Author Topic: SOPHIE GROWLING AT NEW PUPPY AND MY CHILDREN - HELP  (Read 6146 times)

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Offline RainbowClaire

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Re: SOPHIE GROWLING AT NEW PUPPY AND MY CHILDREN - HELP
« Reply #15 on: January 10, 2007, 08:27:56 AM »
Well -   Sophie strikes again!!   :'(

She is now biting the puppies ears. She hasn't drawn blood bit one is a bit swollen and sore.

What am I going to do about this  :'(

Seriously worried that this problem won't just solve itself in time as she is actually biting the pup now. I never shut them  in the same room together or anything like that and we have loads of space so that Sophie can have freedom from the puppy any time she likes.

 
Shophie and Bonnie's family :)

Offline Jane S

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Re: SOPHIE GROWLING AT NEW PUPPY AND MY CHILDREN - HELP
« Reply #16 on: January 10, 2007, 09:46:45 AM »
Have you contacted a behaviourist as recommended in the previous posts? It's really quite difficult to advise on the problems you're having without being able to observe Sophie's behaviour in person - you really need someone qualified and experienced to come to your home and advise you, based on what they see is happening.
Jane

Offline clairep4

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Re: SOPHIE GROWLING AT NEW PUPPY AND MY CHILDREN - HELP
« Reply #17 on: January 10, 2007, 10:40:14 AM »
Although it is really worrying when you introduce a new pup, I just thought I'd recount how Bella was with Zorro (and they are now best buddies - he's 4.5 months old):

Initially she was quite scared by him but this quickly changed into her doing lots of growling, grumbling and pinning him down. The noises she made were terrible and it did often sound like she was trying to kill him. He in response screamed blue murder. To begin with we were quite worried but then we'd check him over and 99% of the time he didn't even have any of her saliva on him so she was clearly not actually touching him. I'd done quite a bit of reading on here about introducing a new pup and the fact that the existing dog will want to lay down the law. We just let Bella get on with it - she clearly knows what the rules are and he clearly needed to be taught. After a couple of day sit was obvious that she had a scale of punishments to fit the crimes, so to speak, ranging from just a low, warning grumble to the doggie equivalent of six of the best, chasing him and then once she got him in a corner, flipping him swiftly onto his back (with much snarling) and standing over him briefly before releasing him. He would always scream his head off during this but often he had actually been warned 3 or 4 times before Bella resorted to this. For certain things she went straight to this serious telling off, eg if he took a toy she thought was in her possession or approached her when she had a hide chew or something.

She also snapped at him if she was heading to us for a pet and he came to join in, or if she was being petted and he tried to get in there, or if any visitors came and she was still saying hello to them.

We ignored all her growling and tellings off but really praised her for times when she was being nice to him, eg letting him settle down within feet of her without grumbling or letting him walk close beside her.

The other thing we did, which I think really helped, was to make sure she got time out from him - she was allowed to go upstairs and have quiet time, she got taken for walks without him and got taken into different rooms for training and play sessions and general cuddles and attention without the pupster interfering.

She spent 3 days really telling him off alot and then on day 4 discovered she could play with him and that changed things alot. They now get on famously although he is still very young and just starting to lose his puppy license so gets told off for various things and sometimes still gets really snapped at, but again, we let Bella get on with this, she's teaching him right from wrong in doggie terms and she knows far better than we do.

I'd say definitely don't tell Sophie off for growling at him as this is her giving him warnings - if you watch them carefully you might well see that Sophie is giving the pup these warnings BEFORE going into snapping and snarling mode. This is certainly true with Bella, you can see Zorro just being cheeky and pushing it despite her warnings and he then inevitably ends up pinned to the floor squealing like a stuck pig, but in my view he's kinda asked for it!

I really hope things start to settle down for you - just remember it's a HUGE change for Sophie so she needs time to adjust, and the pup does need to be told by her what it can or can't do. Give Sophie plenty of time on her own with you doing the things you've always done with her and lots of praise any time she is being okay with the pup.
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Offline PennyB

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Re: SOPHIE GROWLING AT NEW PUPPY AND MY CHILDREN - HELP
« Reply #18 on: January 10, 2007, 11:30:07 AM »
Well -   Sophie strikes again!!   :'(

She is now biting the puppies ears. She hasn't drawn blood bit one is a bit swollen and sore.

What am I going to do about this  :'(

Seriously worried that this problem won't just solve itself in time as she is actually biting the pup now. I never shut them  in the same room together or anything like that and we have loads of space so that Sophie can have freedom from the puppy any time she likes.

 

Have sent you a PM
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Offline *Theresa*

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Re: SOPHIE GROWLING AT NEW PUPPY AND MY CHILDREN - HELP
« Reply #19 on: January 10, 2007, 11:39:33 AM »
This thread is really interesting to me nd I don't want to hijack it but I just wondered if the advice was the same even if the puppy lived in the house first. Sally won't play with Glen at all and she has not actually bit him but she snarls alot when he tries to get her to play. He does push his ticket alot and snaps at her legs but he is just doing what he does with other dogs and they love to play like that with him. So far I am ignoring it in the hope it will calm down and nobody has got hurt but it does sound quite distressing.  :huh:
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Offline RainbowClaire

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Re: SOPHIE GROWLING AT NEW PUPPY AND MY CHILDREN - HELP
« Reply #20 on: January 11, 2007, 03:39:31 PM »
We are looking for a behaviourist in our area.... there is a lady I know of who runs puppy and older dog training classes. She has owned a cocker spaniel before, (As well as various other breeds). She offers consultations on behavioural issues also. She comes to your home fo a minimum of 1 hour (£20), and gives advice. She is passionate about dogs... do you think she is who we are looking for?
Shophie and Bonnie's family :)

Offline CarolineL

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Re: SOPHIE GROWLING AT NEW PUPPY AND MY CHILDREN - HELP
« Reply #21 on: January 11, 2007, 04:18:42 PM »
Does she have any professional qualifications?? I think APDT?!? is the recommended one to look for.
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Offline Cob-Web

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Re: SOPHIE GROWLING AT NEW PUPPY AND MY CHILDREN - HELP
« Reply #22 on: January 11, 2007, 06:37:43 PM »
We are looking for a behaviourist in our area.... there is a lady I know of who runs puppy and older dog training classes. She has owned a cocker spaniel before, (As well as various other breeds). She offers consultations on behavioural issues also. She comes to your home fo a minimum of 1 hour (£20), and gives advice. She is passionate about dogs... do you think she is who we are looking for?

A dog trainer and a dog behaviourist are two different things, although imo, behaviourists are trainers too. I tend to think of a trainer as someone who will teach an owner techniques to train a dog. In contrast, a behaviourist will observe a dogs behaviour, identify the causes, and then provide a programme to *correct* unwanted or *undesirable* behaviour by teaching the owner to train their dog  :-\

As Caroline says, its best to find someone who is a member of a recognised organisation such as the APDT who have a code of practice which has only positive training principles  ;)
The APDT has a list on their website of members in each County:
http://www.apdt.co.uk/list_trainers.asp

To me, £20 for an hours consultation sounds a bit low for a behavioural consultation - it sounds about right for a one-to-one training session though - but I imagine it varys from place to place  ;)
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Offline PennyB

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Re: SOPHIE GROWLING AT NEW PUPPY AND MY CHILDREN - HELP
« Reply #23 on: January 11, 2007, 07:39:04 PM »
As Caroline says, its best to find someone who is a member of a recognised organisation such as the APDT who have a code of practice which has only positive training principles  ;)
The APDT has a list on their website of members in each County:
http://www.apdt.co.uk/list_trainers.asp

I think on this list there's only one person really that's in your area Claire

Interesting though looking at that list there are none in South Wales at all ::)
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Offline RainbowClaire

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Re: SOPHIE GROWLING AT NEW PUPPY AND MY CHILDREN - HELP
« Reply #24 on: January 11, 2007, 08:01:11 PM »
Gosh - there's so much I have to learn!! Will look at that list in a moment...

Today has been much better though  :D  We have praised Sophie when she hasn't been growling when the pup comes near as Clairep4 recommended, (Thanks 4 that  ;),) we also give Sophie a treat as well as the puppy everytime the puppy toilets outside, (Which is more or less all the time). Sophie comes and sits by the kitchen door waiting for us to come back in for the reward. She has even been interested in the puppy today - sniffing her and occasionally allowing her to brush past her. She even caught the puppy in her bed earlier on and just walked past. I also caught her wiggling her bum in excitement at the puppy too - but once she clocked me she recomposed herself  :005: Her growling at everyone else has stopped as well, (For the time being anyway).

Things may be looking up!  We are just giving her lots of love and time and she seems to responding positively to that  :D :D
Shophie and Bonnie's family :)

Offline PennyB

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Re: SOPHIE GROWLING AT NEW PUPPY AND MY CHILDREN - HELP
« Reply #25 on: January 11, 2007, 08:12:44 PM »
Good to hear things are looking up a bit --- you need to keep working with it. Its never easy when a new pup comes in the house anyway when there is an older dog no matter how long this dog has been there
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Offline Jan/Billy

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Re: SOPHIE GROWLING AT NEW PUPPY AND MY CHILDREN - HELP
« Reply #26 on: January 11, 2007, 08:46:12 PM »
To me, £20 for an hours consultation sounds a bit low for a behavioural consultation - it sounds about right for a one-to-one training session though - but I imagine it varys from place to place  ;)

I agree. Billy has seen two behaviourists now, the first £80 & the second £100.



Offline Rhona W

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Re: SOPHIE GROWLING AT NEW PUPPY AND MY CHILDREN - HELP
« Reply #27 on: January 11, 2007, 08:51:45 PM »
To me, £20 for an hours consultation sounds a bit low for a behavioural consultation - it sounds about right for a one-to-one training session though - but I imagine it varys from place to place  ;)

I agree. Billy has seen two behaviourists now, the first £80 & the second £100.
We paid £50 for a two hour appointment, but were actually there for nearer three hours.  :D

Offline RainbowClaire

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Re: SOPHIE GROWLING AT NEW PUPPY AND MY CHILDREN - HELP
« Reply #28 on: January 12, 2007, 11:09:38 AM »
Thanks for the list IWLass - there is a lady on there not too far from me - I am going to call her this morning.

Unfortunately it's one step forward, two steps back  :-\

Sophie has now drawn blood - bitten Bonnie's ear.

Time for action!!

Shophie and Bonnie's family :)

Offline RainbowClaire

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Re: SOPHIE GROWLING AT NEW PUPPY AND MY CHILDREN - HELP
« Reply #29 on: January 12, 2007, 12:42:02 PM »
Well, after a long discussion with the behaviourist......

She belives that Sophie is a real risk to my toddler. She thinks it likely that Sophie had behavioural problems with the baby grandson of the former owners and that they failed to disclose this to me. They told me that they were selling her due to the grandson being allergic to Sophie, but in view of her anxiety around babies the former is most probable. I emphasized to the seller that I had children and that it was extremely important!!! And she guaranteed me that Sophie LOVED children  >:D NOT TRUE

My son is a very gentle toddler - he was 11 weeks premature - so quite small and always very gentle and quiet. He has ALWAYS been very gentle with Sophie. I have read many books on dog behaviour etc, eg - how hugging is perceived by dogs etc - and so can judge fairly well how he has behaved with herfrom her point of view.

The behaviourist advised - The only way to prevent the situation from esculating would be to (1) Always have Sophie on a lead next to me when in the house, or (2) Never let Sophie in to the house, or (3) To rehome her to a suitable child free environment for her own safety and happiness  

We didn't even get on to the puppy issue - she was just too worried about my toddler and Sophie.

I would never forgive myself if Sophie bit my son - for either of their sakes.


 :-\

Shophie and Bonnie's family :)