Recall training - starting over again AGAIN.

[MIN]

you have my blessing    Sometimes they are just not worth the time 

[bizzylizzy]

Uh uh - looks like OH is really in the proverbial dog house now!! 

[lescef]

Don't you just feel you're fighting a losing battle - they just think they know it all! (I have one of those! ) 

[hoover]

Wow this sounds really hard, and you are putting in so much time and effort to fixing it too. For all the behavioural problems Ollie has had thankfully recall has not been one of them. We waited him out one day when he was dancing around and growling about having the lead put on at the end of a walk in the park...just sat down on a bench mostly ignoring him until he was pretty much begging us to have the lead put on to go home. Since then he hasn't done that again. Not sure if something like waiting him out would work in your situation though.

[hoover]

I guess you could try to create a situation where he became afraid that he had been abandoned altogether after he had wandered off. This experience might make him think better of disappearing altogether the next time. You could hide from him. Or the person walking him could return home whilst OH appeared unbeknownst  to him to keep an eye on things. This confusion and uncertainty might convince him to think that staying closer is a better option in the future. You can get tracking devices for them too to give you extra reassurance. This would only work if he is motivated by fear of losing you...if not then its harder to think what might work.

[Archie bean]

He owes you a pretty awesome Christmas pressie. If it's a toaster you'd definitely get a not guilty verdict.

[Londongirl]

I guess you could try to create a situation where he became afraid that he had been abandoned altogether after he had wandered off. This experience might make him think better of disappearing altogether the next time. You could hide from him. Or the person walking him could return home whilst OH appeared unbeknownst  to him to keep an eye on things. This confusion and uncertainty might convince him to think that staying closer is a better option in the future. You can get tracking devices for them too to give you extra reassurance. This would only work if he is motivated by fear of losing you...if not then its harder to think what might work.

Thanks, hoover, but I'm pretty sure that wouldn't work and might even make him worse. I'm sure (praying!) we'll get there eventually, as long as OH doesn't let Henry off in such highly tempting circumstances until they are BOTH ready for it!

[bizzylizzy]

I guess you could try to create a situation where he became afraid that he had been abandoned altogether after he had wandered off. This experience might make him think better of disappearing altogether the next time. You could hide from him. Or the person walking him could return home whilst OH appeared unbeknownst  to him to keep an eye on things. This confusion and uncertainty might convince him to think that staying closer is a better option in the future. You can get tracking devices for them too to give you extra reassurance. This would only work if he is motivated by fear of losing you...if not then its harder to think what might work.

It is an interesting thought, you're obviously the best judge of the way Henry would deal with it but I understand where Hoover's coming from - we inadvertently "lost" our last dog for over half an hour when he was very young. The look of relief on his face (and mine!) when he eventually found us again was clear to see. We didn't go looking for him but just stayed put, calling occasionally, until he eventually turned up, he never ever ran off again. The exercise wasn't planned however, it was just one of those things. I just wonder if having Henry on the long lead most of the time has actually given him a sort of false sense of security i.e. he's still doing his thing but YOU have his safe return under control, so he doesn't have to discipline himself? Maybe hiding occasionally, somewhere safe obviously and preferably somewhere new to him, might just wake him up to the fact he's got to keep a look out too? My trainer said he throws treats out occasionally while he's walking, it supposedly messages the dogs that if they stay close, they'll be rewarded and at the same time gives them a job to do searching the treats. Every dog's different and what works for one doesn't for the other but I think you perhaps need to work on making yourself more interesting than whatever else is out there - (maybe you need to get one of those Hot Dog costumes!!😂😂)

Thanks, hoover, but I'm pretty sure that wouldn't work and might even make him worse. I'm sure (praying!) we'll get there eventually, as long as OH doesn't let Henry off in such highly tempting circumstances until they are BOTH ready for it!

[Londongirl]

I think the whole thing of letting them get 'lost' works when they are puppies and for some dogs that lesson is never forgotten. Remember Henry was off lead and well behaved from 12 weeks to 11 months, when all the usual tactics worked. And let's not forget the other COL member who posted here recently to say his 'runner' disappeared for SIX HOURS and still runs off. People keep say 'just let him off' but I know Henry. One of the things that makes him an easy going dog is also the thing that makes his recall difficult - he's fearless and not particularly anxious about anything. Including getting lost.

We haven't built up distance recall yet and I think that's where my OH went wrong. If he'd called Henry the minute he saw his head go up and the 'squirrel' glint in his eye, he might well have come straight back. But by the time he thought to blow the whistle, the red mist had descended! I'm still working on Henry turning back to me for guidance when he sees something he wants to chase.

I do drop the long line when we are walking in the fields. We play ball and I toss treats for him to find. I let him get so far then call him back for 'special' rewards (cheese and a good chest rub!). I'm working on it being Henry's choice not my control. It's just taking a very, very long time.

[Archie bean]

I wonder if he may have come back for you but perhaps not for your OH? If you are the one doing all the training then he may be learning to obey YOUR commands, but not the command itself? Perhaps OH could join in some of the training just to make sure that when the lessons do sink in (and it sounds like you are working so hard so I'm sure eventually he will get there) he is rock solid with whoever is with him? Mums Jade has a perfect recall to the whistle - when Mum is there. When she's just with me she can be a right little madam!! 

[lescef]

I see Maddie reflected in a lot of these comments
Her recall isn't good if she's in a 'sniff'. I know it's probably my fault as I didn't sort it out early enough, but she doesn't care two hoots where we are. I can hide but she takes no notice. I can be on the other side of the field and she wouldn't care. However,  it's this problem partly  that has led her to become fearful and aggressive as I couldn't get her back or get to her before other dogs had 'bombed'  and scared her. Bramble on the other hand never goes very far from us.  Interestingly,  I know the lady who has Maddie's cousin and her dog is exactly the same - so genetics must play a part too.

Because I mainly train Maddie I also find she won't come back for OH. We are trying to work on that too!

I saw a training tip on another site that basically waited for the dog to come back of its own accord then treat heavily. I've actually found that this is working well for Maddie when there are no distractions. It does at least mean she's staying closer to us which can only be a good thing!
I think they can have a stubborn streak!

[bizzylizzy]

Yes,it is all the distractions that are the problem and there's no doubt that LG has a lot more to deal with than I do, - our walks are more or less event free, unless a tractor happens to appear, in which case Humphrey will sit and wait for it to go past but on the whole there isn't much else happening so in those circumstances I'm pretty cool I guess - it'd be a different kettle of fish in a park.....
LG - I honestly think you're doing a terrific job and you're putting a lot of work into Henry's training, you're certainly a lot more persistent than I am - hats off!!  -I think its like you say, its in his character to be interested and inquisitive and that, after all, is what makes him Henry! If he was human, he'd probably go down in history as a famous explorer  . So maybe you just have to accept that he's like he is for now and hang on to the hope that he'll decide to take early retirement from his expeditions  and be content to amble along at your side smelling the flowers!!   He will grow up, - eventually! (and in the meantime, there's always wine and chocolates and valium!! )

[Londongirl]

I wonder if he may have come back for you but perhaps not for your OH? If you are the one doing all the training then he may be learning to obey YOUR commands, but not the command itself? Perhaps OH could join in some of the training just to make sure that when the lessons do sink in (and it sounds like you are working so hard so I'm sure eventually he will get there) he is rock solid with whoever is with him? Mums Jade has a perfect recall to the whistle - when Mum is there. When she's just with me she can be a right little madam!! 

OH trains at the weekends. We make sure Henry goes back to the person who called him, not the person he loves most. 😉

[Londongirl]

Yes,it is all the distractions that are the problem and there's no doubt that LG has a lot more to deal with than I do, - our walks are more or less event free, unless a tractor happens to appear, in which case Humphrey will sit and wait for it to go past but on the whole there isn't much else happening so in those circumstances I'm pretty cool I guess - it'd be a different kettle of fish in a park.....
LG - I honestly think you're doing a terrific job and you're putting a lot of work into Henry's training, you're certainly a lot more persistent than I am - hats off!!  -I think its like you say, its in his character to be interested and inquisitive and that, after all, is what makes him Henry! If he was human, he'd probably go down in history as a famous explorer  . So maybe you just have to accept that he's like he is for now and hang on to the hope that he'll decide to take early retirement from his expeditions  and be content to amble along at your side smelling the flowers!!   He will grow up, - eventually! (and in the meantime, there's always wine and chocolates and valium!! )

A huge thank you to you and all the COLers for the moral support. It really does help!

In the grand scheme of things, this is not the worst behavioural problem to have because while it is hard to fix, it is easy to manage: we still have lovely walks with Henry on the long line and lead. Other problems are much more difficult to manage and keep under your control and impact on life at home as well as out on walks. Really, I can count my blessings with Henry if this is the worst he ever throws at me. *drawing a veil over the worst of the puppy months*

[MIN]

Gemma is trained to return on the whistle  and she will return to whoever blew it.
 How she knows which one of us it was when we are both with her,  I do not know.