Considering breeding

[LynneB]

Sorry don't want to be rude.   Read  your post and I think words fail me.

I have just caught up with this thread and although I haven't a clue about breeding (and so happily leave it to those who do), this thread has made me cross

I do have a clue and I'm livid.

[lindseyp]

Hi Pippa 
 I understand your way of thinking & did very similar to what you are thinking 4 years ago but my advice would be to do your homework properly , get as much advice as you can, get to know other more experienced breeders but even then, concider very carefully your reasons for breeding from your bitch.
Please meet my Tinker...

She was one of the pups from the litter I bred from my bitch Purdey. She isn't a cross breed but pure bred with a pretty good pedigree. I did all my homework & had the advice & support of long standing breeders. Despite the possibly problems during pregnancy, whelp & with the litter when they are born (still birth, bitch needing Cesarean, cleft palates, hermaphrodites, incomplete anus& more) we decided to go ahead & have a litter in the hope we would have an orange roan girl to keep & show. In the litter of 9, we did indeed have an orange/white bitch, who we have also kept called Livie & a lovely girl she is too 
However Tinker & one of her litter brothers were born with microphthalmia - a condition where the eyes don't develop properly & Tinker had the most severe from of it    She is blind but also had an elongated soft palate, nasal deformities & has horrendous trouble breathing at times. In December last year she went to the vets to have one eye removed (when I say eye- it wasn't an eye as you imagine but just a red mass) the palate on the roof of her mouth adjusted & spayed at the same time. None of Tinkers treatment is covered under insurance as she born with it (existing conditions) & the OP cost nearly £1000.
She is a beautiful awesome little character & I can't regret for a moment what I did & chose not to have her PTS as was offered BUT there are conditions & situations that you nor I have any control over & is always a possibility when breeding. You need to be aware & prepared for so many eventualities -  it really isn't something to do on a whim or because you think 'it would be nice to do'.
Peoples opinions on the forum are strong but for all the right reasons, with the welfare & wellbeing of the breed as paramount  - please don't be angry or upset if opinions aren't what you wanted to hear - it is a emotive subject & one thats is important for you to listen & learn from, if you should choose to continue down the breeding route 
best wishes
Lindsey x
   

[ElaineH]

I'm not a breeder, never wanted to be and cannot for the life of me fathom why someone who has a purebred cocker and has joined a forum specifically designed with the care and welfare of that breed in mind, should openly come on here and ask advice about crossbreeding their bitch at some point in the future   (I believe she is about 3-4 months old at the moment)

Monsterspaniel, you come across not just as naive but immature too. You say you are taking the advice given on board yet your replies do not really bear this out. You balked at paying the inflated advertised price of a crossbreed and settled for a cocker spaniel, was she second best? How much say do you actually have in her future anyway? From some of your posts I assume that you live at home, Mum is paying the insurance premiums and your Dad liked the looks of a cocker and had previous experience with the breed. What are your parents' attitude to some future breeding? Who would be doing the caring, cleaning and decision-making while you're out at work or college?

I find the reference to the expensive of having a dog somewhat worrying as though you're trying to recoup some of the costs by planning to breed from her and make a few £s from people who are happy to have a crossbreed from a novice breeder. You are vague about what health tests the parents of your girl has had, without that information you would be risking a health time-bomb by breeding from her. Please do not do this!

[Cayley]

You've owned a cocker pup for a few weeks and already you are thinking of breeding her to another breed, you haven't even got enough in depth knowledge to breed quality cockers.

With our most recent litter we started off with a c section, we had 7 puppies and lost 1 on day two to fading puppy syndrome. We spent the next 4 weeks hand rearing 2 puppies every 2 hours day and night only to lose them both. The emotional cost is far higher than the monetary cost in some cases!.

[seaangler]

Monsterspaniel....

I am not saying a word.....

[Helen]

Monsterspaniel....

I am not saying a word.....

you just did Chris, 7 of them  

I actually don't think you do agree, but are just continuing on your mission to try and antagonize people today.   The only person you're winding up is yourself  

[Danni and Freya]

Monsterspaniel....

I am not saying a word.....

you just did Chris, 6 of them 

I actually don't think you do agree, but are just continuing on your mission to try and antagonize people today.   The only person you're winding up is yourself 

[bluegirl]

Let me get this right, you really wanted a cocker / poodle crossbreed but they were being sold at a higher price than the cockers so you thought you'd go for a cocker instead because that was half of the cross of the dog you really wanted. Now you think you have found a niche in the market for selling crossbreeds at a more reasonable price so you think you'll have a go. But you aren't driven by money that's why you'd sell them cheaper but you may have more demand for them than you think so off you go again and before you know it a proportion of your pups are in rescue centres.

Before you have a little go just have another little look at your girl, take off your rose coloured specs and ask yourself if its in her best interest for you to do this, think about the DNA tests and hip scoring tests both her and her partner should have, think about whether you are still prepared to do this knowing you may lose your bitch at any part during the pregnancy, whelping or post partum period. Think about your responsibility to those cross breeds you'd be expecting, the homes you'll be sending them to and if the answer is still I want to do it then whilst you are waiting for her to mature do as much research as possible for the sake of your little girl, because she'll be relying on you but will she be able to count on you?

[Eve]

As a former breeder of golden retrievers, can I please ask you to think again. One of my litters was a C section on boxing day in the middle of the night - cost, out of hours, bank holiday and the very expensive cost of the operation - result considerable financial loss but as I hadn't bred to make money, the health of my girl and her puppies was the most important consideration.

If you purchased your bitch from a reputable breeder then they would have been sure to put endorsements on her pedigree. If they didn't bother then it is not likely they did any in depth health checks. Similarly any good poodle stud dog owner would not allow their dog to be used in this way, so the chances are you will be using a dog with no health checks.

PS Have you run this by your long suffering parents as has already been said - the choice to mate a dog is the owners and not a 'life threating illness' so none of the cost can be obtained from health insurance.

By getting your puppy in the first place, I am assuming you are a kind caring person, please think very seriously about this.

[mark1]

I think personally you have had some really really good advice, particularly from Lindsey, Bluegirl and Eve and if that was me I would read those posts over a few times. People haven't commented to spoil your day but just with a genuine concern for your dog and future pups. If you read this thread and ignore the advice I'm sorry but you are very silly.

[8 Hairy Feet]

I was going to keep out of this but I can't resist adding my opinion.
Ellie and Pepper and another cocker spaniel were bought from "pet shops" and my research informs me they originated from puppy farms in Wales. The "gentleman"
that bought them wanted them to breed and make money(the other cocker was a boy) The whole idea was abhorent to me that someone could be so thoughtless and cruel and look now it's me picking up the pieces and the expense of his stupid idea.
You seem to have some strange ideas Monsterspaniel, please don't think I'm having a pop at you but your words fill me with dread................

[Helen]

I think personally you have had some really really good advice, particularly from Lindsey, Bluegirl and Eve and if that was me I would read those posts over a few times. People haven't commented to spoil your day but just with a genuine concern for your dog and future pups. If you read this thread and ignore the advice I'm sorry but you are very silly.

Absolutely  

[seaangler]

Monsterspaniel....

I am not saying a word.....

you just did Chris, 7 of them  

I actually don't think you do agree, but are just continuing on your mission to try and antagonize people today.   The only person you're winding up is yourself  

Just contemplating....

[Pudding]

Just out of interest can anyone tell me what the heath test are that you need to have done
not the abbreviations please. and how much dose it cost to have them done
and both parents have to have them right... what about the pups do you have to get them
tested as well.... if this was me i would wait until i was in a position fanatically.. just in case
something goes wrong... and that i was a lot more informed... and that i was at home all day
throught the pregnancy and for the time it takes until they are ready to find they homes
i don’t think this is the walk in the park you think it is... i take it you are still at home with Mum and Dad... do you have room in your house for the pups... if you make the price of your pups cheap
then people don’t have to think long and hard about what they are getting into..
sorry but i do think you are very naive at the moment...   

[LynneB]

Progressive Retinal Atrophy is PRA, it is an eye condition that will lead to blindness.
Familial Nephropathy is FN, it leads to chronic kidney failure between the ages of 6mnth to 2 years.
Both these diseases are hereditry so it is imperative to test both dogs prior to mating.