Author Topic: Looking for Helleborus line dogs  (Read 5312 times)

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Offline Candylove

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Looking for Helleborus line dogs
« on: February 04, 2015, 11:02:52 PM »
Hello everyone,
I have just joined to continue my search for distant relatives of my beautiful cocker Candy (Candice of Sweet Destiny), who passed away recently. She was from the HELLEBORUS line ( her dad was Helleborus Texas Ranger) and I am now trying to find other Helleborus cockers, in the hope of finding a new cocker girl. She also had quite a few BURNCHILD in her pedigree, but sadly I cannot find much about this breeder either. It seems that all her breeders, both on dad's and mum's side, are no longer active. I hope anyone on this forum may be able to help?!
Thanks for any information.

Offline Jane S

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Re: Looking for Helleborus line dogs
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2015, 09:50:47 PM »
Welcome to COL! So sorry to hear of the recent sad loss of your lovely Candy :luv: I'm afraid it's unlikely you will find too many other owners with Cockers bred by Michael Smith (Helleborus) - he hasn't been an active breeder for quite some years now. Sadly lines often fade away as breeders get older and stop breeding, especially if they were not prolific breeders in the first place. Good luck though :blink:
Jane

Offline Patp

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Re: Looking for Helleborus line dogs
« Reply #2 on: February 06, 2015, 12:13:48 PM »
Sorry to hear about your loss  :bigarmhug: :bigarmhug:

Have you thought about posting some of Candys ancestry on here?  Sometimes breeders change the Affix to their own kennels, but the gene pool might be similar in previous generations?



Offline Candylove

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Re: Looking for Helleborus line dogs
« Reply #3 on: February 07, 2015, 11:53:09 PM »
Thanks very much for your responses and suggestions, Jane and Pat.
In the meantime, I have also heard from other breeders that Michael Smith (Helleborus) sadly passed away last year. The Helleborus cockers were a really fantastic line, not only wonderful looking, but exemplary temperament, very sweet, smart and sensitive.

Here are some of the ancestors that I am looking for: Sweatmans Sunny Sunshine (mother), Burnchild Simply the Best and Kentee Sweet Surprise ( G parents) and Sandvika Out of the Blue, Burnchild Gemma's Tristar and Pippins Princess ( G G parents), Craighleigh The Great Waltze, Hightress Sweet Talk of Lochranza, Danesmead Razzle Dazzle of Burnchild, Merrytree Chewbacca and Colemans Black Gem ( GGG parents). Hopefully I can make some connections here  :luv:

Offline elaine.e

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Re: Looking for Helleborus line dogs
« Reply #4 on: February 08, 2015, 07:56:40 AM »
Here's a link to the pedigree of Helleborus Texas Ranger from an online database http://www.cockerspanieldatabase.info/pedigree.php?id=39709

I'm sure there will be quite a few distant relatives around because some of the Cockers in the pedigree, such as Hightrees Sweet Talk Of Lochranza, Styvechale Storm Cloud and Craigleith The Great Waltz, appear several few generations back in the pedigrees of quite a few parti coloured Cockers.

Offline Jane S

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Re: Looking for Helleborus line dogs
« Reply #5 on: February 08, 2015, 08:58:53 AM »
I thought Michael Smith had died but didn't want to say in case I was wrong ph34r As Elaine says, some of the ancestors you mention are behind many particolour lines today (Hightrees Sweet Talk, Craigleith the Great Waltz, Stormcloud etc) -certainly I have those dogs back in my own dogs' pedigree but their influence would be very faint now so I'm not sure those names will help when looking for another breeder (it would be quite hard to find a show breeder who doesn't have those dogs somewhere). I totally understand why you want to find a breeder who is using the same lines as your girl came from but since personalities vary so much (even in the same litter in my experience), even if you did find someone breeding from the Helleborus lines, you may not get a pup with the same temperament/looks as your Candy. I'd probably suggest you attend a local breed club show not too far from you (if there is one) and get to know some current breeders and meet their dogs - you may find just what you are looking for even if the breeding lines are different :blink:
Jane

Offline Candylove

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Re: Looking for Helleborus line dogs
« Reply #6 on: February 09, 2015, 10:52:46 PM »
Thanks for your posts, Jane and Elaine. I think you have a point about looking at other lines, and I will certainly follow this up in the next few months. I would like to get to know some breeders and their dogs better, before making the big step of adopting another cocker into our family. Candy still seem irreplacable at the moment, but we may be ready for a new dog in a few months' time.

Offline dinkyt

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Re: Looking for Helleborus line dogs
« Reply #7 on: June 19, 2015, 09:10:12 AM »
Hi Candylove, I've just joined this forum in the search for finding the Helleborus line.  My dog Paddy was a Helleborus.  We spoke to Michael Smith before he sadly passed away and he said that he had sold some of the line to a female breeder.  Sadly, we have completely lost her details and I just wondered whether you'd had any joy in tracking the breeder down?

Offline sueonmull

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Re: Looking for Helleborus line dogs
« Reply #8 on: December 21, 2015, 10:30:04 AM »
Just come across this post and was so sorry to hear than Michael Smith had died. We had our Helleborus cocker from Michael in 1980 - but only after Jingle (Helleborus Tigani Blue) had checked us out as being suitable to have one of his puppies. Just like Candylove ours had the most wonderful temperament and we were lucky to have him for over 15 years. When we lost him it took many years before we were ready to get another dog. They are all different and irreplaceable but be assured the right one will come along. Eventually for us we had a Springer but had to be a black and white just like our old boy. God Bless Michael and all his ‘doggies’, brought back some very happy memories just reading Texas Ranger’s pedigree – lucky to have met many of the dogs listed.

Offline Beautifulmist

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Re: Looking for Helleborus line dogs
« Reply #9 on: October 31, 2017, 10:03:21 AM »
HI, just in case anybody was wondering about the helleborus line, you could try Carol Harris in Wisbech St Mary. She is a breeder and knew Michael well. Maybe she can help.

Just to add we had a fabulous dog from him in 2002, sadly passed now. I always remember visiting him, what a character he was and lived for his dogs. As first time owners we were staggered when on a camping trip to Yorkshire we were in a market town with Poppy. We stopped at a fruit and veg stall as she loved carrots ( also raw runner beans were here absolute favourite, didn't realise that apparently they can be toxic...)

The lady on the stall came round and made a fuss of Poppy, she looked at her and said "is she one of Michael Smiths dogs??" we were amazed she knew who had bred Poppy. The lady knew michael as she was a judge on the circuit i think and in truth Michael was a truly eccentric character. I still think of him when i drive past his home.