Genetics

[Millie's mum]

Hi I have a beautiful dark orange roan bitch with a brown nose. Her mum was the same and the sire was a chocolate roan. If she was mated with a stud dogs that has orange, blue and chocolate pups could she have all of these colours too? She has just had her first season at 11months old would it be best to mate her at her 2nd or 3rd season as I have read books that suggest both. Thanks

[spanielcrazy]

To answer your question: she could possibly produce those colours if the sire has produced them but there is no guarantee. My friend has a liver roan bitch who has produced nothing but blue roan.

Now I'll warn you, you are going to get  a lot of questions here about why you want to breed, have you done the Optigen tests for PRA and FN, and done hip certification?  Is the sire similarly tested? Do you show or hunt yior bitch? Are you prepared for the hard work and possible heartbreak that having a litter involves? Are you prepared to make yourself available to puppy owners for the life of the dogs to answer questions and concerns, and to take back any puppy at any time in it's life if it's circumstances don't work out? Is the stud dog owner equally committed? Have you had a look at the rescue websites to see how many cockers need homes?

Nothing personal  we are very passionate on COL about the welfare of the breed and about responsible breeding!

[Millie's mum]

The answer to all of those questions is yes! I have bred from my golden retrievers and am well aware of the hard work, risks etc. and as soon as Pippa is old enough she will have all of the health screening necessary and I will ensure the stud dog has all of these too! As most of my knowledge lies with Golden retrievers I was trying to get my knowledge of breeding Cockers up to stratch before embarking on anything - hence my enquiries now rather than nearer the time.

[spanielcrazy]

Then you understand why all the questions  not meant to offend

Colour breeding is parti's is a crap shoot, you just really never know what you are getting unless one of the dogs is dominant for blue roan, and it appears that a dog can be a certain colour but not produce it! 

Just look at colour as part of the fun and surprise of having a litter 

[Millie's mum]

I think seeing what colours are produced will be great, with golden retrievers there's no surprises! Is is better to mate at the 2nd or 3rd season? Thanks for your help.

[Cayley]

At 11 months she is still very young, I personally wouldn't breed from any female cocker before the age of 2 years. Health test first so you can make informed decisions going by the results.

[spanielcrazy]

My personal opinion is 3rd season The more maturity she can have the better. It also gives you a better idea of what her cycle is 

[Boof]

No offense meant but surely if you breed Golden Retrievers you should know which season to mate at from experience?  Unless it's different for the two breeds, I'm not sure.

I agree with Cayley as well - I would wait until after two years.

Genetics really is fascinating - although when it gets indepth it can become rather confusing. 

[spanielcrazy]

Here is a little bit of a primer on colour genetics:

http://www.ecsca.org/ecscoat.html

[Cayley]

Liver or pale nose pigment is undesirable on orange particolours, for this reason you need to be careful when choosing a stud so you reduce the chance of producing orange pups with liver pigment.

[Millie's mum]

Thanks for the information about the genetics site - it sounds really interesting but a little confusing to say the least. It's something I would like to read more about! I was unsure about which season to mate as I have read contradicting information and Golden retrievers and Cockers tend to have different length cycles, therefore I was trying to find out which is best. Thanks for the information and help.