CockersOnline Forum
Cocker Specific Discussion => Health => Topic started by: noelleybelley on May 27, 2010, 08:12:00 PM
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Hello, I'm after some advice please.
Milly, who is 10, has always had a heart murmur and last October, it was 3/6. I took her back to the vets two weeks ago because she's started losing control of her back end and keeps falling over, for no apparent reason. She also has strange 'shaky' fits, where her head sort of wobbles for about 15 seconds. The vet says she now has a 5/6 heart murmur and has put her on tablets. She's been on them for the two weeks now and is going back tomorrow. The thing is, they don't seem to have changed the falling over/ wobbling thing. I'm not sure if these are caused by the heart murmur, but he did mention 'heart faint'. She's also getting very skinny.
Can anyone explain this and do you think it is to do with the murmur, or is there something else going on? She fell down the stairs in the night and I'm worrying about her because I never heard a thing, it was my daughter who told me.
Thanks,
Noelle
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Hi, not sure if this is any help but my mum and dads old yorkie pepi use to do the shaky judder thing you are discribing, he also had a heart murmur, hed be walking along stop and start juddery shaking for a bit this would stop then he would carry on as normal, walking a bit funny to start with...we put this down to his eye sight as he couldnt see very well at this point. It usually happened if someone walked past him or when he was close to things.
Have you considered her eyes atall?
I remember one night Pepi had been out in the garden and hadnt returned as usual, my mum went out to find him standing in the pond poor we might. Hope you get things sorted
Nic & Holly
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It may be "heart faint" as the vet said, if the blood supply to the brain is not good it can cause those types of episodes. Definitely mention it to th vet tomorrow
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Poor Milly :'( ...sending gentle cuddles and hope the vet can help x
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As others have said heart problems can cause the back legs to go, but whether there are other things going on aswell it would be hard to tell unless your vet did a physical examination and maybe took some routine blood samples from her.
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I just read the bit about Milly falling down the stairs and wanted to send her a :-*
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:-\ Thanks for your replies everyone. The vet has put her on steroids now, as well as the heart tablets. He's not sure why she's having these 'episodes', but is pretty sure she's not epileptic, because it happens too frequently. Have to take her back in another two weeks.
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Just an update :D
Milly has been on the heart pills and steroids for a few weeks now. She still has the wobbly fits and they seem to be getting worse this week. Maybe the vet will increase the dosage?
Whilst I was in the vets last week, she was doing her normal busy thing (which is non-stop) and he said,
"In the words of my mother, I'd rather ha'e her for a week than a fortnight!" (In a very Scottish accent :005: )
I love this, because it's sooooo fitting for her.
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Hello again - another question for you.
Milly has been on the heart pills and steroids, (half of each per day), and this last week she seems to be doing the staggering / falling over thing more. We have an appt with the vet on Monday, but am just wondering if he's going to up the dose, or decide maybe it's not the heart faint thing. He has mentioned that there might be something neurological going on. Tonight she's really quite wobbly, poor thing :-\
Is half a tablet of each quite a low dosage? I'm guessing it is, because she's on half rather than whole tablets?
Any idea anyone?
Thanks :016:
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Poor Milly :-\ I hope you can get to the bottom of this. Your vet may well want to look into neurological issues.
Is half a tablet of each quite a low dosage? I'm guessing it is, because she's on half rather than whole tablets?
The only way to know if a dosage is high or low is to look at the milligrams given. Both meds come in different strengths, so yes, half a tablet is half strength, but it could still be more than another full tablet of a lower strength IYSWIM. So just because you are giving half it does not necessarily mean you are giving a low dose.
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Well Milly is going downhill quite fast now, she used to weigh 17kg and is now only 10.5kg :016:
The vet says her heart is failing, she has an enlarged liver and the mammary tumour is getting bigger. She is still eating, drinking and staggering around. It takes her ages to get up the stairs whereas she used to skip up them a few months ago.... :luv:
What I'm wondering is whether she's in any pain? How would I know?
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I'm so sorry to read this thread and see that Milly is getting worse. It must be so heartbreaking to see. I can't give any advice, but wanted to send you some hugs. :bigarmhug:
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Oh i am so sorry to read this :'( poor Milly & you. :'(
Sorry i don't know the answer to your question, although i do think i would speak to the vet about it. :-\
Thinking of you & Milly. :bigarmhug:
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Really sorry to read this :'( big hugs to Milly and you :bigarmhug:
As Ninasmum said, you probably need to talk to your vet, but you're the one who knows Milly best so think about the quality of life that she has and if she's still happy despite her disabilities.
Thinking of you both :luv:
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I've only just seen this thread - sorry to hear about Milly :'(
My old dog had these staggering episodes - he wasn't permanently staggery though, they would only last about 10 minutes or so at a time and the vet said it was due to his liver. I know you said she has an enlarged liver but have bloods been taken to assess organ function?
I would definitely speak to your vet again regarding her condition. Like Elaine says, it boils down to what quality of life you think she has. If she's still eating, drinking & seems happy enough, then it might be an option to try her on anti-inflammatories - my friends bitch was on them when her mammary tumour started to cause her a bit of pain. Dogs can mask their pain quite well so it can be hard to tell just how affected they are - a couple days of painkillers can be enough to see if that is the case.
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My heart is aching for you and Milly. :'( :'( I had to make the same decision in March, with virtually the same medical condition and for my own lovely little Millie. Sometimes co-incidence is just unbearably painful. I chose to send her to sleep before the pain had a chance to start because I knew it was coming and the vet couldn't guarantee we'd know when it was getting a hold. I couldn't bear to keep her alive just for my sake. But that was just for us - not for everyone. If I had been certain that the vet could keep the pain and distress at bay, I would have seized those few precious days or weeks with both hands. I think you will know when her unhappiness begins to outweigh the good things. I am so very, very sad and sorry for you both and the horrible decision you have to make.
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I'm so sorry to read this thread and see that Milly is getting worse. It must be so heartbreaking to see. I can't give any advice, but wanted to send you some hugs. :bigarmhug:
From me too :bigarmhug:
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Just to say I am thinking of you and Milly :bigarmhug:
Speak at length with your vet. Ask loads of questions so you can get a clear picture of Milly's current conditions, and what the future holds regarding quality of life.
It's so difficult when we see our cockers poorly, but having a complete understanding helps us to do all we can to ensure we are doing the best for them.
Keep us updated and remember we are all here for you :bigarmhug:
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Oh I am sorry that she isn't doing very well.
I agree that you should have "that talk" with your vet and discuss quality of life as well as pain issues.
I know you will make the right decisions for your girl, and I am sure she trusts you too.
We will be thinking of you. :bigarmhug:
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:bigarmhug:
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I'm so sorry :-* :-* I've only just seen this whole thread.
I'm a big believer in letting them tell you, she may be in a bit of pain but may be happy dealing with it for now - some pain killers have other side affects and if her liver is struggling anyway, then medical help might be limited. If a dog starts to look miserable or for example incontinence is causing them distress etc, then that's when I'd consider helping them on their way. It's different for everyone and some dogs never give up - my last cocker didn't and I questioned after he'd died naturally if I should have made the decision to put him to sleep to save him suffering but even the vet said he didn't think he was ready.. He was a younger dog though (6yrs) so maybe that's a factor as well and older dogs have less energy and fight, I don't know.
You know your dog best.... if she seems ok, then she probably is coping with how she feels or if the vet can help her medically without causing her different issues and you're happy looking after her the way she is, be guided by your gut feeling.. ;)
I wish you both lots of happy cuddles together for now and hope she remains stable and comfortable for a while yet :luv: :luv:
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Awww just wanted to say that I am thinking of you both :bigarmhug: :luv:
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Have spoken to my vet, who is lovely, and he says "What she lacks in bodily strength, she makes up for with sheer grit and determination - she's not going to go quietly!!" :luv:
He doesn't think she's in any pain and is unsure whether it's her heart that's causing all her problems, or whether there's something else going on inside. He did say that we could do tests, scans and x rays, but that her heart wouldn't withstand any anaesthetic/ surgery anyway, so there would be no point, other than to find out what is wrong. I don't know if you all think that's a fair view?
I haven't had 'that talk' with him yet, because I've been avoiding it....... but I know I will have to ask him sooner or later.
I've just come in from collecting my daughter and have been home 15 mins and she hasn't even realised I'm home, she's so deeply asleep. It feels strange because she's usually right behind the door when I come in and nearly gets her feet run over. She shows no interest when I take Charlie out for a walk either :016:
Thanks for all the hugs and wishes :)
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Just want to send you and sweet Milly very :bigarmhug: :bigarmhug: thinking of you both :luv:
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:bigarmhug: for you both. I've not had to make "that" decision yet but I'm sure everyone is correct when they say you will know! Till then, she's sleeping because her's bodies telling her too. It doesn't mean she's in pain, just tired. As long as she generally seems to be getting enjoyment from life, let her be and be guided by the vet :-*
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Thinking of you. Just like to say, quite a few of us have been where you are now.
You will know and make the right decision, of that I'm sure.
Take care
Eve x
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Never been where you are now but big :bigarmhug: for you and Milly. All of my love and thoughts for you both x
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My thoughts are with you both :bigarmhug: :bigarmhug:
It is true that when the time comes you will just know. :'( :'( Sadly we have parted with 2 of our beloved dogs over the years & it is hard to try to explain but there comes a point & i know this is totally heartbreaking, but we have no choice but to let them go. :'( :'(
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Sending you lots of love & strength. Thinking of you.
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Thinking of you both and yes, you do know when it's time. Been there twice before and it's gonna happen again one day. It's not nice but maybe something you may want to broach before it's forced upon you?
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Thinking of you and sending gentle squidges for Milly. xxx
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Still thinking of you :shades:
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Just to let you know, I'm taking Milly top the vets at 12. She's really gone down hill this week and have decided to let her go. She's hardly drinking and has stopped eating altogether now :'(
It's so hard, even though I know it's the kindest and best thing for her.
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So sorry to hear this.
It is truly heartbreaking to let them go, but your little Milly will be pain free again. :luv:
Run free at the bridge beautiful girl :luv:
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Thinking of you both
Run free at the bridge Milly :luv:
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I'm so sorry :'(
Have lots of fun at the bridge Milly :luv:
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Oh dear, am so sorry to hear that, but you are doing what is best for her :luv: ...thinking of you and sending lots of supportive hugs.
Sweet dreams Milly :luv:
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Sorry to read this :'( but you will know she will be pain free once at the Bridge. :bigarmhug:
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I have just seen this, so very sorry you are having to make this sad decision :'(, I am thinking of you :bigarmhug:
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Thinking of you. :'(
It's a horrible decision to have to make but sometimes the kindest one :bigarmhug:
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Thinking of you. :'(
It's a horrible decision to have to make but sometimes the kindest one :bigarmhug:
Couldn't put it better - so sorry
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:'( I am so sorry, but you know however hard it is for you, you have done the right thing by Milly :luv: :bigarmhug:
Run free Milly :luv:
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I am so sorry to hear Milly has gone down hill so much. I know how hard that decision must have been for you to make. They are never with us long enough no matter how much we would like to keep them close to us. Milly will always be in your heart and memories.
Run free at the bridge Milly whole again till you meet again
Cathy
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I'm really sad to read this.
No words I type will help ease how you're feeling at the moment, so I shall simply say that I am thinking of you and will light a candle for Milly tonight when looking up at the stars for those I've lost too :luv:
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Thinking of you at such a heartbreaking time. :'( :'( :bigarmhug: :bigarmhug: I am so, so sorry. :'( :'(
Sleep tight Milly :angel: :luv:
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So sorry....
Hope you had a peaceful journey to the bridge, Milly. :luv:
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So sorry....
Hope you had a peaceful journey to the bridge, Milly. :luv:
From me too xx My heart is breaking for you xx
Run free Milly :luv:
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So very sorry, run free Milly :luv:
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I'm so sorry :'( thinking of you :bigarmhug:
Run free Milly :luv:
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So so sorry to hear of your loss
Run Free Milly :luv:
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So sorry for your loss :luv:
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I'm so sorry :'(
Run free Milly :luv:
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Just seen this too, so sorry to hear your news
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I'm so sorry :'(
Run free Millie :luv:
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So very sad for you ... but you showed how much you loved her by doing this. God bless, Milly.
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Run free Milly, so sorry for your loss
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I am so very very sorry. All the other cockers at the Bridge will look after her until you are together again.
Thinking of you.
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Run free Milly.
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So sorry to read this :'(
Run free at the bridge Milly
Thinking of you all and big hugs from us
Jo.x
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So sorry to hear about Milly :'(
Sleep tight gorgeous girly :luv:
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Such sad news about Milly RIP little girl and run free :luv:
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So sad...run free at the bridge Milly, you will continue to be much loved for ever :luv:
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So sorry to read about Milly. :'(
Run free at The Bridge beautiful girl. :luv:
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So sorry :'( :'(
Take care, thinking of you at this sad time :bigarmhug:
Run Free Milly :luv:
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So sorry. :'(
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So very sorry. Run free beautiful Milly :luv:
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Hello, thanks to you all for the messages.
It's just over a week since Milly went and I still keep expecting her to swoop in and pinch my slippers every time I take them off. Charlie keeps going to her basket under the stairs and staring into it as though he thinks she might be there :-\
The vet was so, so, nice with her, (which made even my OH cry). He sedated her first and she was sleeping peacefully when she went. While she was sedated, he had a quick feel around her liver and said that she had a huge tumour. They couldn't have operated on it because her heart wouldn't take the anaesthetic.
We had her for almost exactly 5 years, she was an ex breeding bitch from Many Tears. She was as mad as a box of frogs, but I loved her so! She was always happy - even when I told her off, (half-heartedly), she'd stand there wagging her tail at me and smiling! She never really understood the idea of going for a walk, she was quite happy to take herself off home if she thought she knew the way and you gave her her lead too early!
She always liked to carry her own lead on the beach and would spot people, (prospective new owners, we called them), and go and round them up if she liked the look of them :luv:
Although she had a bad start on a puppy farm, she gave so much love and was always so happy and desperate to please. I know she had her funny little foibles, that I tried to understand, over the years - but, on the whole, she gave back far more than she took from me.
I think what I'm trying to say is that, if any of you are considering adopting an ex-puppy farm breeding dog, please, please do. She/he will give you sooooo much love and trust, for as long as you are lucky enough to have them. They take time to come out of their shells, but once they do, you have a friend for life. Milly loved me implicitly and it was as if she was eternally grateful to me for taking her on :'(
Hope you understand all this?
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I've only just seen this. I'm so sorry. Your post made perfect sense and it was lovely that you shared it with us all. :bigarmhug:
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What a lovely tribute to Milly :luv: and a very convincing case for taking on an ex-puppy farm dog.
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A beautiful post, thank you for sharing more of Milly :luv: with us.
She was obviously a very special dog
Thinking of you :bigarmhug:
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What a beautiful eulogy for your cocker friend Milly. :bigarmhug:
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I'm really sorry I've only just read that Millie has gone to the bridge. Run free from your pain and your memories of the puppy farm. Your words are beautiful and heart warming and inspiration to anyone looking to give a dog the chance of a wonderful life. :luv:
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I knew she was poorly but I am sorry to hear that you have lost her and am thinkiing of you all Run free Milly you will always be loved and remembered.
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Have only just seen this. So sorry to hear about Milly :'(. But what a lovely post, she was obviously so grateful to you :luv:.
Run free Milly xxx
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What a beautiful tribute to Milly. :luv: :luv: She sounded a very special girl. :luv: :luv:
My thoughts are still with you. :bigarmhug: :bigarmhug:
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What a lovely tribute to Milly :luv: thinking of you x
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So sorry for you. your words are a lovely tribute to Milly.
Angie