CockersOnline Forum
Cocker Specific Discussion => Genetics & Breeding => Topic started by: Emmylou on February 20, 2007, 06:43:56 PM
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Hello
We've had Cosby for almost 3 years now, but it's not until we got Boo a coupl of months ago that I started getting interested in genetics and breeding. Probably because our new pup comes from a good breeder and Cosby was a bit of a naive purchase (I know, don't shout at me).
Anyway, in Bitcon troubador is in Boo's pedigree and it's a name I've see many times. Since joining this site (I'm a newbie) I have been looking through the posts and Bitcon Troubabdor comes up time and time again. He must have been a very busy dog!
I was just wondering if anyone knew anything about him and how he came to father so many pups - was he an extremely successful show dog, which is why everyone wanted to breed from him. Sorry if I'm being naive, but as I said, I'm knew to this
Thanks
Emma
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Sh CH Bitcon Troubador (My Jasper's daddy ;) ) was very very successful. Percy was also very busy fathering many lovely pups!!!
I have some pics of him somewhere and I think if you do a google search for his name you'll find lots of stuff for him ;)
Here's a link showing him - top pic - dog on the left ;)
http://www.westofenglandcockerclub.co.uk/hall_of_fame2.htm
(http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v257/pammy172/Troub2.gif)
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When you say Percy - is that Bitcon Troubador? As I said, I'm new to this
Emma
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When you say Percy - is that Bitcon Troubador? As I said, I'm new to this
Emma
Yes - that was his everyday name ;)
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gawd percy was one helluva handsome boy :luv:
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Actually Troubador's pet name was Geoffrey :lol: He was named after Geoff Parkin (Mistfall Cockers).
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Actually Troubador's pet name was Geoffrey :lol: He was named after Geoff Parkin (Mistfall Cockers).
:o Really :o :embarassed: :embarassed: I'm sure somone told me he was Percy :o :embarassed:? I must be having a senior and blonde moment rolled into one :embarassed: :embarassed:
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I think there might have been another Bitcon who was Percy but can't remember which one - I just remember Troubador was Geoffrey as we used him a couple of times and it's the sort of name that sticks in your head :005:
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Hi Guys
Jane is right Sh Ch Bitcon Troubador was indeed called Geoffrey .... Bitcon Time Traveller I think was called Percy whom Debbie & Ken Grice showed quite successfully.
Dessie
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He's my Dylans great great great grandad!
We're reated!
xxx
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and Flossy's Grandad :D
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Hi Guys
Jane is right Sh Ch Bitcon Troubador was indeed called Geoffrey .... Bitcon Time Traveller I think was called Percy whom Debbie & Ken Grice showed quite successfully.
Dessie
Percy is SH CH Bitcon Pickpocket :luv:
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hes ollies great great great grandad too :D
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He was Tess Great great grandad too! :o
Must have been one for the ladies this one :-* :P :luv:
As you get talking to people there isn't many parti-colours without Bitcon Troubador somewhere in the pedigree!
I noticed the dates on the photo above, and see he is no longer with us :'(
He must of died one happy dog ;)
Pam
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He's also Mac's great grandad. :D
Bitcon Troubador fathered Bitcon Broadway, who went to live at Gessa d'Aran (Spanish kennel), who in turn fathered Mac's mother who is now in Switzerland.
It's a small world. ;)
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Sorry the term is sired (and not fathered)!
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Oooh Bitcon Troubador is Domino's great great grandfather too! I'm so pleased...she has relatives! :005:
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He's Queen Bella's great-grandad (I think, or great-great Grandad). I believe one of his traits in blue roans is the black legs - Bella definitely has them anyway :lol: :luv:
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:D and Flo's great grandad ! ;)
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Boy that dog sure got around!! I'm surprised the neighbours didn't talk :005:
He's Queen Bella's great-grandad (I think, or great-great Grandad). I believe one of his traits in blue roans is the black legs - Bella definitely has them anyway :lol: :luv:
What do you mean by the back legs?
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Oska to has Bitcon Troubador as his Great Grandad on Dams side. So another relative here.
He also has Bitcon Moonlight, Bitcon Silver Rebel, Bitcon After Dark and Bitcon Blue Cascade also on Dams side. That does seem alot of the same gene pool although they are later GGG Grandparent.
Mistfall rang a bell too so looked at pedigree and Oska has Mistfall Medlar, GG Grandfather, Mistfall Mood Indigo GGG Grandmother. Can anyone tell me what colour these dogs were please.
Thanks.
sal/Oska
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He's Indies g grandad too :luv:
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Boy that dog sure got around!! I'm surprised the neighbours didn't talk :005:
He's Queen Bella's great-grandad (I think, or great-great Grandad). I believe one of his traits in blue roans is the black legs - Bella definitely has them anyway :lol: :luv:
What do you mean by the back legs?
I think Claire said 'black' legs not 'back' legs :005: :005:
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He's not in Elsie's pedigree :huh:.
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Bitcon Time Traveller is my Aidan's sire and was pet named Ross
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Boy that dog sure got around!! I'm surprised the neighbours didn't talk :005:
He's Queen Bella's great-grandad (I think, or great-great Grandad). I believe one of his traits in blue roans is the black legs - Bella definitely has them anyway :lol: :luv:
[/quote :005:
What do you mean by the back legs?
I think Claire said 'black' legs not 'back' legs :005: :005:
:005: oh of course she did. I must have been having one of those days, silly me :D
However, now you mention it, Boo has very dark front legs, darker than therest of his body - perhaps he got them from Bitcon!!
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just finding my way round site still and came across this thomas great great grandfather was also bitcon troubador ;)
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What a stunning dog, bet he had a permanet smile on his face :005:
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yeah he does how did u no ?? :005: someone even commented the other day that he looked like he was smiling :005:
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yeah he does how did u no ?? :005: someone even commented the other day that he looked like he was smiling :005:
No wonder with all those girlfriends :luv: :005:
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Think we're talking at cross purposes here ;) Troubador passed on to the big kennel in the sky several years ago now (he was a good age though).
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That dog definately had a bike! I was reading the mail (as a newbie) and went home to check Whistlers pedigree and yep Bitcon Troubador is his great grandad mated with Shenmore Starlet to produce Shenmore Sonnet , are the ones at the top of the pedigree sires? If so Shenmore starlet & Freshet Furbar produced Whistlers Dad Castanes Sonneteer.
Dams side Lynwater Isleman with Classicway Colinda produced Classicway moonraker at Rosbercon mated with True Elihu toproduce his Mum who is Swallowtail Blue moon.
Is this right?
Any realtives recognise these dogs.
Viv & Whistler
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Not quite right ;) We owned Shenmore Starlet and she produced Sonnet when mated to Troubador. Sonnet went to live at Castanea where she produced Castanea Sonneteer when mated to Freshet Fubar. Both Starlet and Sonnet are sadly no longer alive but they live on in their progeny :D
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And if I can say so beautifully, they are really healthy dogs. Whistler is one of 9, 7 dogs and 2 bitches and all really lovely. I suppose their is no simplistic way of explaining how a blue roan can be an ancestor of an orange roan, c : can anyone point me to a book?
I am finding all this fascinating stuff.
Viv
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Oska to has Bitcon Troubador as his Great Grandad on Dams side. So another relative here.
He also has Bitcon Moonlight, Bitcon Silver Rebel, Bitcon After Dark and Bitcon Blue Cascade also on Dams side. That does seem alot of the same gene pool although they are later GGG Grandparent.
Mistfall rang a bell too so looked at pedigree and Oska has Mistfall Medlar, GG Grandfather, Mistfall Mood Indigo GGG Grandmother. Can anyone tell me what colour these dogs were please.
Thanks.
sal/Oska
Whistler also has Bitcon moonlight, silver rebel, after dark at shadowlands, blue cascade and of course troubador. then a lot of Helleborus, thunderbug, tango rapsody, teandante, twice as nice,texas ranger,thunderspark and ch okell outward bound anyone know this line?
Viv
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Another website I discovered at the weekend. It lists British Champions and Show Champions 1948-2004, including colours.
http://www.aones.com/cockers/champions.htm
You will see that Mistfall Mood Indigo was a blue roan.
Good luck with your search.
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Troubador was Maddy's Great, Great Grandad too :D by the sounds of it perhaps about 90% of our dogs on here are related :005: that is one heck of a big family ;) just think of the Xmas card list :o
He sure was one busy very gorgeous dog looking at his picture.
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I bet he slept well!
Viv
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SH CH BITCON TROUBADOR is Baileys GRT GRT GRT grandad he as also got SH CH BITCON PACIFIC BLUE as well
BAILEY IS A CHOC ROAN ann :luv:
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So has Thomas got bitcon pacific blue ;) and bitcon moonlight memories anyone got photo of her ???????
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ETA: Photo removed while checking permission to use
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ooh thanks very much i'm doing a photo pedigree thats great when i no who else i need i'll be asking you all thanks again ;)
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Boof, have you got permission to post that photo? Sorry to sound nit-picking but unless that's your own photo taken by you, you need permission to post it, specially if it's taken from a website or a year book.
Thanks ;)
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hes also Bibas grt,grt grandfather busy boy :luv: and she has shenmore in her ped ,grandfather ,great grandma and grt grt grandma
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That dog definately had a bike! I was reading the mail (as a newbie) and went home to check Whistlers pedigree and yep Bitcon Troubador is his great grandad mated with Shenmore Starlet to produce Shenmore Sonnet , are the ones at the top of the pedigree sires? If so Shenmore starlet & Freshet Furbar produced Whistlers Dad Castanes Sonneteer.
Dams side Lynwater Isleman with Classicway Colinda produced Classicway moonraker at Rosbercon mated with True Elihu toproduce his Mum who is Swallowtail Blue moon.
Is this right?
Any realtives recognise these dogs.
Viv & Whistler
biba also has troubador and shenmore starlet as her grt,grt grandparents,shenmore seeing stars as her grt grandma and shenmore star voyager as her grandad,and also shenmore star voyager as her grt,grt grandad ,sire side :o
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And Thomas ;)
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Gosh this is exciting :005: :005: Here's Dave's Pedigree. Bitcon Troubador has managed to be his Great Great Grandfather twice :005: :005:, Dave's dad is Classicway Chinwag at Rosbercon but his mum has Shenmore and Troubador:
Hiawatha's Song (Dave) 25/05/07
(http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa99/hannahgilsenan/IMG_0637.jpg)
Dam:
Speechouse Reprint
D G'parents:
Shenmore Star Voyager & Speechouse Kalamazoo
D GG'parents:
Sh Ch Palacecraig Go West & Sh Ch Shenmore Seeing stars
Sh Ch Salabah San Raphael & Sh Ch Speechouse Sault Ste Marie
D GGG'parents
Glowhill Apollo Seven & Placecraig Be Fair
Sh Ch Bitcon Troubador & Chenmore Starlet
Sh Ch Bitcon Troubador & Sh Ch Salabal Santa Sophia
Sh Ch Dialynne Senator of Salabah
Speechhouse Sedona
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Yes so does Tom they are related no wonder Dave such a handsome chap ;)
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D GG'parents:
Sh Ch Palacecraig Go West & Shenmore Seeing stars
Sh Ch Salabah San Raphael & Sh Ch Speechouse Sault Ste Marie
You've missed off our Katie's title - Seeing Stars was also a Sh Ch :D I can see Dave's family resemblance now to Arran (Star Voyager). It's a small world ;)
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Oooh sorry Jane, you're right it's written with that on the pedigree - I'm just a bit dizzy after typing it all out! Will amend it. Would love to see some pics of Star Voyager if you have any?!
Hannah x
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Kali has Bitcon Troubador and Palacecraig go West :blink:
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I love the name dave :D One of my tutors at college has an indian runner duck called dave that he takes to the pub with him, gets his own pint too :005: :luv:
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'Dave the Duck' goes to the pup??? :rofl1: :rofl1: :rofl1:
I know a fantastic joke about a duck going to a pub... but think I'd better grow up and not post it on here :shades:
Dave the Duck....... heh heh
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well his mate daisy died and Andy my tutor got divorced around the same time and none of us would go to the pub with him during school hours so he took Dave :D :D :005: He just sits on his stall and slurps his beer its great :005: :005:
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Even in Norway you can find relatives... He is great grandfather to my Mazie. ;)
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he is Roxy's great Grandad!!!!
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He is molly`s great/great/great grandad. :blink: