Boosters how safe?????

[english.springer]

This is apost that was sent to me recently.

Any views on this would be great as mine are due for boosters very soon.

"Last October my dog received an annual booster vaccination and within days developed an autoimmune response. The booster had overloaded her immune system and that same immune system then attacked her own tissues.

She was put on a MASSIVE dose of immunosuppressants and now, almost three months on, is still receiving immunosuppressant treatment. I won't go into just how ill she was, or the symptoms, but the vet is amazed that she's survived.

As a result, I went looking on the net for information on vaccinations and found plenty. Typically, there was more information against the presently accepted annual schedule than for it.

It seems the annual schedule was established when drug companies promoted the concept amongst US vets in the early 80's. Unfortunately, mainly for profit reasons, but also because of poorer quality vaccines in the US than in EU.

How often do we humans need "booster" vaccinations for smallpox, TB etc? Why do dogs need them annually?

Much depends on whether a modified live virus (MLV) or killed virus is used for vaccination. In the case of parvo, if MLV is used, the school of thought seems to be a re-vac. every 3 years, while it is reckoned that a killed virus gives less than a year's protection. This article is just one of the many and is from a non-US source.

It seems that re-vaccination of dogs is yet another lottery, fraught with risks and complicated by profiteering. I've read dozens of articles and still haven't reached any firm conclusions, but I've another 9 months to go before having to make a decision. If my dog survives until then, and I do go for another re-vac, then it won't be another "all-in combination" vac, which overloaded her immune system last time. I will be looking for separate vaccines, administered around three weeks apart. Shades of MMR?"

What do you think? Any one had an experience like this or know some one who has.

Thanks in advance                    

[PennyB]

This is something I've recently had a chat with my vet about as I'm worried about Wilf and his recent cancer. Mine suggests vaccinating next year (which will be Wilf's 1st lot of boosters) and then vaccinating every other year, or titering for parvo antibodies and only vaccinating for lepto.                    

[Kim]

I too have recently had this conversation with my vet.
I was reluctant to boost mine every year, having seen a Cocker with Auto-immune, but since moving to the country & having to cope with rats, squirrels, mice etc I have had to re - think.
Although my vet doesn't like it much, we have agreed to boost every other year & just give the Lepto annually.                    

[Sheryl]

Speaking as an owner with a dog who has coped with auto immune disease for 5 years now I still would not advocate missing vaccinations out until I was absolutely sure that it was safe to do so.  I get my other dog Holly vaccinated every year, despite the fact that I am almost certain Chloes' illness was vaccination related.  The problem is that the alternative is horrendous and I am not prepared to risk Holly dying with a disease she has every chance of catching by not vaccinating her in case she gets a disease which is (although on the increase), still relatively rare.  Of course the ideal solution would be that we have an alternative which we know for sure to be safe but we haven't.  All you can do is read what you can and make an informed choice.                    

[Sheryl]

Just as a matter of interest, AIHA need not be the death sentence that it is purported to be.  I can't deny that we have had some real tough times with Chloe but she has managed 5 years now with this disease.  It is expensive yes, she needs constant watching yes but she remains a little livewire.  She has a zest for life which would fear you and she is happy and pain free which is all I can ask.  I know the drugs she is on to keep her well will eventually take their toll but she is now 7 years old and to me, that is nothing short of a miracle.                    

[Dessie]

I'm lucky my Vet doesn't like to give Cockers yearly boosters as he has had quite a few cases of Auto Immune.  We have agreed to do boosters every 15-18 months.                    

[Sheryl]

I think where you are located also plays a big part in the vaccination issue.  When I lived in my cottage, letting my girls roam around my ground and taking them for walks where very few other dogs had been, I would have been far less likely to worry over Hollys' yearly boosters.  Now I am in a small town where there are many inconsiderate owners who don't clean up after their dogs (and lets face it, these are also the owners who probably don't get their dogs immunised :x ) so it is far more dangerous to leave her unprotected.  My vet also has had more cases of auto immune disease but it begs the question... If yearly boosters have always been the same, why should there suddenly be an increase in auto immune cases?  When Chloe first started with this disease, there was another culprit to be considered and that was genetic predisposition.  I have read articles about AIHA until I have had my head spinning but nowhere seems to have proof positive that one thing is definitely the cause.                      

[carol]

Dessie, I have been giving this subject some thought, and was interested to know that you leave a bigger gap between vaccinations.  I was wondering though whether this can affect your insurance, and how you get around that, also I know Kennels require up to date certificates, have you had any problems or can you explain that your dog has them every 16months?

I'm very worried about this whole vaccination issue, and feel there's no real independant advice out there  :?                    

[LindaW]

The following is taken from notes written by Dr W Jean Dodds DVM -

Veterinary vaccinologists have recommended new protocols for dogs and cats. These include 1) giving the puppy or kitten vaccine series followed by a booster at one year of age. 2) administering further boosters in a combination vaccine every 3 years or as split components alternating every other year until 3) the pet reaches geriatric age, at which time booster vaccination is likely to be unnecessary and may be unadvisable for those with aging or immunologic disorders.

In the intervening years between booster vaccinations, and in the case of geriatric pets, circulating humoral immunity can be evaluated by measuring serum vaccine antibody titers as an indication of the presence of "immune memory".  This latter phrase is perhaps more correct than "protective immunity", because protection against disease means survival after challenge with the infectious agent and may not correlate with the serum antibody titer.  Titers do not distinguish between immunity generated by vaccination or exposure to the disease, although the magnitude of immunity produced by vaccination is usually lower.  Except where vaccination is required by law, animals that previously experienced an adverse reaction to vaccination or are at genetic or physiological risk for such reactions also can have serum anitbody titers measured annually until some future date.  Rechecking antibody titers can be performed thereafter, or can be offered as an alternative to pet owners who prefer not to follow the conventional practice of annual or seminannual vaccination.  Reliable serologic vaccine titering is now available from several university and commercial laboratories and the cost is reasonable.                    

[Dessie]

Dessie, I have been giving this subject some thought, and was interested to know that you leave a bigger gap between vaccinations.  I was wondering though whether this can affect your insurance, and how you get around that, also I know Kennels require up to date certificates, have you had any problems or can you explain that your dog has them every 16months?

I'm very worried about this whole vaccination issue, and feel there's no real independant advice out there  :?

Hi Carol

I always do the first booster when pup reaches 1 year old.  But then afterwards I've been lucky and have left mine go a good 16 months, it does help a great deal if the Vet is of the same opinion though which mine thankfully is.

One Kennel insists that vaccines are up-to-date but the other doesn't, they only insist that if Kennel Cough is around you vacinate against that.

The other way around it is to have blood tests done which will tell whether there is vaccine in the dogs system.  I believe this is done quite a lot in the US where they do not booster every 12 months.

Jane is a fountain of knowledge on all this so hopefully she might join in on this thread.

HTH                    

[Anita]

This has reminded me - our vet hasn't sent me a reminder for Phoebe's booster. Hubby checked before Christmas and they said February and I've been meaning to check.

If our vet routinely leaves 16 months between how does this affect insurance and putting them in kennels??

Its very interesting this debate about vaccinations - yet another issue to consider.                    

[PennyB]

With insurance I think you just wouldn't be covered for those illnesses the vaccines protect against.                    

[Michele]

Although my vet doesn't like it much, we have agreed to boost every other year & just give the Lepto annually.

Same here with mine. I had/have my concerns about vaccinating year after year, but as already mentioned the alternative could be horrendous.                    

[Sheryl]

I think the test mentioned is the Titers test but I have just read about this on www.caberfeidh.com/Titers.htm
 The text reads as follows:- 'A Titers test does not and cannot measure immunity because immunity to specific viruses is reliant not on antibodies but on memory cells which we have no way to measure.  Memory cells are what prompt the immune system to create antibodies and dispatch them to an infection caused by the virus it 'remembers'.'
  I find this interesting as Titers is one of the things I considered for both my girls and I only found this information out this evening. :?