CockersOnline Forum
Cocker Specific Discussion => General Cocker Spaniel Discussion => Topic started by: villierschris on October 26, 2017, 08:39:25 PM
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Have been interested in some of the posts on here regarding ex breeding dogs as there doesn’t appear to be that much information/advice about rehoming , training these very special dogs.
After losing our precious terrier cross ‘Holly’ last year there was such a gap left behind. Fate stepped in and just before our summer holiday in August I discovered the Many Tears Website. A sad red eyed Cocker Spaniel caught our eye, mine and the kids that is! My husband didn’t take much persuasion and four days later we had changed our holiday plans driving 7 hours with two kids, our two other dogs Star and Mia in our camper van to Wales! All on the strength of a sad photo on a website, call us mad , looking back it probably was! Amber is her name now she was known as Charlie, we wanted to share our experience, highs and lows of our life with her over the last few months. Each tiny milestone feels huge, we feel so privileged to have her in our lives!
Would love feedback from others who have experience which may help us, as want to do the very best for her!
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Hi. what a beautiful girl you have there. Her sad eyes tell a story but with time I am sure they will smile.
There are a few people here ( more than a few) with Many Tear's girl who will be along to share their stories. I applaud you for taking the plunge to give this girl her forever home. I look forward to reading hers and our journey :luv:
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Amber is beautiful and I think you are wonderful for giving her a home.
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Amber is a lovely girl, am sure with extra TLC she will shine. We too have a rescue in Ollie over 9 years later he brings us joy each moment of every day :luv:
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Amber is a beauty :luv: Well done to you all for offering her a lovely home :-*
I have Bella who is an ex breeder from MT, she is also blind and always has been, she has been with me over 6 years now and without a shadow of doubt the best achievement in my life to date. Bella was a bad case but if you met her now you wouldn’t know it :luv:
I also have Carrie the Springer from MT (found tied to a tree pregnant and under a year old :'() and Poppy the “posh” Cocker.
There are a few of us on here with ex breeders and some super experienced COLers so I am sure we can help if you need us x
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Amber looks so much better already, now she is in your home. We had an ex breeder and she was a joy. It was the most rewarding thing I have ever done. Not always easy, but those special moments when they achieve a little milestone is priceless. You will get lots of help on here. For me, the most important thing for Lara was time, and she learnt way more from my two cocker boys than she would ever had from us. Enjoy your new girl.
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She's lovely, hope you have many happy years together.
Lesley and Dylan
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Thanks for your lovely responses; nice people on here!
Amber arrived in a pet carrier, we unzipped the front and brought her carefully in to her new home. She cowered in the corner of it fearful of moving, eventually claimed ‘Stars’ bed and remained there all night, we weren’t sure what to expect that first night.Would she cry, start scratching to escape;it was like having a new baby!
She wasn’t house trained and that worried us, would our home be awash in wee and poo? In reality we’ve had only a few accidents, our two other dogs helped I think. When one wee’s the others follow, realise the value of these dogs being rehomed with others! Star our German Shepherd quickly became therapy dog; Amber was fearful and spent lots of time hiding behind bushes in the garden. The garden which had been checked as dog proof we quickly realised was no match for the fight or flight adrenaline fuelled will of Amber. She was a magnet for any gap or weak spot, digging for freedom! I believe it’s a feature with these dogs, they will endeavour to return to what they know however bad !We spent the first few days re -dog proofing, boulders at base of fence, chicken wire , you name it we did it. Coaxing her out of hiding was a challenge, one night I sat in the garden for almost an hour scared to leave her in case she started her escape. Eventually we sent Star in for her and that was a breakthrough and gave her the confidence to leave her hiding places.
What are others experience of the fight or flight trait, does it ever leave them? Wondering if we will ever be able to trust her off the lead?
Hoping to post some more over next few weeks and hoping for pearls of wisdom from any veterans? We were so focused on trying to do the right thing , read the advice re crate training and the need for them to have a safe haven. Wrong!! When zipped in overnight she ripped the roof of the luxurious £50pet carrier!! Reluctantly had to trust she wouldn’t wreck the house and that Star and Mia would accept their new furry sister, yes that’s right girls she in it for the long haul not just a sleepover!,
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What a pretty girl, wishing many happy years ahead :luv:
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Time is a healer and memories can fade. they are more like us than we imagine.
if we were " kidnapped" and taken to a strange place our first thought would be to escape regardless of our previous lifestyle. Love and patience will win through :luv:
We are all behind Amber and stand with you in her corner :bigarmhug:
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I know what you mean about the garden, you think you have created Fort Knox only to find it is a bit of a sieve! Star will teach Amber a lot, and definitely give her confidence. There is so much for her to absorb, it will take time. I struggled with toiliet training for Lara, and then I noticed that she had a habit of looking at the back door before going where she was. Things got a lot better after that! We always had to be proactive with her, but we got there. Amber will be totally overwhelmed just now and needs to sort things out in her head. I would let Star take the initiative and enjoy watching your new girl grow.
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I do think each dog is different and the only advice I can give is to give them time and space and not push them too much
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You’ve now had Amber for 10weeks now, she is doing really well in the short time we’ve had her. Walks quite well on a short lead; but harness and a ten metre training lead is still needed as we are just trying to work on recall. Amber is coming out of her she’s not hiding in bushes anymore and has started taking treats from us, this has taken some perseverance though. Training involved me laying face down in the garden with a treat in my upturned hand, as fearful of being approached initially and figured I was less of a threat face down! The neighbours must have thought I was mad. Poor Chris is still persevering, she is still more nervous of men and is starting to be more receptive. It’s exhausting watching her if she doesn’t get the treat on the first pass she spooks her self and does twenty laps of the dining table backwards and forwards....... Any sudden movement past her still makes her skedaddle, poor Amber I do hope this will settle. Like others have said it’s just about time and confidence. Any tips for our current issue? She is unable to restrain her barking when we walk her, call it excitement, feeling overwhelmed , we live by the sea and she is distracted by seagulls flying , other dogs, people they all set her off. We try to reel her in and say quiet. Someone suggested a tin with pebbles in it and shaking it when she starts, haven’t tried it yet.Hope the neighbours aren’t watching when we do they’ll think we’ve finally lost it!
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I would be wary about the tin with pebbles, the noise will probably scare her, and I would imagine that is the opposite of what you want. The puppy farmer was likely male which is why she will be cautious of men. Lara was always less comfortable with my OH than me, and was very wary around his feet, making us believe she had been kicked. if your other dogs are calm, then you may find that Amber will settle as she gets more used to her surroundings.
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Well done for giving Amber her home.We have had Maggiewho came from Dogs Trust Bridgend and Jesie from MT .Both so different. Maggie came to no other dog here. She found things easier but it took 1 year and lots of treats for her to go near my husband. 2days after coming fromWales she went to DT fun day and won waggiest tail in the show. Jessie came very nervous of everything circled the garden for days. Now 3.6 years on she is better but still very frightened.when anyone comes to the house she circles al the time. She is too nervous to go for a walk if I manage to get her out she circles my feet. She relied onMaggie a lot but sadly Maggie went to rainbow bridge 3 weeks ago . Now to get her to come into the garden I often have to put the lead on. When ever or where ever Maggie went she would go too. . I am always telling her that no one will hurt her any more. By the sound of things Amber is doing well it all takes time and some take logger than others.
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Much the same things we had with Annie when we got her from Many Tears last spring. Scared of people but especially men. Frightened of feet. If I walk towards her she will scoot. On the other hand, she has now decided that I am probably not an axe-murderer and will happily cuddle up with me on a sofa and go out with me for a walk.
I would be nervous to let her off anywhere that wasn't secure. It would only take something unexpected to flip her into panic and then I think she would just run with no regard for her own safety. That said she is as happy as could be and just loves being out with 'her pack'.
Please don't use the pebbles in a tin. The last thing you want is her to associate you with something scary. At the end of the day, if she turns out to be a noisy little devil ... what of it? It beats running and hiding.
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https://youtu.be/0vtn8NhofOw
Have a look at this video on YouTube. If you teach the 'bark' command along with the opposite 'quiet' command, she will get the hang of what 'quiet' actually means. This may not be helpful straightaway as she is barking in excitement, but it's a very useful thing to train. Don't think the tin and pebbles would help much.
Lovely to read of her progress though :D
Lesley and Dylan
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Sounds like she is doing really well and making great progress :clapping:
But PLEASE do not use the pebbles in a tin suggestion, or any other aversive method. As a site COL promotes only positive, reward based training methods. ;)
Given that she is still so nervous and is making slow progress, anything that gives her cause to be fearful of you or her new surroundings is bound to do more harm than good and could undo all your hard work so far. It is important to reward her for good behaviour, rather than punishing her when she does something you do not like. No doubt at the puppy farm, they were left to bark, so it may be a hard habit to stop. :-\
Cockers are a vocal breed, but if it is a problem, you can train her to "speak" to order and then "quiet" - rewarding at each point. Have you tried distracting her from the things that she tends to bark at with a tasty treat or game? Distract her when she is in the situations that cause her to bark and reward her for being calm. If she is reluctant to take treats from your hand at the moment, you can try throwing them on the ground near her.
To be honest, given her background, anything that suggests she is becoming more confident in her new environment sounds like a good thing, but like everything else, time and patience are the answer.
You may not be able to solve all her "issues", but it sounds like you are doing brilliantly so far
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At three month point with Amber, have started dog obedience classes with her but not sure if it’s really for her if I’m honest! She is quite bewildered by the whole thing, and after 3months is getting used to us but doesn’t respond or want to please the way the puppies do within the class. She still doesn’t even always respond to us saying her name even at home. Anyone out there taken their ‘special dog’ (don’t want to keep labelling her ex breeder!) to obedience classes?
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I have no experience but I would imagine that these girls would be at there happiest one to one with there new loving family 👍
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No, I don't take Lara to classes. She learnt more from Max and Bertie than from anywhere else. I know what you mean about wanting to please, that is a good description. These dogs have never had a puppy hood so often lack the social skills we expect to see. Amber coping with being in a class is fantastic on its own. Not sure Lara would have at that point. Lovely to hear of her progress :luv:
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I can't see how old she is.
My experience with with well cared for, reject kennelled Springers from a pedigree breeder , has demonstrated that even they take two years to resemble 'normal'. Even then they prefer to hide behind a tree than say hello to other dogs. .
Mine had no understanding of scents, shadows and freedom. You absolutely cannot hurry the process. Baby steps please.
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I wouldn't take Annie (MT class of 2016) to an obedience class. She is unpredictable with other dogs, aside (fortunately) from our other spaniel Buster, whom she adores and copies from.
Because we don't know what they have experienced you never know what will frighten them. Last Friday night all the power in our village went off and Annie was shaking with fear. Yet she will happily go out for walks at night with torches along unlit lanes.
As others have said just let Amber take things at her own pace.
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TBH I would probably forego a group training class. It is very likely to be far too much for a nervous dog to cope with and it is still early days and you could do more harm than good. :'(
Could you perhaps have some one to one sessions with a kind, positive trainer and practice at home while you build up her confidence?
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Oh my goodness...you could have been me and my story. I too have an MT rescue red cocker called Amber. I've had her since June and she's settled in really well. At first she just tried to escape all the time. I've hired a private enclosure to let her off lead to run a few times. Otherwise I have a long line. Still feel she would just keep running if I let her off lead especially if something spooked her. She was house dry very quickly and got used to her bed and collar. Still pulls a bit on a lead and has no clue about toys. Loves to top newspaper up. Tested my two other cockers but has found her position in the pack now.Good luck....they are very special.havent managed to attach a photo to forum 😣
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Oh my goodness...you could have been me and my story. I too have an MT rescue red cocker called Amber. I've had her since June and she's settled in really well. At first she just tried to escape all the time. I've hired a private enclosure to let her off lead to run a few times. Otherwise I have a long line. Still feel she would just keep running if I let her off lead especially if something spooked her. She was house dry very quickly and got used to her bed and collar. Still pulls a bit on a lead and has no clue about toys. Loves to top newspaper up. Tested my two other cockers but has found her position in the pack now.Good luck....they are very special.havent managed to attach a photo to forum [emoji21]
Sounds like your doing well with her, love to see a photo . Keep us posted!
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Been to obedience class tonight and trying to teach her sit and reward, not sure at times if she is really listening to me. Think I still need to build a connection with her, did those of you with similar dogs find the same? Teach you at class to follow a treat and gain their attention by saying ‘watch’ maybe eye contact feels too much but do catch her attention at times. She is comfortable now being with us in the lounge and will now lie on the rug near us as well as her bed. We just love to watch her sleeping she’s so lovely, dying for her to get on my knee. Guess we are long way off that, she sat on my knee in car on the way tonight. By default but love the feel and smell of her it’s such a privilege to have her close, just call us obsessed but we absolutely love her to bits!
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It’s been a good few months since I last posted thought I would update on our rescue Spaniel ‘Amber’.
We have had Amber now for a year, if you were on the Forum then you will remember we got her from the Many Tears Charity in Wales. It’s been quite a journey full of challenges, frustrations, hard work but so worth it as a year on she is turning in to the most loving wonderful dog. Something we would never have imagined as she was so incredibly scared and fearful of any contact at all with us when we first got her.
We have very much had to go at her pace, she has had to gain her confidence and come to us rather than the other way around. Conventional training methods just didn’t work and we have had to look at other approaches; training a puppy is hard enough but the bonus of a pup is that generally they want to please you. Amber wasn’t a puppy and in her mind self preservation and avoidance were her driving force not doing things to please us! We naively thought reward based training would be the answer as she didn’t place any value on toys and didn’t know how to play. Try giving treats to a dog who won’t even come near you and runs away every time you approach her!
That said a year on we have a dog who walks on a lead, comes back sometimes when she’s called! Lol..... in her own time when there’s no birds to distract her. She has learned to sit at kerbs and on a walk but isn’t able to repeat the same at home. Our biggest achievement is that she trusts us, we know this as she sits next to us on her favourite chair, lies with us in bed (just as a treat)and loves being stroked, hugged and loved!! We are so lucky, she’s not perfect but neither are we, we’ve made mistakes too and still have more to teach her but for now we’re content she is (https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180826/1d0f2af5fcef96bb6d0c0d23333bd3ae.jpg)(https://uploads.tapatalk-cdn.com/20180826/522bc80cb72f19ba5d8ccf1437bad29c.jpg)happy content and hopeful knows she is very much loved
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Ahh..... that is lovely to read. The bottom photo of her is beautiful. She looks truly relaxed. :004:
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A lovely update. Well done to all of you :luv: :luv:
Stephanie, George and Hamish xxx
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What a wonderful update, she's such a pretty girl ❤️❤️
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Well Done! Sounds as if all your patience and hard work are paying off, Amber is beautiful and looks so happy and relaxed. Thanks for the update, its put a smile on my face this evening!! :luv:
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Lovely to hear how well she is doing, she looks happy and comfortable in her skin :luv: Well done!
Lesley and Dylan
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it is a truly lovely update
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That is a lovely update and well done for persevering...you are now reaping the reward :luv: Amber is absolutely beautiful :luv:
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Amber is beautiful.you have so well in a year amazing she has achieved so much.my poor Jessie from MT still struggles to go for a short walk and sometimes won't come near me and she is in her sixth year here . well done Amber
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That is great progress in a year. Our MT's girl taught me more than I ever taught her. It can be frustrating but so very rewarding. Well done. Amber is stunning. :luv: