Author Topic: To cocker or not cocker, that is the question!  (Read 958 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline ips

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 880
  • Gender: Male
Re: To cocker or not cocker, that is the question!
« Reply #45 on: August 11, 2017, 11:02:17 PM »
That is good advice. It's harder to unlearn a behaviours than it is to train it .
Muddling along in the hope that one day it all makes sense.

Offline Arrielle

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 27
  • Gender: Female
Re: To cocker or not cocker, that is the question!
« Reply #46 on: August 11, 2017, 11:14:41 PM »
I have never found the need to crate train, I hate the things and feel so many dogs are abused with them.

I think crates are good for dog's safety. When I am not at home (few hours a week) I need to know that my dog does not chew on something that eventually can harm him. Pieces of hard plastic may end up piercing his stomach. I prefer a few hours of crating that thousands of dollars in dog surgery.

Offline moneypenny

  • Donator
  • Full Member
  • *
  • Posts: 159
  • Gender: Female
Re: To cocker or not cocker, that is the question!
« Reply #47 on: August 12, 2017, 12:15:29 AM »
I agree that it's vital to establish bedtime rules early. It's very cute having a puppy sleep on your bed or a child's bed when she is a puppy, but if you don't want to be at the beck and call of a grown dog all night it is easier to establish a bedtime location and stick to it.
We have never used a crate, but from the time Penny came home we put her in a dog bed in the laundry with the door closed at night. We only had a few nights of complaining and then she settled down. We now have a bedtime routine involving every member of the household kissin g and patting her goodnight at about 930 pm and then she happily goes to bed in the laundry and doesn't reappear till about 7 am the next morning.
Very civilised!

Offline Arrielle

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 27
  • Gender: Female
Re: To cocker or not cocker, that is the question!
« Reply #48 on: August 12, 2017, 02:32:04 AM »
I agree that it's vital to establish bedtime rules early. It's very cute having a puppy sleep on your bed or a child's bed when she is a puppy, but if you don't want to be at the beck and call of a grown dog all night it is easier to establish a bedtime location and stick to it.
We have never used a crate, but from the time Penny came home we put her in a dog bed in the laundry with the door closed at night. We only had a few nights of complaining and then she settled down. We now have a bedtime routine involving every member of the household kissin g and patting her goodnight at about 930 pm and then she happily goes to bed in the laundry and doesn't reappear till about 7 am the next morning.
Very civilised!

THANK YOU for sharing your routine. It makes me feel much better. So many people tell me that they let the dogs in bed with them and I was feeling so guilty for moving the Doxie on the ground and also for planning to keep the ECS on the ground. But for me is lesson learned: never let any of my dogs in bed with us.

Offline TheAdventuresofBarnaby

  • Jr. Member
  • **
  • Posts: 96
Re: To cocker or not cocker, that is the question!
« Reply #49 on: August 12, 2017, 07:54:38 AM »
You mentioned eating pebbles from the beach.   Barnaby has not done this,  but we did go through a stage of him eating stones from the garden.

Our vet reckons it is instinctual for puppies craving calcium to assist their bone growth.  They can also develop a taste for walls and mortar at this stage.

I'm not sure the vet is right as Barnaby's stone eating phase was mostly restricted to granite,  although he did do an amazingly thorough job of removing all the mortar from the front step and patio walls. End result is that no vet visits were called for, and it doesn't seem to have done him any harm.

From reading this forum,  with regards to eating stones, it seems that some puppies do and some don't. 

Offline hoover

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 209
Re: To cocker or not cocker, that is the question!
« Reply #50 on: August 12, 2017, 09:42:52 AM »


For us we feel the key to our little boy's lovely temperament was in his choosing at the breeders.  In stead of going for the most energetic pup,  the one that pushed himself upon us,  we instead were drawn to his quieter sibling who stayed in the background and appraised us before coming forward.  That think-first, and then act behaviour is still very much part of his make-up.  It doesn't make him the sharpest of gun-dogs,  but he's a delight as a member of the family.


I would agree with this when looking for a family dog - watch the pups as a group and don't go for the one throwing their weight around with the other pups - go for the quieter, gentle one.  This is what my aunt was advised by the breeder of cockers they went to and it worked very well for their family of young children.  We, unfortunately  :005: picked the most rambunctious pup and he was a very challenging pup and I believe will continue to have issues that we will need to manage.

Also try to spend time with both parents to assess their temperaments as far as possible, and try to ensure they don't have nervous, skittish behaviour.  Guarding behaviour is something that can crop up in cockers and some believe (myself included) can have a genetic component so maybe just check with the breeder that the parents aren't known to have any issues with guarding or body handling.

Offline lilgingemama

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 22
Re: To cocker or not cocker, that is the question!
« Reply #51 on: August 12, 2017, 11:48:07 AM »
Thanks everyone.

We were thinking as tempting as it is - to keep to a dog sleeping to downstairs. It's helpful to hear about setting routines like this from early on. Well done for doing the tough work of setting a new routine.

Stone eating - ah! Good to know! So we'll have to watch and see. Slightly concerned for my tiny (but beloved) garden (!!!)

Pup choosing - this is REALLY helpful to know. We do want as calm and friendly a dog as possible. Will defo try to implement this when we choose and suss out the pups parents.

Is this a tricky factor when you are looking for certain specs? E.g. wanting a female golden cocker?! Do you commit to a breeder before you choose a pup? Or visit litters hoping to pick? Or if a breeder likes you - can you ask them to reserve a chilled out golden? Sorry! That's a lot of questions!


Offline Arrielle

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 27
  • Gender: Female
Re: To cocker or not cocker, that is the question!
« Reply #52 on: August 12, 2017, 01:34:16 PM »


Is this a tricky factor when you are looking for certain specs? E.g. wanting a female golden cocker?! Do you commit to a breeder before you choose a pup? Or visit litters hoping to pick? Or if a breeder likes you - can you ask them to reserve a chilled out golden? Sorry! That's a lot of questions!

In my experience, it is very difficult to find a breeder and a pup. They usually have one 2 litters / year and their waiting list is long. At least in the USA. I doubt that you will have the opportunity to go to 3-4 breeders when you plan to bring the pup home, and choose just the right one.
Yes, you can tell the breeder what you want, and to keep the pup for you, but you have to place a deposit and this is 2-3 days after they were born.
In our case, my breeder will give us the pup she thinks is right for us. I just told her who we are, and what we are looking for. Given that she sees the pups for 10-12 weeks she knows better their temperament. Although the look is important, don't make it your firs criteria of selection. If I were you, I would find 2-3 breeders, tell them precisely how is your family and how do you want the dog to be.
Good luck.
I looked for a pup for a long time.

Offline bizzylizzy

  • Donator
  • Hero Member
  • *
  • Posts: 2862
  • Gender: Female
  • 🙂 Jayne
Re: To cocker or not cocker, that is the question!
« Reply #53 on: August 12, 2017, 04:18:37 PM »
Thanks everyone.

We were thinking as tempting as it is - to keep to a dog sleeping to downstairs. It's helpful to hear about setting routines like this from early on. Well done for doing the tough work of setting a new routine.

Stone eating - ah! Good to know! So we'll have to watch and see. Slightly concerned for my tiny (but beloved) garden (!!!)

Pup choosing - this is REALLY helpful to know. We do want as calm and friendly a dog as possible. Will defo try to implement this when we choose and suss out the pups parents.

Is this a tricky factor when you are looking for certain specs? E.g. wanting a female golden cocker?! Do you commit to a breeder before you choose a pup? Or visit litters hoping to pick? Or if a breeder likes you - can you ask them to reserve a chilled out golden? Sorry! That's a lot of questions!

I don't know that there are any hard and fast rules, I wouldn't commit to anything until you've seen the puppy and are 100% sure he/she is the one you want.  When I was looking for Humphrey. I told the breeder before the litter was  born what I was looking for and she put me on a list as she's had other enquiries also. The first viewing was after a couple of weeks, after their eyes were open and we chose Humphrey, -( all the others were eating dinner and Humph had to be woken up to make aure he didn't miss his!!  :005: - he's always been pretty laid back!  ;) ) Once decided, we paid the deposit.
Every situation is different but I would say take your time, phone round a few breeders and ask what their procedures/arrangements are, just don't allow yourself to be pressured and if you've any reservations at all, walk away. Any breeder worth his/her salt will be as anxious as you are to make sure the right owner matches the right puppy and should also be asking questions of you too. Another good idea is to meet the beeeder, have a good chat and get a first impression before actually seeing the pups, - once faced with the litter, all sense goes out od the window!!!  ;)

Offline lilgingemama

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 22
Re: To cocker or not cocker, that is the question!
« Reply #54 on: August 12, 2017, 08:35:25 PM »
Great thoughts and help both of you. Thank you.

I wonder if there are more breeders here Arrielle, DH has a list for the South East of the UK that is huge! It sounds like finding a GOOD breeder is the issue for us brits!

Love that Humphrey was sleeping through dinner. Haha. Brilliant!

Offline Jane S

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13193
  • Gender: Female
Re: To cocker or not cocker, that is the question!
« Reply #55 on: August 13, 2017, 08:54:07 AM »
I wonder if there are more breeders here Arrielle, DH has a list for the South East of the UK that is huge! It sounds like finding a GOOD breeder is the issue for us brits!

Yes that is the issue - there are huge numbers of people breeding dogs in the UK but only a small percentage will be "good" in the sense of doing all the recommended health tests, breeding for the right reasons, knowledge of the breed etc. I haven't read all this thread sorry but if you are looking for a gold bitch from a good breeder, you will inevitably have to be extremely patient as such a puppy will not be easy to find (you will probably find it much easier if you don't limit yourself to a particular colour). Also I see you have mentioned sussing out both parents, you should always see the mother of course but many good breeders will not own the stud dog necessarily - they will use the best dog for their girl but he could live could anywhere in the country. So don't expect always to be able to meet the father :-)
Jane

Offline Arrielle

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 27
  • Gender: Female
Re: To cocker or not cocker, that is the question!
« Reply #56 on: August 13, 2017, 12:19:55 PM »
I wonder if there are more breeders here Arrielle, DH has a list for the South East of the UK that is huge! It sounds like finding a GOOD breeder is the issue for us brits!

Yes that is the issue - there are huge numbers of people breeding dogs in the UK but only a small percentage will be "good" in the sense of doing all the recommended health tests,

I am in the USA but I experienced the same thing - very few good breeders and those are hard to get in touch with or don't have litters. I found mine at a dog-show and just by chance she was planning a litter this summer. The only dog that I actually saw was a pup from same parents she was planning to reproduce. I never saw the mother or the father in real life. Only some pictures.  However I trust her. For one think, she screened me and my husband 10 times more than we screened her dogs :)
In the end you also take a chance. After you made sure the breeder is reputable and her dogs won some prizes, it's like with humans: they have personalities .

Offline lilgingemama

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 22
Re: To cocker or not cocker, that is the question!
« Reply #57 on: August 13, 2017, 07:44:05 PM »
I wonder if there are more breeders here Arrielle, DH has a list for the South East of the UK that is huge! It sounds like finding a GOOD breeder is the issue for us brits!

Yes that is the issue - there are huge numbers of people breeding dogs in the UK but only a small percentage will be "good" in the sense of doing all the recommended health tests, breeding for the right reasons, knowledge of the breed etc. I haven't read all this thread sorry but if you are looking for a gold bitch from a good breeder, you will inevitably have to be extremely patient as such a puppy will not be easy to find (you will probably find it much easier if you don't limit yourself to a particular colour). Also I see you have mentioned sussing out both parents, you should always see the mother of course but many good breeders will not own the stud dog necessarily - they will use the best dog for their girl but he could live could anywhere in the country. So don't expect always to be able to meet the father :-)

Thank you Jane. This seems like one of the most important yet toughest bits.

I am not joking when I say DH printed out a wadge of breeders numhers and addresses as thick as my thumb.

I'm totally overwhelmed by looking. Because I'm a first timer - I am nervous about getting it wrong or having the wool pulled over my eyes.

DH was a boy when he got his dog and parents were in charge - sounds like little Sammy was kept outdoors etc which now I hear is a no no!

Is there any reputable places to go? Is champdogs good or does that limit you to show cockers that actually "show"?

What would be a good price to pay? I've seen adverts from 400- 1300! We would rather wait for the right dog from the right breeder. We are in Sussex but would be willing to travel if anyone had a good experience (of a sincere breeder who would advise us on a great family dog!)


Offline lilgingemama

  • Newbie
  • *
  • Posts: 22
Re: To cocker or not cocker, that is the question!
« Reply #58 on: August 13, 2017, 07:55:25 PM »
Thank you Jane. This seems like one of the most important yet toughest bits.

Ah, I see about the mother. I'd read that is was best to meet both but that makes sense from a good breeder.

I am not joking when I say DH printed out a list of breeders' numbers and addresses as thick as my thumb! There seem so many to work through and I'm totally overwhelmed by it. I am nervous about getting it wrong or having the wool pulled over my eyes as a first timer!

Is there any reputable places to go to help narrow our search down? Is champdogs good or is that only if you want to get a dog to "show"?

What do you think would be a good price to pay? I've seen adverts from 400- 1300!

We would rather wait for the right dog from the right breeder. We are in Sussex but would be willing to travel if anyone had a good experience of a sincere breeder who would advise us on a great family dog!

Offline Jane S

  • Administrator
  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 13193
  • Gender: Female
Re: To cocker or not cocker, that is the question!
« Reply #59 on: August 13, 2017, 09:42:06 PM »
Thank you Jane. This seems like one of the most important yet toughest bits.

Ah, I see about the mother. I'd read that is was best to meet both but that makes sense from a good breeder.

I am not joking when I say DH printed out a list of breeders' numbers and addresses as thick as my thumb! There seem so many to work through and I'm totally overwhelmed by it. I am nervous about getting it wrong or having the wool pulled over my eyes as a first timer!

Is there any reputable places to go to help narrow our search down? Is champdogs good or is that only if you want to get a dog to "show"?

What do you think would be a good price to pay? I've seen adverts from 400- 1300!

We would rather wait for the right dog from the right breeder. We are in Sussex but would be willing to travel if anyone had a good experience of a sincere breeder who would advise us on a great family dog!

Champdogs is better than most breeder listing sites in that there is some vetting carried out & you can clearly see the KC registered names of parents, health test results etc (and you can filter out Working Cocker litters too if you want a show type puppy) but as in any website, you must still do your own checking & not take anything for granted. Champdogs is definitely not just for show dogs - there are plenty of breeders listed who have never shown in their lives ;)

Prices vary enormously - I have seen ads for Cockers for 1000 and above (and these are "normal" colours not the so-called "rare" colours) from breeders who are not producing top quality dogs and who seem to have no interest in the breed apart from making money from their litters. However it does depend on many factors - a fair price for a KC reg Cocker from health tested parents would for me be around the 800-850 mark but there are many breeders who will ask whatever they think people will pay and there are obviously puppy buyers willing to pay over 1000 for a puppy  :o

I would just advise you take your time, don't rush or be rushed by breeders who want you to pay a deposit immediately you enquire about a litter (so you don't "miss out" ). If you want a show type puppy, try to visit some shows and meet some breeders, meet their dogs too - it will all help in the long run. You have just missed the Hants & Sussex Cocker Club Open show which took place today but depending on how far you can travel, there are other shows in the SE over the next few months you could go to. I'll give you more info if you are interested :blink:
Jane