CockersOnline Forum
Cocker Specific Discussion => Behaviour & Training => Topic started by: Londongirl on October 06, 2016, 02:55:36 PM
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We are into the second week of my 'I'm determined to crack it this time' loose-leash training with Henry. As many of us here have darling little pullers, I thought it would be useful to record what I'm doing, and with what success (if any!). It will keep me motivated knowing I need to report in, and if things go wrong it might help to pinpoint when and where the cause is, if I keep a record. So here goes!
I started at home using this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DayHrhoSJZc&app=desktop (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DayHrhoSJZc&app=desktop)
I did this for a few days. It took a while for Henry to work out exactly where I wanted him to stand when I started moving around, I'd say we had this sequence down in three days, practicing for ten minutes twice a day.
I then added the leash and did the Kikopup loose-leash training in this video:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFgtqgiAKoQ&feature=youtu.be&app=desktop (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sFgtqgiAKoQ&feature=youtu.be&app=desktop)
I also like this video, especially the tip on holding the lead at your belly button, which I've been doing this week and find really helps. For one thing, my shoulders no longer hurt!:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Th5z-mnnUE#action=share (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Th5z-mnnUE#action=share)
I did this training in the garden rather than out in the street as our roads are really busy. I did this for another three days, a few times a day.
Meanwhile, we went on our normal walks but I tried to keep pulling to a minimum by changing direction or stopping. I know the trainers say it is best to not walk them on a lead if they will be able to pull while training, but it's impossible for us, especially as Henry's recall is currently so poor.
This week I've been doing loose-leash training for all our walks (bar some free running in the woods where for some reason he is very good and stays close). I let him run around on the longline first to burn off some energy then put him back on the regular lead. I have the clicker attached to my belt on one side and the treat bag on the other - so glamorous! On most walks it took him at least ten minutes to settle into the training. Click then treat for being by my side, or for looking up and turning back (click on the look, treat when he gets back to my side).
He's still forging ahead, but today I noticed him correct himself a few times. So I've upped the ante a bit. If he pulls ahead, I stop. I don't turn or walk backwards to try to reposition him, because I can see he knows what I want. So I just stop. I don't say anything. I just wait. Henry stops too. After about 20-30 seconds he remembers what I want and turns and comes back to my side. So I am now getting him to make the choice to come back to my side. As soon as he gets there, I start walking again and feed him the treat behind my leg while we are moving. After about 30 minutes of this, we were steadily increasing the amount of time he was walking by my side rather than ahead. I rewarded him a few times on the hoof when he was walking nicely for any length of time.
So that's the strategy for the next few days. He knows what I want, he knows the potential rewards, and that's the foundation to build on. Here's hoping we are both on the right track.
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Thanks for the great post. I will check out the vids and keep an eye on your progress.
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What a great idea L.G.!!!
I'll have a look at the videos a bit later and will prepare to join you in the Great Struggle :005:
Its a super way of staying motivated and I'm sure if we make a united effort we'll get there in the end!
Looking forward to everyone's progress reports! ;)
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What a great idea L.G.!!!
I'll have a look at the videos a bit later and will prepare to join you in the Great Struggle :005:
Its a super way of staying motivated and I'm sure if we make a united effort we'll get there in the end!
Looking forward to everyone's progress reports! ;)
Yes! Join me and together we shall bring the little darlings to heel - quite literally. The more the merrier.
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👍👍👍
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I am in to day two and its hard work. I am sure people think I am completely crazy until they realise i have a dog on one side of me! I am going to try the clicker method, i was trying just the word good then treat with some success but not too much. What treats are you using? Loubeelou has quite a sensitive tummy so don't want to give her too many treats as we both suffer later!
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I haven't used a clicker much before, but I do think it's really helping because when we are in motion it clearly marks the moment the good behaviour happens. Have you tried doing the clicker training videos first at home before trying it out on your walk?
Henry's tummy is pretty sensitive too. He can have a little cheese, or hot dog, cut into tiny pieces. I bring a small bag of one of those plus a pouch full of Harrington's liver training treats. He can eat a whole bag of those with no adverse consequences! When we're training he mostly gets the liver biscuits with the occasional jackpot of cheese or hotdog.
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I'll be following this with interest . I posted about using the halti front fastening harness on a different post . Ernie isn't on the lead much & when he is he's pretty good but if we go into town or he's on lead somewhere new he's not great & I spend my time constantly stopping & waiting for him to come back to heal . My recent bad back forced me to try the harness ... the difference is unbelievable it's like he's had months of loose lead training :D. I know it's cheating really but it's really changed things for the better & he's quite happy wearing the harness ;)
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I've been doing a similar thing for ages and Maddie is better. I too stop and wait for her to return to my side. You can see the cogs going in their brain. I actually now don't carry on walking until she has looked at me but I feel it focuses her and she concentrates a bit more.
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Weekend update:
Henry walked really well on his evening walk yesterday, but he generally does, wearing his WYDWL harness. He started pulling about half way back to the house so I really focused on not letting him move forwards when pulling. Something I'll be watching out for I need future.
This morning was the first time I walked Henry with my OH as well since I started the training. I showed OH what to do and Henry was quickly correcting himself with me. But when I handed him over to my OH, Henry just started pulling again and when OH stopped, Henry took FOREVER to walk back to him. So he knows what I want but hasn't generalised the behaviour to someone else holding the lead. I'm going to try and persuade OH to do some practice at home and in the garden with the clicker and treat pouch before tomorrow's walk.
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I think it'll be a while before he starts to do it automatically, whoever's at the other end of the lead. If you think how long he's been pulling, he's going to need a while to break the habit - its like us trying to alter a life long behaviour, it doesn't happen overnight. I think we need to be realistic otherwise we'll get demotivated and we are dealing with cockers afterall!
My situation is the reverse in that OH is always with me and I find it hard to be consistant when he's standing around like an abandoned suitcase and wanting to get on with the walk - I really need to go out separately, just to train.
On a lighter note - we started doing an exercise at class this morning to teach the dogs how to follow direction without using a command but using body language. In order to get the hang of it, we had to do it without the dogs to start with -, we were in pairs, one person was "the dog "and held one end of the lead and the other person holding the lead had to show what direction to go while we all trotted round in a ring!! :005: :005:! Talk about a Monty Python sketch, if anyone had been watching they'd have thought we'd all gone balmy! ...... The lengths we have to go to...... :huh: :doh:
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That's hysterical!
During the week it's just me and the dog. When it comes to the weekend, OH joins me and either has to stand around like a spare part while I train or he tries and has me barking orders at him and telling him where he's going wrong. It's not conducive to harmonious marital relations.
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Both of you can train independently. It's not necessary to be totally consistent.
Three people trained my dog. He works fine for any of us but it's a bit different.
My son uses a kind of swiss-yodel to call him, daughter-in-law uses a whistle because she can't bellow.
I just yell "COME".
Makes no difference we all get him back most of the time.
The kids use his name a lot. I stick to one-word commands. None of us does significantly better than the others.
However we ALL use the same reward/ignore/ methods we never do any punishment kind of things.
Just once as a puppy I gave this dog a telling off. Would not co-operate for a week.
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Not so good today, but I can think of two reasons:
1. I couldn't give him a run around on the long lead when we first arrived at the park because the mowers were out cutting the grass.
2. I didn't bring good enough treats. He LOVES cheese but too much upsets his stomach. Ditto for hot dog. With the amount that he gets during training, his stomach was getting very upset. I am going to try a trick I read somewhere, where you put training treats in a bag with some cheese and leave them there in the fridge overnight so the biscuits smell and taste like cheese! The biscuits I had today definitely weren't tasty enough to keep him focussed.
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Livercake!
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Livercake!
I've tried it. He's not keen.
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Not so good today, but I can think of two reasons:
1. I couldn't give him a run around on the long lead when we first arrived at the park because the mowers were out cutting the grass.
2. I didn't bring good enough treats. He LOVES cheese but too much upsets his stomach. Ditto for hot dog. With the amount that he gets during training, his stomach was getting very upset. I am going to try a trick I read somewhere, where you put training treats in a bag with some cheese and leave them there in the fridge overnight so the biscuits smell and taste like cheese! The biscuits I had today definitely weren't tasty enough to keep him focussed.
Yes, I've done that in the past, and taken a mixed bag, so each treat is pot luck. I've still got loads of puppy kibble, which we had given as samples when we first had him and I mix those in aswell. I tried goats cheese this morning - lovely and smelly but by the end of the walk it was just a big soggy mess!
I started "proper" with the clicker on Saturday morning and although we've obviously got a long long way to go, he does seem to be getting the idea and as long as there's no distraction, he's not too bad but the hard bit for me is deciding at what point he needs to be corrected, sometimes he's just moving a bit further forward to follow a smell but the lead isn't isn't really tight. It seems a bit idealistic to think he'd walk absolute glued to my heel without his nose down at all for any great distance and wouldn't be much fun for him either. As anticpitaed, he does tend to just sit down as soon as I stop because that's what I trained him to do, -( I think that's what they mean by putting the cart before the horse!😂😂) Just out of interest, which hand do you have the lead, clicker and treats in and how long do you have the lead? It always looks so simple in the videos but I seem to get myself in a bit of a muddle - I could do with another hand!, :005: :005:
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I have a double ended lead, fastened at the chest and on his back. I hold the centre of the loop with both hands at my belly button. I stop the minute I feel any tension against my hands (which is quite often!). There's enough slack that he can move a little ahead, or to the side to have a sniff without me bothering him. It's his walk, after all.
Now, onto the tricky bit! I have the clicker hanging from my belt on the right and a treat pouch hanging from my belt on the left. I can get to either while still holding the lead with the other hand. The advantage of the double ended lead is that I'm holding on in two places,side by side, with both hands. If I drop one hand to click or get a treat, Henry doesn't really notice and I don't accidentally tug on the lead myself. I can grasp the clicker and click without having to let go at all as the cord is long enough. And because it's attached I can just let go again when I'm done.
I tend to always have a treat cupped in my left hand (as I'm training Henry to walk on the left) so I'm ready to give it promptly. As soon as I dole one out, I secret another in my hand ready for the next time.
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Have you tried cooked chicken or roast beef? Better fed than us our dogs! :005:
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He does like roast chicken - I'll be training him tomorrow with the left overs from Sunday lunch! But still not as much as he likes cheese.
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OK! Thanks - will report in at the end of the week! 😉
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I shall enjoy reading about how you get on and shall hopefully learn some tips to help with my 16 month old. Millie can walk nicely when she wants to and then other times its a battle and she can be very tricky. I am keen to know how you progress. Good luck
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After a couple of frustrating days, a better walk today.
I realised that I've been making a mistake. When Henry pulls ahead, I stop. As I mentioned above, I've started waiting for him to correct himself and come back to me. I realised today that he was popping back to me, getting his treat then bolting forwards again. So I don't think he was associating the reward with loose leash walking. Just stop - turn - go back - get a treat - repeat. You have to be so careful about the erroneous associations they get in their heads.
I cottoned on to this about halfway through our walk today and changed my behaviour so that when he came back to me I shifted my position every so slightly to make sure he was just behind my leg, and gave him the treat when we started walking again and when he was still behind my hand at the seam of my trousers.
I let him off for a good run in the woods then put him back on the leash for the last five minutes walk back to the car. Which he did all by my side, my dropping treats into his mouth every few steps. Hurrah! That's the longest he's been able to focus on the training while out of the house and with lots of distractions. Obviously it helped that he'd run off most of his crazy already.
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ha ha!! That was EXACTLY the conclusion I came to yesterday afternoon - little Wotsit was doing just the same as Henry! I read a book about using a clicker for training (general, not just heel walking) and I gather the idea is, that the clicker eventually replaces the treat altogether, the clicker becomes the reward and because of association with food, they're happy with that! (Wonder if it could work for us .. :005:) In order to get that far, you can leave a gap of a couple of seconds between click and treat then start to only treat after every second or third click then gradually space them out more and more until they only get an occasional treat. It's obviously quite a long process til we get that far but maybe just clicking without a treat occasionally would keep them on a their toes a bit. This is all theoretical, I haven't tried it but the concept of the clicker was invented by somebody training dolphins and based on the research of a Russian scientist, so we cannot allow ourselves to fail!! :005:
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Hey.
For clicker training, a click always means a treat, always. But what your dog does to earn the treat should get more difficult over time. So, if you click and treat for ten steps at heel, you can then move to eleven. If puppy nails eleven, you can move to twelve. You want to get to the stage where the puppy does't know when the treat is coming, but knows that a click means something good will happen, and therefore keeps working for it. What you are aiming for is rewarding the best efforts, and that's what you'll then get more of.
If you click and then don't treat, the pup will lose faith that the click means something good is happening. So instead, just make it a fraction harder to earn the treat after the pup has been successful at one 'level', then keep baby-stepping up.
There's tonnes of great stuff online that will help- let me know if you want some links.
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OK - that actually makes more sense, thanks!!
Presumably I can bin my book? ;) :lol:
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:D
The positive reinforcement behaviour field is fascinating. I can draw parallels to how my daughter 'trained' me, how I might be inadvertently 'training' people at work, and all sorts of situations. For now, I'll keep practising on Bonkers Bonnie. :005:
Incidentally, we're just back a lovely walk with her on harness and longline patrolling the village. After a few months, we have widened and widened where we can go, she potters along collecting sniffs and village pee-mail, and checks in with me frequently. When I need her closer by the road or whatever, I shorten the lead and she knows it's time to stick close to mum (and by the way, that means lots of treats). Much more relaxed for us both. And I've noticed that she seems to need less entertaining at home since the walk is more enriching for her. Her recall is better too, but she's not getting off at the moment as she's in season and I'm not ready for a houseful of little Bonkers Bonnies.
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O'h I think a bountyful of beautiful baby bonker Bonnies sounds beguiling!!! :005:
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I'm thinking I will next summer- need to start interviewing potential daddies!
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Quick update - we've made real progress this week, although it doesn't feel like it when we first arrive at the park and he is pulling and barking like fury! But he is settling into nice walking much more quickly. He's still orientated by get a treat, so walks gazing up at my hand. I'm stretching the length of time / number of steps before the treat comes, and he is also occasionally just walking by my side, looking around.
He still pulls more for my OH, so I got him to walk Henry most of the time this morning. As ever, the OH needs more training than the dog! He kept allowing the lead to go tight because 'oh, he's only pulling a bit, it's better than it used to be'. I insisted on zero tolerance on any tightness in the lead which is boring, but being inconsistent is what got us in this pickle in the first place.
The other thing I've noticed is that Henry is getting a little less reactive to squirrels, which has been a big issue for us and his recall. He stops and stares, and whimpers a bit, and still pulls towards them, but not to the point where he's on his hind legs. And I can get his attention back to me much more quickly now. There were a few times today where I noticed him get distracted but then very quickly turn his attention back to me without being promoted. Hopefully this is will help in re-training his recall, which I'm starting in earnest next week.
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Sounds as though you are making real progress with his heel work :D
Don't rush into recall. Get his basics right first, he's already given you a hint of what is to come by doing "the meerkat" impersonation.... Much as I'm sure you want to be able to see him run round, off lead, it really is worth persevering with the long line until he's passed the chase age.......which can be after 2 ;) Wish someone had said that to me and I'd listened...... We are off to more Gundog lessons as Coral has recently discovered what the ground scent really means. We are not just back to basics but not able to be off lead at all, again :-\
Jayne
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Thanks, Jayne! Yes, I agree about the recall. I'm working on all his basics while keeping him on the long line. We need a solid down-stay for starters. I'm also going to focus on his recall in more basic situations. I'm ashamed to say I can't even recall him from the garden anymore. ph34r ph34r
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I've begun to realise how much harder it must be to work/train a Cocker if you can only use a park.
I have given up using my local Common because there are too many roads, other dogs and possibilities to get into trouble.
Fortunately I've two huge forest areas around here. One of them, Ashridge NT, is so huge and wild I've to use a GPS tracker or I get lost.
I do need effective recall though!
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Sounds like you are doing well.
Bramble get so obsessed with the food that she walks straining to look at me which is no good for their necks. As she doesn't pull so badly I click and treat her when she's walking and looking around her rather than at me. Maddie isn't there yet. Her nose is still to the ground!
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Just in the interests of balance, am posting to say we had a shockingly bad morning. I was not in a great mood and Henry was already agitated by the workmen building a shed in our neighbours' garden. I did some training with him before we went out (reinforcing some basic obedience before my Friday dog walker threatens to quit on me!) but Henry was just all over the place when we got to the park. Just as I got him settled down to some nice walking a jack russell jumped up and stole my bag of treats. So I had nothing to reward him with and he was pulling all over the place with me desperately trying to not let him reinforce it.
Oh well, tomorrow is another day.
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Start carrying a Tennis ball. You can get small ones.
Always good for "distraction" and rewarding.
You can clean and even descale my dogs teeth, by putting a ball in his mouth and holding it.
Dogs that are "ball-obsessed" are easier to manage.
Excuse to show photo of my dog!
(https://c8.staticflickr.com/2/1703/23972641119_f5724f3d05_b.jpg)
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Henry is not toy motivated when we're walking although I'll give it a try as things change.
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I agree with Alan. If your dog is interested in balls they can be great for getting the desired response. Millie will walk to heal perfectly on a field if I am holding a ball.
I've not tried it on a pavement walk yet bit I might do today.
Edit.....just seen the above post.
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If you train a dog to fetch a ball then it helps with general recall.
I started ball training at the same time as toilet training.
Have a wee and fetch a ball. Worked a treat.
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I've tried repeatedly to train Henry to play fetch. Just. Not. Interested. He just wants to play tug with the ball. Will drop it for a treat, then I'll throw it. But once he's done that a couple of times and realised we're playing fetch and not tug, he drops the ball and gets his tug toy.
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I find a ball a distraction, to be honest. If Humphrey's been doing well, he gets to play as a bit of a reward but then I take it away again as the ball is the main focus of his attention instead of me! He loves racing after it and brings it back but won't drop it willingly and becomes so possesive with it, I don't think its good to let him have it for too long.
We've got a labrador staying here at the moment, so the training's on the back burner at the moment, they're both so excited all the time, I just haven't got the patience. . On a more positive note though, the lab saw two deer this morning and shot off with Humphrey in persuit - one blast on the whistle and Humphrey was back with me, - took another 5 blasts before the labby finally turned back! :banana: :banana:
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I do take a ball on a rope out with me sometimes but I find Henry just gets too hyper with it in a way he wouldn't at home.
Great to hear Humphrey is doing so well with his recall. I'm starting from scratch with the whistle, random times at home, occasionally when he's on the long line. I'm sure it will come back quicker than it took to embed in the first place.
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Better day today. We did some long line training in an open field first, then a walk in the woods. I normally let him off the lead in the woods as he stays close but he's been going further and taking longer to get back to us - minutes at a time, which feels like an eternity when you can't see or hear your dog - so I'm reluctantly keeping him on the lead in the woods too. :-\
Anyway, he managed some loose-lead walking in the woods, which I think is pretty good with all the distractions. I'm also working on getting him to do a 'down' outside the house. He's always been very reluctant to lie down on command outdoors, I think it makes him feel vulnerable. I interspersed the loose-lead training with some 'down' training, just so he didn't get too bored, which he seemed to enjoy once he got over his initial desire to do a curtsey instead of a proper down! And of course I let him sniff every tree, bush, bramble...
As a side note, I have a dog walker take Henry on Friday mornings. He's been walking Henry since he was just a few months old but he's just told he can't take him any more because if he lets Henry off the lead, he disappears and does not come when called. If he keeps Henry on the lead, Henry pulls him all over the place. While this is a complete pain for me, I think in the long run it will be better for Henry, as he has been getting to do all the things with the walker that I've been trying to train out of him. Hopefully with a few months consistency and a bit of maturity on Henry's part, he'll be able to go out with the walker again. They adore each other, so it's a sad day. :'(
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That's a shame but I suppose you can understand how he feels. I think you're right about the training though, its quite possible that Henry's confused about what's expected of him. I just don't seem to be getting any further and since our labrador visitor has been here, Humphrey's just so distracted, he's pulling worse than ever.
Hope the penny drops with Henry soon so he can enjoy his Friday walks again! ;)
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I have to admit I did sit and have a good cry, just out of sheer frustration. A few months ago he was off-leash, enjoying the woods and field and walks were... fun! I know we'll get back to it eventually.
I'm sure Humphrey will get back on track once your visitor is gone. We are definitely making progress, albeit slowly.
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Yes, and we really mustn't forget they're still very young, they're interested in everything and that's why they're so distracted. In contrast, this 6 year old, rather overweight lab just plods along at my side, very placid and obedient (but SO boring!! :005:)........
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I did have a lady come up to me with her two labs and say 'Oh, I'm getting a spaniel next time, these two are just so DULL.' :lol:
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Wasn't planning to update so soon, but just had the best walk so far with Mr Henry. Very, very little pulling. We even managed to get from the car into the park with only a little tugging, rather than him barking his head off with excitement and meerkatting all the way. Walking around the park after a run on the longline, he mostly looked to me for his treats as we went along, but several times he trotted along just looking around. He also managed to not react to a squirrel at very close proximity. He saw it, stopped but didn't lunge, and quickly turned back to my side for a treat. This is a REAL breakthrough.
Looking back over the last few weeks, I am reminded that breakthroughs often come immediately after days when the training has gone badly.
The other thing to note is that this week I have been absolutely resolute on zero pulling. On our bad day on Tuesday, it took us fifteen minutes to get from the car to the park even though it's maybe ten steps in total. I just plain refused to let him drag me. We went somewhere else yesterday, but today we returned to the scene of the standoff and he barely pulled at all. Immediately we got out of the car he started circling round to walk beside me.
Now, there is every chance he'll be dreadful again tomorrow. So I'm writing this as a reminder to myself to be consistent and not give up at the first sign of backsliding, which I've been guilty of before.
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Try a WYDWL harness.My wife could not hold mine on a collar but managed well on this.
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Yeahhhhh :banana: :banana: :clapdance: :clapdance:
Well done Henry!!!
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Try a WYDWL harness.My wife could not hold mine on a collar but managed well on this.
We have a WYDWL and use it for street walks. But I want Henry to learn not to pull in any harness as we use other harnesses for longline training and walks in the woods. And the WYDWL is no good when I want to have him on and off the leash as the front strap dangling down makes him walk with a funny hitch. I never attach his leash to his collar.
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I on/off the WYDWL all the time. I can do it as quick as an ordinary collar.
When off I clip it into a loop and wear it MYSELF!
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I on/off the WYDWL all the time. I can do it as quick as an ordinary collar.
When off I clip it into a loop and wear it MYSELF!
My point is there are situations where I need to use a different harness. I'm not going to walk him there in the WYDWL then whip it off and fit the other harness. If Henry was allowed off the lead, yes I could just take off the harness. It is very easy as you say. But the fact that I can see him hitching up his leg makes me wonder if it's also affecting his gait when we are walking with him on the lead and the WYDWL. I can't tell as I walk beside him. So I'm keen to get him walking nicely in his other harness.
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Real progress well done Henry (and you!) :D
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Monday morning update - some real progress on all fronts. Husband's training is coming along nicely! He's co-operating with the zero-tolerance on the pulling and getting those treats in fast.
I'm letting Henry have a good 10-15 minutes sniffing around on the long line before I put him on the regular lead. He is falling into walking by my side very quickly. Reacting less to squirrels, although we still get the odd meerkat moment. If he pulls to the side because he wants to sniff something, I stop, wait for him to come to my side, click and treat then walk him over to whatever it is he wanted to have a sniff at. I'm hoping that feels like a double reward to him, and lets him know nice walking gets him what he wants.
He is still mostly looking at me while we are walking, waiting for a treat. I'm still firing them in pretty quickly to really establish the habit of being beside me. The next step will be to lengthen the amount of time between the good behaviour and the treat arriving. I also try to reward when he is just walking along looking around, rather than always at me. I think this is the crucial time to NOT rush things but build on the good habit we are starting to establish. It's taken three weeks to get to this stage, and the first two weeks or so mostly consisted of me walking one or two steps at most before stopping.
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Rachael, that's brilliant!!! Well done, I really admire your determination! Really sounds like you're making a breakthrough!!
You say Henry has 15 minutes long line before normal walking, do you leave the house with the long lead or do you drive to where ever you go? My problem is, that when we leave home, we walk for about 5 minutes on the normal lead and then I can let him off (its just fields and paths), so he's on the normal line to start with and that's the hardest bit as its the way that everyone else has been with their dogs and cows ( >:( ) etc and I feel doomed to failure before I even start!! Coming back is much easier, (but then, breakfast awaits!!! ;)).
If I put him on the normal lead on the field paths and say heel, he'll play the game, probably because the smells aren't so exciting but on the street or at training classes, where I really need him to cooperate, he's still a nightmare! (I had thought of pushing wine corks up his nostrils! 😂😂😂)
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I do have a short walk from the car to where I let him run and this part is still a battle in some places. I've cracked it at the park we go to most often by just not moving until he comes to my side. One day it took 20 minutes to walk ten paces. I was so exasperated. But guess what? The next day he remembered and played the game and has done ever since.
He still pulls like a steam train at the woods, where we only go twice a week. That's the next one to crack!
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Do you give any command before you click and treat? I always say "Walk nicely" but from Humphrey'/ point of view,that's probably open to interpretation :005:.....
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Nope. I just stand and wait. If it's taking forever and he's clearly forgotten what we are doing, sniffing the air, I sometimes make a little sound just to get his attention. Then click and treat when he gets back to my side and is already walking beside me.
I say 'nice walking!' and toss him a treat occasionally when he is actually walking nicely without looking at me for a treat. If you say it when he's not doing it, what is he pairing it with? Walking back to you? Standing waiting for a treat? I have made far too many mistakes pairing cues with the wrong action that I'm very sparing now in what I say!
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Yes, I've made that mistake - I only say it at the moment if he really is walking well, but I suppose, thinking about it, it is a bit unnecessary. Thanks!
By the way, this diary is really keeping me motivated, it was a great idea!
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Millie is still not good on a lead but.....
She now has a habit of dropping back, walking behind me and then walking along side Murphy with a perfect loose lead. Then she does the opposite and returns to her normal position on my right where she pulls like a train.
She does this continually during our walk. I don't understand why she only pulls when walking on my right when on the left she does a perfect heel.
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Yes, I've made that mistake - I only say it at the moment if he really is walking well, but I suppose, thinking about it, it is a bit unnecessary. Thanks!
By the way, this diary is really keeping me motivated, it was a great idea!
Glad you're finding it helpful, I was worried about boring everyone!
For that last three days, Henry has been walking beautifully. I don't want to jinx it, but I think we are getting there!
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Wish I could say the same! Well done, keep it up!!! :clapping:
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Wish I could say the same! Well done, keep it up!!! :clapping:
Pep talk time! Where have you got to in the process? Is there one place or situation where the training just not getting through? It's taken all this time to get Henry to walk nicely from the car to where he goes on the long line and even now there is one place that he loves where he still can't help pull me. When it's at the beginning of the walk it is so frustrating. I had a few 45 minute walks where the first 20-30 minutes were spent practically not moving.
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As my trainer remarked with a sigh on Saturday " uh uh - Humphrey's back in Humphrey World again"! and that just sums it up!! When we leave the house, I get him to sit and then calmly walk off, if (when!) he pulls, we stop and he'll reposition himself and and we can manage a calm walk to the corner, where we come on to the main road - which is where the smells start - the cows walk along there to the field and there are several other dogs that have gone before us, so nose is glued to the ground and I could wave a side of beef in front of him, NOTHING will get him to look up. When we get to the place where we always cross over, he's back with me again and sits automatically and waits til I start off again. Shortly after that, he's off lead and he's rarely far away, and if necessary will walk perfectly to heel, - we've walked passed goats and cows and he'll stay with me.
Its the inconsistency that's so frustrating, some days or in some places he'll walk beautifully but then at other times he just goes off into fairy land!! BUT on the plus side, he's been really good on his recalls lately and the last couple of days I've managed to get him to stop and sit at distance, so I have to be thankful for small mercies!!!
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Is he pulling while he's sniffing? Now that Henry is behaving himself better I am attaching the two-ended leash just to front of his harness which gives us a six foot lead. If he wants to dander off to the side and snuffle, there's enough slack that he doesn't pull.
Because Henry is never off the lead at the moment, our training has been a good 30-40 minutes every day, in different locations, so that might have speeded up our progress.
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Yes, I think that's your secret, - I really do need to spend more time with him on the lead. I walk with OH in the mornings for just over an hour but any serious training I do with him on my own in the afternoons, but we're usually only out for 20 to 30 minutes, - and thinking about it now, that's when he's usually better. Maybe I should re-think our routine altogether and increase the time when we're training proper rather than just ambling along (and leave OH at home! ;))
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Leaving OH at home is the secret to success! :005:
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Hi, - just wanted to update that I think we're starting to see a chink of light on the distant horizon!!
Humphrey's very unenthusiastic about any of his harnesses, so I've been back to using the collar, just for short walks on the lead. Aldi had dog leads on offer a couple of weeks ago and I bought an elasticated one, just to have as a spare for the car. Its a bit strange to use as its harder to wind him in and you haven't got as much control but, he doesn't seem to notice it so much as its really light. I keep my arm straight at my side and try as much as possible to keep it loose. ( He always walks better to heel without the lead anyway) We're definately making progress and he's starting to correct his own position now when I stop and he comes back to me rather than me stopping, him stopping and then I walk to him. This is all still only happening in a distraction free environment and we've still got a loooonnnnng way to go but I do think we're heading in the right direction at last.!!............. :banana: (just hope I haven't opened my big mouth too soon! :005:)
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After getting fed up that I feel like the middle man between the Russian and Polish tug-of-war teams (Murphy wants to stop and sniff everything while Millie just wants to plough on ahead) I have bought Millie a Halti head collar. Now believe me, this is a last resort as I am not a fan of this type of harness but it does seem to work.
When Millie is not trying to get it off her face she walked beautifully today. Every time the lead started to tension she would drop back without any correction on my behalf. Hopefully I can start to enjoy our lead walks a bit more now.
Edit : if anybody would like a Walk Your Dog with Love harness (18lb - 35lb) just send me a PM and I will send it out. It worked well for Millie at first but she has since learned how to pull in it.
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Since it is 6 months since I started this thread, I thought I'd post a short video of Henry walking with me today. It's a bit rubbish as I am trying to walk and film at the same time, and Mr H is looking at me more than normal because of the phone in my hand. However, I think it gives a general idea of how easy our walking is now. On the street I keep him in more of a heel position. But in the park, I let him take it at his own pace and stop for important investigations.
https://youtu.be/urg7rqdyT0E
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:clapping: :clapping: well done Mr. Henry and even more - Well done Rachael!! That's a real success story and so great that all your hard work has paid off. It just goes to prove that it IS possible with enough determination and staying power!
Herr Humphrey needs to get his finger paw out!!!! :005:
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I expect everyone to be posting similar videos in six months time!
This (equally crappy) video shows Henry correcting himself a couple of times when he gets to the end of the lead.
https://youtu.be/pZfQjCk3gEU
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I expect everyone to be posting similar videos in six months time!
This (equally crappy) video shows Henry correcting himself a couple of times when he gets to the end of the lead.
https://youtu.be/pZfQjCk3gEU
Don't hold breath!! :005: (but we'll try!! ;))
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Aww, Henry's just a model dog. If I were not so embarrassed I'd post a video of Blue doing his finest Roobarb impersonation.
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Believe me, Henry was a nightmare. When I started this training, we had just been dumped by our dog walker because both his recall and lead walking were so bad!
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Well, he's a credit to you and your perseverance. Well done! And he's completely gorgeous! :luv:
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I expect everyone to be posting similar videos in six months time!
This (equally crappy) video shows Henry correcting himself a couple of times when he gets to the end of the lead.
https://youtu.be/pZfQjCk3gEU
Coming on great, well done 👍