Becoming a breeder

[karen488]

I know that these words raise hairs on the back of the neck but...
We got our 1st show cocker 10 yes ago. Relatively easily. KC Reg. neutered her.
Then Bingley. Again relatively easily..KC reg. (we lost him earlier this yr to cancer 😢)
Then our worker Austin. All neutered as I don’t advocate backyard breeding.
My parents expressed an interest in getting a puppy.What has happened to the puppy market? Can’t find a decent pedigreed puppy for love nor money! Non KC reg dogs going for stupid prices and cockapoos selling at pedigreee prices!
I do not need to make a profit.
I’m a stay at home mum whose babies are leaving for uni.
I’d like to buy a bitch specifically to breed from.
I’d like to research and do it properly.
I’d like to find a breeder who will support me becoming a breeder. Guide me to stud dogs suitable etc.
In short I’d like to become someone’s apprentice! I’m in Kent. Any advice?

[Emilyoliver]

Hi,
What strain are you planning to breed? And will the puppies be for the pet market or working/ both?

[karen488]

Show quality Pets. I only want to do it if I can do it properly. 

[Barry H]

Well, I say go for it.  Can offer no practical advice, but plenty of encouragement.  I daresay it will be hard work, but immensely rewarding.  If you think you can commit 100% then you may regret NOT doing it if/when you have the chance.  Every top breeder had to start with their first litter...

...and one thing is not in  doubt - the world needs more (responsibly bred) Cockers!

Wishing you every success.  And keep us updated on progress.  There must be lots of COL members who would love to do this but can't for one reason or another. 

[karen488]

Thanks Barry. Suspect the hardest part is going to be finding the right bitch. It's bad enough finding a standard pet!

[Emilyoliver]

Hi, sorry I don't know of any show breeders in the Kent area (only a few working ones who may have been able to help). 

Apologies of this is obvious, but just in case it isn't...  If I was planning to breed quality show type cockers, I'd be contacting the breed societies and getting in contact with breeders who actively show their dogs.  I think the only way you would be able to convince them to sell you a quality puppy (with the possibility of future removal of breeding endorsements) would be to show your dog.  And once it has been proven to be a good example of the breed and you have shown your commitment to bettering the breed, then they may agree to lift the endorsements and advise you on which lines/ stud to use.  My show type cockers were sold to me on that basis.  I didn't breed either of them, but the breeders were on hand to assist with grooming, showing and an agreement was in place that should I want to breed the bitch, I was to contact them in relation to lines that would be suitable and would complement my bitch.  It wouldn't be a quick process, and would involve a lot of commitment, but if you are serious about breeding quality cockers, then that is the way I would suggest you go about it.

[karen488]

I think you’re right. Unfortunately I don’t actually want to show. Endorsements these days are pointless these days when people can make more by breeding cockabloodypoos. But I do get where you are coming from.  I’m not in any rush. I’ll keep my eyes open and make some tentative enquiries.

[Jaysmumagain]

Wonder if this site will help http://www.thecockerspanielclub.co.uk/health.htm

It gives the breed standards and the health - was going to say requirements...maybe the wrong word.

I understand what you say about the endorsement point - but many true cocker spaniel breeder are really against mixed breeds too - in normal times I would say visit cocker shows and speak to breeders some are really friendly and might give advice.  Sadly not sure if they are going ahead.

[karen488]

Thanks jays mum. Am not a fan of cross breeds which is my point about endorsements. They prevent people breeding quality pedigree pups but don’t prevent mating with a poodle to make a buck. Seems counter intuitive to me.

[CMarten]

Hi, I'm new to this forum but not new to Cockers! I have an 8 yr old Orange Roan, and 2 yr old Black and Tan. I was in your situation 2 yrs ago wanting to get into breeding, well bred show Cockers. It took me a long time to find a breeder who was prepared to let me have a pup without endorsement. I did and have Flo. I have spent the last two years having her DNA tested, trained to platinum level obedience training, searching out the best stud dog I could find that suited my requirements to look for improvement in the litter. I can happily now say Flo is 5 weeks pregnant! Stick with it you have to really prove to breeders that you are not in it for the money and really want to add to the standard of the breed.

[karen488]

Ah. Thanks for your words of encouragement.

[phoenix]

Reading this post, no wonder I rarely see a ‘proper’ show type cocker.   Such a shame that protecting the type is actually reducing the breed, and increasing the crossbreed  market.
I’m not against cross breeds, I have two mongrels  of my own, though no spaniel blood.   A cockapoo   is a perfect family pet. I’m not sure the breeders all understand the breeding type intricacies.  They are reverting to poodle round here.

[Barry H]

Reading this post, no wonder I rarely see a ‘proper’ show type cocker.   Such a shame that protecting the type is actually reducing the breed, and increasing the crossbreed  market.
...

In the five years I've had Jack, I've only ever seen one other proper show type 'in the wild' - and that was in Blackpool on the prom!  I couldn't get enough of her, but Jack turned his nose up - sorry babe, you're not my type...  I think he's in for a very long wait!  See plenty of springers, working cockers, cockerpoos and the occasional King Charles.

I find the preference for cockerpoos to be baffling.  There can be no more beautiful sight than a well-groomed show type Cocker. 

Anyway, I'm sure everyone on COL is doing their best of to spread the lurve.  I know I am 

[theshrew]

TBH i don't really know a great deal about the KC other than 12.5 years ago it was advised to buy a pup from a KC breeder, i don't know anything about breeding nor am i interested in showing.

Missy did come from a KC breeder, yet she only has 3 toes on her front feet  her 4th is just a little stump. I never even thought about checking this when i got her, i don't care and nor does she tbh it just means i have to cut her nail every 4 - 6 weeks.

My parents bought a standard Poodle in with the intention to show him maybe 10 years ago, He was a pup of a Crufts champion. Although a really great dog he had  Addisons disease which i believe is hereditary, Yet the breeder kept on breeding from the dog despite my parents protests. I haven't got a clue what it cost them in vet bills but i'ts in the multiple 10's of thousand's.

Whats the point ?

[davidbird]

...
I did and have Flo. I have spent the last two years having her ... trained to platinum level obedience training, ...

Hi and welcome to the forum, I'm fairly new here myself, but we were owned by a beautiful Black and Tan girl who sadly is no longer with us.
I've not told my wife yet, but I have such a cocker-shaped hole at the moment that I am seriously needing another dog.

I'm aware of the KC Bronze/Silver/Gold Good Citizen training programme that our local Canine Club is (pandemic permitting) able to deliver.

Is the "Platinum Level Obedience" a recognised award?  If so, who administers and deliveres it?

Thanks
PS I've sent you a PM on another topic...

Edit:  So a Google search for "Platinum Obedience" comes up with a few results... why did I not try that before?  It seems to be a "next level" up from the KC GCDS Bronze/Silver/Gold awards, provided by specialist dog trainers.  Is that correct?