Our Cocker is 18mths, is becoming more aggressive and has bitten...!! HELP...

[Elisa]

Have you been in touch with his breeder?  Can they give you any advice?

I sympathise with you, I have a young boy who sounds very similar to yours.    Harvey guards with a passion, anything from food, toys and personal space.  With a very strict training regime of "leave" or "off" we have gone from the depths of despair to hope.  We like you, thought he was trying to assert his dominance, when in fact, it was the very opposite.  Harvey is a very anxious dog.  We don't take anything away from him unless it is absolutely necessary.  We can now walk around him while he is eating.  When he has got something he shouldn't have, we ask him to leave and come and sit beside us (if he comes away, he is letting us know, he is ok about giving it up).  He is very affectionate, but can be unpredictable when being stroked, so we never just stroke him, we always ask him to come over, or stroke him when he "asks".  He loves being groomed and this helps with bonding with him.  I would say he is 95% perfect but will never be 100%

I know Harvey doesn't suffer from Rage and I don't think your dog is either, from what you have posted, but I can appreciate how difficult it is for you. 

[Cotswold Girl]

I really don't think it sounds like rage i am by no means an expert, but rage is supposed to be completely out of the blue attacks, and these don't sound completely out of the blue. And vets are not qualified to diagnose behaviour issues.

I wonder if any cocker savy rescues would take him in and assess him more fully?

Does not sound like rage to me ... but it is very difficult to do any sort of online diagnosis without the full facts and seeing the dog in action.

All I would ask is please don't make any rash decisions about this dogs future without exploring all options. If you rehome this dog it must be done via a rescue that can offer the back up and first of all fully assess the dog in foster care or kennels.

Given that he has bitten it makes it very very hard to rehome a dog but there are rescues that will take on dogs with issues and rehabilitate them and I will talk to Cynthia the boss at NESSR to see if she can help ... I can't myself as I have a young daughter and probably best if the dog comes to rescue that it is fostered without children.

try Cynthia 01670 760346 she won't mind the number being given out as it is plastered all over NESSR publicity.

[CarolineL]

Vets are there to give advice on phyiscal issues, not behavioural ones - a bit like us going to see a surgeon if we've got depression. 

Rage is soooooooooo very very rare and it is extremely unlikely that your dog has this.

Rage is when a dog attacks without warning and it is actually thought to be a form of epilepsy.

If your vet has recommended that you have your dog put to sleep and you find yourself unable to work with your dog further (for whatever reason - nobody will judge you) then rather than have him PTS why not speak to a rescue centre about rehoming him. You would probably be better off approaching a smaller rescue or the Cocker Spaniel Rescue rather than The Dogs Trust or RSPCA - they are unlikely to take a dog that has bitten.

I really hope that you choose to get some professional advice from a behaviourist who uses positive reward based methods and above all understands cockers, and if not, that you turn to a rescue who will take him on and understand him and his behaviours.

Good luck

[wrenside]

doesn't sound like rage.

Your dog clearly has some food/toy guarding issues; this type of behavior can often develop in a household that has young children as they tend to 'snatch' the dogs possessions etc... and generally behave in an unpredictable manner, teaching the dog that it needs to protect its 'things' from these unwanted and often difficult to predict intrusions, which is generally expressed through growling, snapping, and eventually biting if the first warning signs are ignored.

Your dog will need careful re training and new clear and consistent boundaries. If you have the time to give this to your dog then get a good behavioralist in to help guide you. If not, then contact the breeder who you bought the dog from and ask them to either have the dog back or to help you rehome your cocker to a home that has no young children and where there will be an adult who can spend a sufficient amount of time with the dog to encourage a new behavioral regime.

Please don't put your dog to sleep  This is a young, healthy dog who has most likely learned this bad behavior because of its environment. If you can't cope with him then allow him to have the life he deserves in another home with someone who can cope. 

Mary xxx

PS: Sorry if my post is quite 'strong' but I thoroughly believe that putting a dog to sleep should be a last resort measure once every other avenue has been exhausted.

   

[Top Barks]

  gees some vets make me so angry, the problem you are describing sounds like resource guarding and certainly not rage!!!
I had a client with a resource guarding westie and her vet to her to give it a good kicking to sort the problem in not so many words.
You really need to get your dog checked by a reputable behaviourist using the links already posted.
How did your vet diagnose rage?
Is he a vetinary neurologist?
Did your dog have a CT scan?
I have a old  golden cocker who can resource guard from me he can bite, but he aint got rage.
Think your vet is barking up the wrong tree.

[joanne_v]

I agree it doesnt sound like rage but it does sound as if rehoming is the best option considering you have 3 young kids. NESSR will be able to help I'm sure and are experienced in dealing with dogs with similar issues. I rehomed NESSR cocker who had guarding issues and after a year of work to build trust and security she is now 99% fine. There is also The Spaniel Trust who specialise in rehabilitating spaniels with issues. I would advise you go to one of these rescues 

[KellyS]

I agree doesn't sound at all like rage just behavioural issues 

Please contact your dogs breeder or NESSR please don't have the dog pts

[Stars1193]

wowwww, so many thanks for all your virtual verbal dialog  , you all have good advice and most probably stopped us taking the absolute last resort of PTS...the very last thing I really want to take.

From the first impact from Heather&Benjy re Nessr - and 4 further referrals from you good folk online - we have made contact with Cynthia (be it I think her partner) as she was busy, discussed a little but will call and directly speak to Cynthia in the morning...this org really sounds like it will work...

we are taking an open mind now with HOPE.... , yes from all your replies he does guard, but also has bitten without provocation and literally from sleeping beneath the coffee table - i.e. we are so lucky that my parents live so close by and since biting our 8yr old, he has been with them, he loves them like grand parents and is settled - but as fore mentioned, he has bitten them a good few times this past week, the coffee table aspect, he was sleeping, parents watching TV, did not move, but just spoke, he awoke and lunged at my fathers hand biting...

This is so unsettling and I know he would not bite strangers, (least he has not done so), he so loves playing and rolling with the biggest of dogs, Great Dane's; Alsatian's; and even came across a St Bernard - mind u that one was BIGGGG>>>> still no fear.

A second vet opinion, taken to by my parents reached 90% same conclu of 'rage', however from all your experienced knowledge, it also sounds like possible anxiousness also, maybe due to 3 young ones, loud at times; but also wife child minds so it is a hectic house, be it he is kept separate from them all in the day...

I am persuing the Nessr now and keeping fingers crossed, he so deserves as much love as we give but quite possibly in a quieter environment without children.

I thank you all.
Stephen.

[Crazy Cocker Gang]

I really feel for you but think your actually making a brave decision putting Barney and your children first.
Good luck to you all 

[joanne_v]

Thats great you've made contact. I'm sure its the right thing for you all in the long run. Cynthia has got plenty of experience with naughty cockers and has seen it all before. Barney will be in good hands under her care.

[bibathediva]

So glad you are exploring other avenues for him  he will be in good hands and what ever the outcome you will know you did all you could for him ...i really do wish you and your family well and the very best of luck to Barney ...my heart goes out to you all 
do let us know how you get on 

[Karma]

So glad you are getting help and advice from some good rescues....  

As has been said before, a vet cannot diagnose Rage - that is for an experienced behaviourist to consider.

Obviously, we do not know all the circumstances of every incident (and have not seen how Barney interacts or behaves generally), which is why a behaviourist would need to observe Barney.  
I can see from your description of the coffee table incident why a vet may think about Rage - but equally possible, given he has been in a high noise environment with lots of children around was that sudden noise startled him and he felt he had to protect his "den" under the table - if children have "invaded" his space (as children are want to do   ) he may feel threatened by a sudden noise (especially as he may be a little disorientated by the move).  As I say, this is not necessarily what happened, but it is an alternative possibility (which doesn't just go straight down the Rage route).  And it is certainly not said with any criticism of your managing Barney - some dogs thrive on the sort of environment you seem to have   , but others don't (and it sounds like Barney doesn't).

I am glad that the responses here have given you hope for Barney's future life!

[Worthy]

  Having had problems with Kasper (although fortunately for us it was more noise than substance) I can truly appreciate where you are coming from particularly with your children to think of. I too had a behaviourist tell me my dog has RAGE and I also considered re homing him on his advise, however like you I posted for advise and the support and encouragement was phenomenal. I got in touch with a behaviourist who came to my home to assess both the dog and us and luckily she assured me that what we were experiencing was nothing like Rage syndrome and with a few minor modifications to our own behaviour (not his ) things have definitely improved drastically to just an occasional grumble if he wants to be left alone.
As others have said given that you can usually predictive Barney's behaviour it does not sound like Rage, which I understand to be more of an uncontrollable response caused by a neurological defect in the the brain (i am no expert though so don't take this as Gospel). Hopefully for Barney's sake your vet has got it wrong as others have said Rage is incredibly rare and definitely a term that gets thrown around too easily (I have heard it SO many times even when I took Kasper for something totally unrelated and despite him behaving impeccably the vet out of the blue started talking to me about the Red Cocker mist). 
I am not saying your vet is wrong but please get a behaviourists opinion first as Rage can not be diagnosed from symptoms alone and not confirmed without specific neurological testing. Your children's safety in the meantime is paramount and I am sure that Barney senses that things have changed in terms of your feeling towards him particularly now you are fearful of him.
Given that your already on the case it is obvious you love Barney's deeply and have his best intrest at heart, hope you are all able to find a positive way forward x

[LisaB]

It sounds like a temperament issue to me, my Buffy was the same - but we worked with her, with it - and loved her none the less for it.  It was, however, easy for me as I have no children.  Defo not rage syndrome. 
I saw a behaviourist at the university - found it a waste of time, to be honest.  What did work, however, was that we sent her away to residential training and so complete removal for 2 months from our household.
The rage syndrome people traced her family tree and found aggressive cockers on both sides of her pedigree. Rather surprisingly, the cocker breed club advised us to have her pts.  Did you get the pup from the free ads or from a reputable breeder?
We then had intensive training with the trainer, in the last 3 weeks of her stay (pm me if you want the details of the residential training). We were advised to change her food to a high quality but low taste, dry and leave it down all the time, so it no longer came a highly valuable resource to her, worth guarding.  That sorted the food guarding issue.  We used Hills Science.

What you've said about the bite, without provocation, while sleeping, when you're dad spoke is a bit worrying tbh, but there again, it was a newish environment where routines aren't learned yet.  I would never have been able to touch Buffy when she was on her bed, sleeping though.

[wrenside]

Well done for getting help   
Putting your kids and Barneys best interests first in resolving this difficult situation truly shows that you are a good dad and also a good dog owner 
Barney clearly has some serious issues and unfortunately may not be suited to the 'busy' home that you have (do have a chat to an experienced behaviorist as they can work wonders  ) But by getting in touch with Cynthia you are ensuring that if Barney's future doesn't lie with you, then he will be found a home that recognizes his behavioral problems and will hopefully accommodate his needs and then teach him how to behave in an acceptable manner around humans.   

Good luck. 


Best wishes,

Mary xxx