Author Topic: working harness  (Read 8433 times)

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Offline ips

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working harness
« on: April 25, 2017, 04:10:01 PM »
Has anyone ever used a harness instead of a slip lead whilst working there dog. ??

Re - harness

Is there a similar product to the wydwl harness but a top attachment (must attach close to neck not halfway down the back and one that is as easy to put on with one fastening point without any need to put a leg through etc ????

This would probably be my ideal set up as long as it was available in brown or green 😉
Muddling along in the hope that one day it all makes sense.

Offline Londongirl

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Re: working harness
« Reply #1 on: April 25, 2017, 04:48:34 PM »
Have you looked at Perfect Fit harnesses? They come in three separate pieces so you can custom fit and get both front and back anchor points. On Henry the back ring is in the middle of his shoulder blades, just below the base of his neck, but maybe not has high as you would like.

They come in a huge variety of colours.

It takes three clicks to put on rather than one, but it doesn't go over the head or through the legs so you can get it on and off pretty quickly once you get the hang of it.
Rachael (me) and Henry (him)


Offline ips

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Re: working harness
« Reply #2 on: April 25, 2017, 05:09:23 PM »
Thanks LG but I need one click to put on.

Been browsing and what about ezydog quick fit that seems to fit the bill, anyone had one ?
Muddling along in the hope that one day it all makes sense.

Offline Helen

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Re: working harness
« Reply #3 on: April 25, 2017, 09:35:35 PM »
harnesses just encourage a dog to pull - I'd persevere with a slip lead  ;)
helen & jarvis x


Offline Helen

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Re: working harness
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2017, 09:36:20 PM »
have you tried a slip lead in a figure of 8?
helen & jarvis x


Offline ips

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Re: working harness
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2017, 09:51:40 PM »
harnesses just encourage a dog to pull - I'd persevere with a slip lead  ;)

Not convinced with that. I have tried a few and it made no difference either way.
Muddling along in the hope that one day it all makes sense.

Offline ips

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Re: working harness
« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2017, 09:53:08 PM »
have you tried a slip lead in a figure of 8?

Yes she goes mad though, hates it.
Muddling along in the hope that one day it all makes sense.

Offline Pearly

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Re: working harness
« Reply #7 on: April 26, 2017, 08:51:51 AM »
have you tried a slip lead in a figure of 8?

I'm with Helen on this - the figure of 8 worked with Coral.  Harness don't teach the dog anything.  It's a little like teaching bite inhibition; the dog needs to learn how much it can pull or not.....the figure of 8 should be loose enough they don't feel it but if Eze pulls she will find it uncomfortable immediately and drop back.  She won't like it but it does work  ;)

Offline ips

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Re: working harness
« Reply #8 on: April 26, 2017, 09:15:32 AM »
have you tried a slip lead in a figure of 8?

I'm with Helen on this - the figure of 8 worked with Coral.  Harness don't teach the dog anything.  It's a little like teaching bite inhibition; the dog needs to learn how much it can pull or not.....the figure of 8 should be loose enough they don't feel it but if Eze pulls she will find it uncomfortable immediately and drop back.  She won't like it but it does work  ;)

Yes it does work very well and on the occasions I have done it I have told myself that I will ignore her displeasure and that eventually she will get used to it BUT I am a big softie and I cant bear to see her so stressed.

I am in no doubt that a harness will not teach her anything however I believe they are a useful tool in order to ensure whilst you are "attempting" to train not pulling or heel work the dog is not doing itself any harm. Plus Imo if the dog is in discomfort ie pulling on a slip lead it will not be in a very good state of mind therefore less receptive to any command. Not saying I am right but that is how I read it with my dog.

Why do we default to putting a restraint around the neck ? Is it because that is what we have always done  ? Is there not a better way ?
My opinion is that a simple, lightweight harness that is easy to put on (one single buckle for instance) and the lead is part of it and high up the back close to the neck would be the very best option. I believe the whole lead thing is now outdated. The closest I have found to my requirements so far is a ezydog quick release but I am still open to offers.

Muddling along in the hope that one day it all makes sense.

Offline Helen

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Re: working harness
« Reply #9 on: April 26, 2017, 10:02:31 AM »
A slip lead is a perfect tool for when your dog is working. 

Training to walk to heal and walk on a lead are boring bits of gundog training but essential.  That's the better way IMHO to prevent pulling - if your dog walks to heal nicely it's not a "restraint around their neck".  My advice would be to go a gundog trainer and go back to basics.

I doubt that you will find anyone that works their dogs regularly that uses a harness instead of a slip.  I couldn't imagine dealing with getting a harness and lead off and on my dog - it all needs to be as seamless as possible.
helen & jarvis x


Offline ips

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Re: working harness
« Reply #10 on: April 26, 2017, 10:15:54 AM »
A slip lead is a perfect tool for when your dog is working. 

Training to walk to heal and walk on a lead are boring bits of gundog training but essential.  That's the better way IMHO to prevent pulling - if your dog walks to heal nicely it's not a "restraint around their neck".  My advice would be to go a gundog trainer and go back to basics.

I doubt that you will find anyone that works their dogs regularly that uses a harness instead of a slip.  I couldn't imagine dealing with getting a harness and lead off and on my dog - it all needs to be as seamless as possible.

Last bit is exactly my point. If there was such a harness that was easy to put on and lightweight etc then maybe we would have an alternative way of keeping our beating dogs at heel on those occasions that we al have to and the inevitable pulling that goes with the territory.

Gundog trainer is not an option for me. I have got this far on my own and I am quite happy with things plus I do not like formal training either group or one to one. I prefer to middle along on my own 😁 
Muddling along in the hope that one day it all makes sense.

Offline Emilyoliver

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Re: working harness
« Reply #11 on: April 26, 2017, 11:55:24 AM »
I think you either need to be absolutely consistent with your heelwork training and never ever allow any transgressions, and proof it while in the presence of birds - dogging in and on the shoot days - and still allow no transgressions - if you wish your dog to be impeccably behaved and never ever pull while on lead.  Rather than looking for a suitable harness to use while working your dog in case it pulls.  If you aren't as consistent as above (like me) then you just adapt to the situation and use a slip in figure of 8 (as suggested) to counteract the pulling.  My dog hates the figure of 8, but it does him no actual harm.  (you have all spring, summer and dogging in before shooting starts to put the work in and get the required result - if you're keen and determined enough  ;)  I've never been  :lol:.
Michelle, Emily and Ollie

Offline Murphys Law

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Re: working harness
« Reply #12 on: April 26, 2017, 12:16:08 PM »
A slip lead is a perfect tool for when your dog is working. 

Training to walk to heal and walk on a lead are boring bits of gundog training but essential.  That's the better way IMHO to prevent pulling - if your dog walks to heal nicely it's not a "restraint around their neck".  My advice would be to go a gundog trainer and go back to basics.

I doubt that you will find anyone that works their dogs regularly that uses a harness instead of a slip.  I couldn't imagine dealing with getting a harness and lead off and on my dog - it all needs to be as seamless as possible.

I took Millie to a reputable gun dog trainer. He said 'ill show you how to stop her pulling, easy'

He put a slip lead on her and as soon as she started to walk ahead, gave her a very sharp yank along with a growled 'HEEL'

I just haven't got the stomach to do this as Millie is incredibly sensitive. Maybe that is where I am going wrong.

Offline ips

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Re: working harness
« Reply #13 on: April 26, 2017, 12:51:37 PM »
I think you either need to be absolutely consistent with your heelwork training and never ever allow any transgressions, and proof it while in the presence of birds - dogging in and on the shoot days - and still allow no transgressions - if you wish your dog to be impeccably behaved and never ever pull while on lead.  Rather than looking for a suitable harness to use while working your dog in case it pulls.  If you aren't as consistent as above (like me) then you just adapt to the situation and use a slip in figure of 8 (as suggested) to counteract the pulling.  My dog hates the figure of 8, but it does him no actual harm.  (you have all spring, summer and dogging in before shooting starts to put the work in and get the required result - if you're keen and determined enough  ;)  I've never been  :lol:.

Cant argue with any of that and yes I am determined it is now my lifes ambition 😁
Dogging in this year is going to be used for steadines and heelwork, last year I used it primarily for stop to flush.

Inconsistency has been my downfall on many aspects, I am the first to admit it 👍

I have concluded in the last two days that she is better on a wide ish collar rather than a slip, this mornings walk was very very good. I will continue with the collar and try to proof it.
Muddling along in the hope that one day it all makes sense.

Offline ips

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Re: working harness
« Reply #14 on: April 26, 2017, 12:55:51 PM »
A slip lead is a perfect tool for when your dog is working. 

Training to walk to heal and walk on a lead are boring bits of gundog training but essential.  That's the better way IMHO to prevent pulling - if your dog walks to heal nicely it's not a "restraint around their neck".  My advice would be to go a gundog trainer and go back to basics.

I doubt that you will find anyone that works their dogs regularly that uses a harness instead of a slip.  I couldn't imagine dealing with getting a harness and lead off and on my dog - it all needs to be as seamless as possible.

I took Millie to a reputable gun dog trainer. He said 'ill show you how to stop her pulling, easy'

He put a slip lead on her and as soon as she started to walk ahead, gave her a very sharp yank along with a growled 'HEEL'

I just haven't got the stomach to do this as Millie is incredibly sensitive. Maybe that is where I am going wrong.

Don't worry I am going wrong with you my friend, I have witnessed some pretty full on lead yanks and scruffings, funny thing is the dogs still pulled the week after 😞 as far as I can tell that type of aversive merely escalates the level required next time.

Muddling along in the hope that one day it all makes sense.