what to look for in a gun dog trainer and when to start

[ginnygirl]

Hi all just wondered if someone can give some advice about trainers and what to look for.

I'd like to try some training with Bella. I dont want to go hunting for live things but thought some training would be good for her. She has started taking a big interest in birds when we are out. She is 9 months and previously showed no interest at all. Her recall has taken a dip so I am keeping her on an extended lead when near the ducks on our walks. She has taken to running off in undergrowth and only returns when she feels like it if she has the scent of something. last week she returned with feathers and bits of bird stuck in her lips; not sure if she caught it or found it or what type of bird it was, hence the extended lead. I am going to try to improve her recall with a whistle ( I have read a thread by mark from top barks). Also she 'yaps' and whines at birds in trees and bushes and it is pretty much impossible to get her to come to me when she is doing this. I suppose I wonder will her recall and the fact that she is noisy when she finds birds hinder her being accepted on a training course, also I no absolutely nothing about working with dogs on hunts or beating and what it actually entails. Where do I start? I'm interested in anything that will be good for channeling her natural behaviour. Just to add when I'm out I call her back to me regurlarly and treat her before letting her go again so that she understands that recall is not the end of her fun. Think I am going to experiment with what I treat her with so that she is enthusiastic about her reward as she is turning her nose up with our usual treats. Hope I havent waffled too much here.

[Wendy G]

You could try looking for a Gundog training course near you. They usually start after the shooting season has ended.
If your dog only yips on live game you should be O.K as only dummies are used at training classes.

[mooching]

Might help to take a look here:

http://www.thegundogclub.co.uk/

[lindseyp]

feel for you Ginny Girl - having exactly the same problem with Livie at the mo 
I too have gone down the gundog training route & have enrolled her into two clubs local to my area - Have explained our problem to both & each have slightly different opinions, so we'll try both & see if either will be good for Livie (& me  )  I know each trainer has their own methods but I'm going to trust my judgement on whether I like their teachings used & go from there.
I'm no expert but as far as the noisiness goes, if you are only doing for the fun & enjoyment side &  to get a better relationship with Bella then I would of thought it not a problem but if you wanted to go on & take it more seriously then maybe it would be  - perhaps, when she learns what she can/should be doing, the little noises will stop ....we can but live in hope eh? 
Good luck finding somewhere - Manda's (mooching) link is a good place to start. I went on recommendation &  searching for one - maybe someone will come along soon, with knowledge of a Trainer in your area - let us know how you get on though 

[vixen]

  Think I am going to experiment with what I treat her with so that she is enthusiastic about her reward as she is turning her nose up with our usual treats.

It might help to get a more reliable recall if she has a very high value treat that she only ever gets when she returns quickly. 
I followed the whistle recall training advice by Top Barks and my girls only ever get pilchard cake on a whistle recall. I call them back to me often on my walks and they are rewarded by fuss or other treats. The pilchard cake is reserved just for a whistle recall.
My girls return very promptly when they hear the whistle as they know it means a great treat.  It does help that my girls are very greedy. 
There is a recipe for pilchard/tuna/liver cake on COL 

[ginnygirl]

Thanks everyone for your reply's. I really just want the training to help build the bond with Bella and I and enable her to channel her energy into something she is naturally meant to do. I suppose i dont want to join a group that is too serious as I want it to be fun and enjoyable. Ive had a look on the Gun dog website; I am going to ring when their phone lines are open on Monday as I would like to talk to someone before booking to make sure I'm choosing the right course. I am looking at the starter packs for the equipment and book on the site too and maybe will start training with her whilst waiting to access a club.

[Sarah1985]

Be careful when searching for a trainer. I found alot of them use harsh old fashion methods, that just arent necessary IMO. Look for a class where both the dogs and handlers are having fun.

In my case I found a lady local who I like and doesnt use any sort of physical punishment but does use stearn voices and encourages us to do the same (and lots of positive noises when they do well). Clover is ok with this and its actually improved her behaviour but Ive had to stop taking Dexter as his recall went downhill as a result of her methods. I now go with CLover learn the exercises and teach them to Dexter privately with lots of rewards and encouragement and treating any mistakes hes made as no big deal (which he really seems to need).

SO my advice is to trust your insticts, dog training isnt regualated so if you dont think something is right or that its working for you stop going.

 If you used a dog trainer for puppy classes that you liked its worth having a chat with them to see if they can recommend anyone specifically for gun dog work. Very often they will have contacts for you to try.

[Petepreston]

I've been muttering about this for weeks now. Posie is a working Cocker too and she has already shown signs of natural inclination to the working traits. She is from a Field Champion pedigree and directly from currently working dogs 2 or 3 generations back, so not too surprising really.

I did some online research and found The Gundog Club too. This was the bit that got me interested: http://www.thegundogclub.co.uk/Training/courses/index.html

I haven't done anything more about it yet and I think I've just missed the start of their current course. It's not cheap but it is more geared towards family/pet working dog breeds so might be more suitable for our needs. I have no intention of hunting with her either.

[hanandhen]

Mwahahahahaaaa, no intention of working, yes I used to say that as well

The only criticisms of the Gundog Club courses that I have heard are that they are time limited and working to an exam, so you can feel a bit pressurised to move things on as opposed to letting the dog set the pace, and that they are possibly a bit sterile as game is not really introduced.

Personally I went down the route of 1-2-1 lessons with a trainer, this also had its drawbacks as Henry didn't get used to working with the distraction of other dogs around. But we were able to concentrate on what we needed rather than on what an exam syllabus said. The trainer I picked was recommended to me on here, she believes in clicker training, learning through play and positive methods. If you post your general area on here you may be able to get a similar recommendation.

[Petepreston]

The Gundog Club doesn't seem to be very active. I missed the first week of the only basic course in my area (for over a hundred miles in fact) and then found out that today was the second week. Doh! When I went to the websit just now to look for more courses I had to go to the FAQ to see what they were saying about upcoming dates. It tells you that all the dates are on the website and that the website is the most up to date information. It hasn't been udated since October 2010 so not really much help. For my perspective as a customer, that is a bad sign of how an organisation works, especially one that is making profit and taking my money.

I'm fortunate that we are very close to lots of working farms and shoots so I should be able to track down somebody to help.

[riotous_uk]

I too have gone the way of 1-2-1 lessons and am lucky that my trainer is very positive. The dogs love it, as I do and I'm never asked to do anything to my dogs that I'm not happy with.

we are working our way through the dgundog club tests and we just arrange group tests wehn there are enough of us ready. I'd like to do the working certificate at some point, and hopefully get myself rganised to find some beating this year.

I love watching the dogs do what they were bred to do....

[maddy74]

Lots of info. When I get my pup if I start her on clicker training and then start gundog training will this confuse her or will she understand what it what? Was going to start with puppy school and move on to gundog. A lady in our area does gundog training and has emailed me to say the skills for that can start almost straight away on a low level getting used to the whistle. Any advice, I am blinded by science....

[Sarah1985]

Lots of info. When I get my pup if I start her on clicker training and then start gundog training will this confuse her or will she understand what it what? Was going to start with puppy school and move on to gundog. A lady in our area does gundog training and has emailed me to say the skills for that can start almost straight away on a low level getting used to the whistle. Any advice, I am blinded by science....

Gun dog training and clicker training dont need to be mutually exclusive.

Clicker training can be very useful in gun dog work althou not many of the instructors use this method. Clickers allow you to reward at a distance and to pin point the exact behaviour you want which makes it an ideal tool if you want to use it.

At puppy school they will teach you things like sit and recall with verbal ques and hand signals but once they are sitting to the hand signal que you can easierly apply the whistle. I use my sit hand signal whilest blowing the whistle to first introduce the noise and if they get stuck or if Im asking for a particularly difficult sit (such as over a long distance or with high destractions) I will often give the hand signal as well to ensure they dont misunderstand.

Its up to you really as to how you want to approach it. Ive dabbled in lots of different doggy activities and for the most part nothing conflicts. If it does I apply a different word so that my dog can learn the difference and knows what I expect.

[maddy74]

Hi sarah, thank you for that, its really helpful. 

[Petepreston]

Most references I've read talk about gundog training only starting at 6 months minimum, so you should have lots of time to get the basic obedience going. We dropped out of the puppy classes after one session, initially because of illness but then because she was doing so well without them (those of you who read my posts about the class I went to will be interested to hear that I met several other owners who had the same impression as I did).

Posie is now 8 months old and I think I'm going to have to get one to one training as I've missed the Gundog Club course start and there is no sign of another one starting anytime soon (or of them updating their website this year). Hopefully I can find somebody through my brother's shooting friends.