07, 2008, 10:20:10 AM »
I wonder if anyone has any suggestions please  :huh:

As you know Jakey has a little friend in Lenny and it was love at first sight for them.  They would spend hours washing each other snuggling up and playing.  Since we've had Lenny castrated just over a week ago our house has been like a war zone.

Jakey doesn't seem to be able to tolerate Lenny too near him unless we supervise i.e. cuddles on the settee, they do play together and it starts off ok but Jakey gets really rough and aggressive so I have to distract and end play time.  They won't even share a bed any more unless Jakey is on there first because if he is not Lenny will defend the bed and not let either Jakey or Meg anywhere near it.

I know there are books on managing multi dog households to buy but it seems weird that we've been absolutely fine up until Lenny's castration  :'(

It is so sad to watch because the dogs are getting stressed and we're stressed which doesn't help them.

Louise & my beautiful girl Meg xx

Offline clairep4

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Re: 2 Best Friends Fallen Out
« Reply #1 on: April 07, 2008, 10:53:29 AM »
Sorry to hear this, Louise. Would it be worth getting Lenny checked over by the vet in case he's sore? Just seems strange that it's coincided with him having had his op, so maybe it's just that he's not feeling right so is being tetchy?

Claire, Bella & Zorro - the two muppeteers!
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Offline LouiseAS

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Re: 2 Best Friends Fallen Out
« Reply #2 on: April 07, 2008, 11:17:35 AM »
I thought of that Claire, but he had a check up on Thursday and is doing ok.  He didn't even flinch when the vet examined him.
Louise & my beautiful girl Meg xx

Offline Hurtwood Dogs

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Re: 2 Best Friends Fallen Out
« Reply #3 on: April 07, 2008, 11:24:37 AM »
Oh Louise, I'm so sorry.. I don't know if this is any help but I still 'manage' Dave and Storm's time together - they have a gate between them  so that she gets a break from him being a puppy although as he's getting older their time apart is getting less and less. It might just be a case of giving them all a bit of time to get used to the new levels of hormones etc.. sorry I can't be more help but really hope it starts to settle soon - you sooooooo deserve it to!

Lots of luck
Hannah xxx

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Offline clairep4

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Re: 2 Best Friends Fallen Out
« Reply #4 on: April 07, 2008, 11:32:17 AM »
We have the occasional similar thing with our two - usually started by Zorro but he can get very possessive about beds and will just charge at Bella for walking past sometimes. He's the same over chews so we generally just don't give them to him - he's okay if Bella is eating at the same time but otherwise, forget it. Bella has started to reciprocate - she wouldn't let him in the living room over the weekend because she had a hide chew (he had one in the dining room but wasn't allowed to come anywhere near her).

Sometimes I think they just go through phases of testing out the boundaries with each other so perhaps it is that with Lenny and Jakey?

I hope it starts to settle down soon, it must be a worry...
Claire, Bella & Zorro - the two muppeteers!
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Offline Claire83

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Re: 2 Best Friends Fallen Out
« Reply #5 on: April 07, 2008, 11:32:35 AM »
Hi Louise,

I'm sorry to hear they aren't getting along right now. I'm afraid i'm a bit useless in that i don't have any helpfull information or advise.

Hopefully you'll be able to get some useful advise from other COLers.

You've been an angel taking on Jake and Lenny they are both, individually lovely dogs (not forgetting Meg too!)

looking forward to seeing you and the gang on Sunday. xx
The cocker spaniel.........It will leave paw prints on your heart which will remain with you, Forever!
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Offline LouiseAS

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Re: 2 Best Friends Fallen Out
« Reply #6 on: April 07, 2008, 11:46:37 AM »
Thanks everyone.

It might just be a case of giving them all a bit of time to get used to the new levels of hormones etc..

Sometimes I think they just go through phases of testing out the boundaries with each other so perhaps it is that with Lenny and Jakey?

Hannah and Claire, I'm really hoping it is one of your suggestions.  Only time will tell, I guess.
Louise & my beautiful girl Meg xx

Offline clairep4

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Re: 2 Best Friends Fallen Out
« Reply #7 on: April 07, 2008, 12:59:16 PM »
TBH we're having slightly similar things with Zorro at the moment, he goes through phases of being really narky with Bella (and he doesn't tend to do that many calming signals, just goes straight to lunging mode). Flashpoints are the packing of the dishwasher (we now have to keep them both out of the kitchen when it's being done because he really had a go at Bella the other day over it), the sofa (they're both now banned), his cushion in the living room (he varies which one he thinks is of higher value  ::)) and the aforementioned hide chews. He's also been stealing Bella's bed and then telling her off for going near it.

I guess the difference is that he's only 20 months so I know that he's still throwing his weight around, and we're trying to leave them to sort it out themselves, as I think in an ideal world Bella probably wouldn't be leader (if you see her in a group of dogs she's far happier to just not have the responsibility) so it's whether Zorro is up to the job or not. Trouble is he has the brawns but not the brains so I think that's where the dilemma is for them...

Louise I think if you can work out the flashpoints for them and just try and minimise them, then that's all you can do really - they obviously have something going on that they feel needs to be sorted out. If only they could talk to us, eh?
Claire, Bella & Zorro - the two muppeteers!
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Offline LouiseAS

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Re: 2 Best Friends Fallen Out
« Reply #8 on: April 07, 2008, 01:15:14 PM »
I wish they could talk too  ::)

Lenny is only just over a year (we think) so he could also be throwing his weight about  >:D

It has also been suggested by our trainer (Lurchergirl) that because Jakey didn't have a great start in life he is finding the change in Lenny's smell and behaviour hard to handle.  She has suggested managing them closely and not letting Jakey get too rough with Lenny which may then esculate into a barny.  She has also suggested walking them more together and training them together.

I shall sit on the settee tonight with my clicker and practise "team building".

Louise & my beautiful girl Meg xx

Offline clairep4

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Re: 2 Best Friends Fallen Out
« Reply #9 on: April 07, 2008, 01:23:31 PM »
I wish they could talk too  ::)

Lenny is only just over a year (we think) so he could also be throwing his weight about  >:D

It has also been suggested by our trainer (Lurchergirl) that because Jakey didn't have a great start in life he is finding the change in Lenny's smell and behaviour hard to handle.  She has suggested managing them closely and not letting Jakey get too rough with Lenny which may then esculate into a barny.  She has also suggested walking them more together and training them together.

I shall sit on the settee tonight with my clicker and practise "team building".



It could well be Lenny throwing his weight around then - we've found with Zorro he'll do it for a couple of days and then go back to normal, then try again for a few days, so it's kinda up and down with him - and inbetween the spats he gets on great with Bella and they still play and have their little love-ins, but they both get very upset at the spats (esp Bella as it's always Zorro who starts it).

Maybe Lenny & Jakey are wrangling for second position in the pack (I'm assuming Queen Meg is topdog?).

It's really difficult, isn't it, when you don't really know what is happening between them. Hopefully doing the bits of training/walking with them together will take their minds off it a bit.
Claire, Bella & Zorro - the two muppeteers!
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Offline LouiseAS

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Re: 2 Best Friends Fallen Out
« Reply #10 on: April 07, 2008, 01:35:04 PM »
Maybe Lenny & Jakey are wrangling for second position in the pack (I'm assuming Queen Meg is topdog?).

It's really difficult, isn't it, when you don't really know what is happening between them. Hopefully doing the bits of training/walking with them together will take their minds off it a bit.


That's an interesting one.  I used to think it was Lenny in charge but all this latest business makes me think that Queen Meg is quietly still in charge although Lenny likes to think he is.  She will take so much from him and then have a go.  He tends to leave her alone though as he knows the boundaries with her.

Louise & my beautiful girl Meg xx

Offline Nicola

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Re: 2 Best Friends Fallen Out
« Reply #11 on: April 07, 2008, 01:40:33 PM »
I was having something similar with Rodaidh and Alfie, at least prior to Rodaidh being stuck in his crate. He is now nearly 16 months and as he gets older he has been challenging Alfie more and more. Alfie used to just flatten him to the floor if he stepped out of line but recently just prior to Rodaidh's surgery I noticed that if their playing turned a bit 'handbags at dawn' it would often end with Rodaidh standing over Alfie baring his teeth, although Alfie can't generally be bothered with fighting whereas Rodaidh has a stronger character in that sense. Rodaidh will also growl and posture at Alfie he he comes near him when he's got a chew or toy but he doesn't do any of this stuff with Tilly and Alfie and Tills never do it with each other or with Rodaidh. I think in my situation it helps that Alfie is so laid back, when Rodaidh starts carrying on he invariably just sits there and doesn't react. I do think it's to do with Rodaidh's age and with him being a more 'dominant' character than Alfie now that he's more physically equal to him he's starting to push the boundaries. Rodaidh is also entire and Alfie is castrated and I wouldn't have said prior to this that either Alfie or Tilly was definitely the 'boss' out of the three of them, neither of them are particuarly bothered by stuff like that and they have never had a go at each other over anything. It's only Rodaidh who seems to be bothered about it although he will not growl at or mither Tilly the way he does with Alfie. As long as none of them are stressed out by it, which so far they don't seem to be, and they get on most of the time, which they do, then I pretty much leave them to sort it out amongst themselves.
Nicola, Tilly, Rodaidh and Caoimhe x



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Offline bibathediva

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Re: 2 Best Friends Fallen Out
« Reply #12 on: April 07, 2008, 04:34:45 PM »

No advise im afraid Louise ..but it would be a lot easier if they could tell us why they are peed off with another dog  ::) i think the dynamics are changing in out house as well ....lola is getting bolder with Biba and is quite prepared to fight her corner now ..not literally yet as i have also noticed Biba gives in quicker as in ..she use to defend whatever she had but if Lola wants it she gives it up...Lola has also started to defend whatever space she is in..bed sometimes even the kitchen and Biba is reluctant to push it or cant be bothered to fight for it..she is also not a fighter like Alfie and would sooner walk away from trouble  ::) she just looks at Lola as though to say "whatever" ....
I really hope yours all settle soon  ;)