At wits end with recall

[Samrennie]

Hi

We have a gorgeous 9 month old working cocker who I am having major problems with recall. She had recall as a young puppy and we used both a come command and a 210.5 whistle but over the past couple of months the recall has gone to zero. She is very good with commands in the house and will generally recall to the whistle in the house and garden, we play hide and seek with her and she also knows the basic normal commands of sit, stay, leave etc and has been working very hard on impulse control and a “look” command. Even the loose lead walking that I have been working on for a couple of months is starting to come along nicely.

Recall is just awful now though and I am tearing my hair out, I use a long line on all walks now and while she will sit when I change over from the short walking lead to the long training lead as soon as we start walking again she just charges off and tears about at the end of the lead no matter how short or long it is. If she doesn’t have the training lead on (or we drop the training lead) she will just disappear at 100 miles, occasionally crossing our path but generally we don’t know where she is or what she is up to. I feel like I have tried everything to get recall, high value treats (hot dog!) that is only used for recall, other treats, tennis balls, new expensive tug toys, books on recall and some 121 training (which we initially got to help with the loose lead walking but as that has improved her recall has reduced – we now can’t afford any more 121s) but nothing seems to work for more than about a day and once she has her nose on the ground/sees birds her focus has gone and she is not interested in anything I try to offer her. We try and only use the whistle to keep consistent with that.

Added complication is that my husband does not want to train her and is happy to have her off the lead charging about without recall, despite my attempts to get him to understand why it is so important and believes it is just down to her age and she will get better once she is a bit older. I don’t agree and think it is something that needs to be trained on each walk but unfortunately I can’t walk her every time she needs a walk.

Apologies for the long post but I would really appreciate any other tips or ideas as I fear i will have her on the long line for the rest of her life which i really don't want to do (I have seen the recall sticky post so that is another option I will give a go) or am I doing something completely wrong?

[bizzylizzy]

  First and most important, she‘s quite normal!! You‘re just patting yourself on the shoulder for having done such a brilliant job, your dog‘s hanging on your every word and you‘re wondering what the big deal is about training a dog and then WHAM, they hit puberty and everything you‘ve achieved so far seems to have flown out of the window!!  Good news is, they do come out the other end,  - eventually!    , but you do need to be consistent and continue with the training. The problem is, once they get used to tearing off and disappearing, the habit does start to set in and its more difficult to get under control again. Once their noses are in action, they go into their own little world and you just become invisible, - they‘re not ignoring you out of defiance -,(ok well they do that  sometimes too  ), you‘re just no longer on the radar.
I would personally put her back on the long line all of the time, at least for a few weeks. Praise her every time she looks at you or stops and turns to see where you are. Keep up the recall training with praise and special treats but try not to overdo the amount of times you recall her on in one session. When she does come, feed her a series of treats every few seconds so that she‘ll stay with you and not just grab the treat and tear off again.  You can do things while she‘s on the long line to keep her focused on you (sit, stay, sniffing games, - anything) just to reinforce that staying with you is actually quite fun as well.
You will get there, its a tough phase but the work you put in now will pay out a thousand fold for the future. Very best of luck!

[Barry H]

Excellent post above.  Good stuff.  Nothing much to add except that folks are almost always fooled when young puppies have a great 'recall' only to find it evaporating as they get older and confidence grows.  There are many threads on COL on this so a forum search will pay dividends.

1. If you haven't already, invest in a copy of 'Total Recall' by Pippa Mattinson
2. A good recall takes a long time to master (usually).  The key is to accept this and have infinite patience. 
3. Train husband to help!  You seriously and absolutely need to be singing from the same hymn-sheet, otherwise your chances of success will not be greater than zero.

[Emilyoliver]

Hi, this isn't uncommon - particularly with working type cockers.  In my opinion, the best way to overcome this would be to visit a spaniel (gundog) trainer, and learn how to teach your dog to hunt under control.  You may well not want to actually work your dog, but understanding its drives and motivators will be invaluable in terms of training.  If your dog is highly driven to hunt, no treat will ever be able to compete with birds and scent.  And as we move into shooting season, pretty much anywhere you walk in the countryside from now until February will be full of birds and scent.  I personally believe the best way to ensure your dog doesn't run off, is to teach it to hunt around you - under control.  That way it will be able to fulfill its instincts to hunt without self-entertaining.  Having it hunt around you, interspersed with retrieving games will keep its attention and encourage it to find its entertainment near and from you rather than wherever it chooses.  Yes, many dogs go through a teenage phase and misbehave, however believing that your dog will 'grow out of' hunting/ chasing if it has become a habitual behaviour is dangerous - particularly in a working strain dog.  Whatever you decide to do, i would suggest you keep her on a longline in any situations/locations where there may be bird/ scent/ rabbits/ anything she may chase/ hunt to prevent this becoming habitual behaviour - until you are confident she will stay close/ recall in any situation.  Work on your bond with her, and use walks for playing/ fun training so that the focus is on you, not her surroundings.  if you are at all interested in approaching a gundog trainer - message me and i may be able to suggest one in your area.  Gundog 121s usually aren't too expensive and aren't required weekly.  A good trainer will usually give you work to do at home, with fortnightly or monthly follow-up lessons.  Good luck.

[Samrennie]

Thank you very much for taking the time to reply, useful to know that, to an extent, I need time and patience and to keep her on the long line for the moment. I have no chance in training the husband though, I have tried and its just not worked, he is more stubborn than the dog! 

I had a better training session this morning in the park on the long line, mostly returned to the whistle and had fun playing chase (me running and her chasing me) and using the sit, stay and look commands, although I am almost certainly asking her to recall too much in one session, if I see it working then I just try and do more in the thinking that it will really drill it into her. There are a lot less distractions in the park though compared to out walking in the fields.

I would be interested in the gundog sessions, I will need to save a little money first but any trainers in Sussex that could be recommended I would be grateful. I don't want to work her but might give me a different way of doing things that would work better for her.

Many thanks again