CockersOnline Forum
Cocker Specific Discussion => Genetics & Breeding => Topic started by: Roxies_mum on November 17, 2007, 11:03:28 PM
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Took Roxie (now 5 months) to vets today and vet is adamant that she is not a cocker spaniel but a field spaniel, due to her size and neck length. Our trainer also voiced that she is extremely large for a cocker. As a fist time owner am a bit confused by this. We got her from reputable breeders and saw parents and have all relevant papers. Am not sure what difference between breeds are.
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There is a section in the Genetics and Breeding board where you can post her pedigree - and also use the search facility to see if her sire or dam have been posted before...... :D
Working cockers still confuse a lot of people (incluidng vets), but if she has a KC registration as a cocker, then that is what she is ;)
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Hmmm Field Spaniels are not that common, so it would probably be doubtful that she is one :huh:
Do you have a pic of her, its diificult to tell from your avatar, is she from working or show strain? Are there any names on her pedigree that you could list, that may help us to identify her.
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Cockers come in different shapes and sizes, major differences between show and workers especially.
Field spaniels are just another breed of spaniel, like American Cocker, Clumber, Springer etc.
Heres a bit of info on them
http://www.thekennelclub.org.uk/item/115
Found this too...sooooo many spaniels :D
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spaniel
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Thanks for feedback KC papers as cocker, came from working parents- sire is listed as Maesydderwen Scimitar, Dam as Wernffrwd Blodwen. I love her what ever and she certainly has all the characteristics and personality of a cocker. This comment just confused me.
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From the names you mentioned and by seeing her picture in your avatar she certainly sounds and looks like a cocker :D
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Thanks for feedback KC papers as cocker, came from working parents- sire is listed as Maesydderwen Scimitar, Dam as Wernffrwd Blodwen. I love her what ever and she certainly has all the characteristics and personality of a cocker. This comment just confused me.
Working cockers are what you see if you google both names :D
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Working cocker I think!
I have met a few people who do know that there are two types of cocker spaniel, but somehow get confused about their names. All of these referred to the working type as "field spaniels" but a true field spaniel is a very different dog.
So, now you can go armed with confidence in your knowledge of what type of dog you have and be proud that you know more that the doubters do!
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she's working cocker through and through...although she would be much rarer if she were a field spaniel!!!
Some lines ARE much bigger than the 'expected' working cocker size - and some are smaller. Other dog breeds have been bred into lines over the years to enhance the gun dog traits - like springers etc - so it's understandable that there are size variations.
Some breeders prefer (and breed) the larger style working cocker in the field for strength and stamina, some prefer the smaller working cocker as they are still pocket rockets and go all day too (us smaller working cocker owners believe they can do the same job as their older relations, and as long as they can get a pheasant back in their mouths then they are big enough for us)
Wernffrywd and Maesydderwen are very well known working cocker lines - try and get Mike Smiths book on working spaniels - i think you'll find a strong family resemblance looks wise in some of the Wernffrywd girls and Roxie :luv: :luv:
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She has an excellent Working Cocker Spaniel pedigree
Just in case you haven't checked
Dad here http://www.wetlandsgundogs.co.uk/scimitar.htm
Half sister here http://www.ammerdown-gundogs.co.uk/dogs/cockers/pedigrees/cyflym.htm
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A lot of people including vets are confused by the 'working' cocker & 'field' spaniel.
As Helen says the Field spaniel is quite rare; although I have met one or two whilst out walking & the body shape is different to the Cocker. Domino is quite a large cocker & so there wasn't much difference between his size & that of the field spaniel. :shades:
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if you are asked again you can always give them a little lesson in history... the differences between the breeds are narrow down to weight a size in some including the cocker. If you look historically at litter and pedigree registrations you'll find several breeds listed in the same litter... there are some good old history books on the breed why not buy a couple they make interesting reading and prepare you for silly questions. :D
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she is a VERY VERY well bred working cocker!! I used her older brother at stud last year and was delighted with the pups :D They were big strong pups and very bold. Many vets arent geared up to working cockers (mine is as living only a few miles from Mike S, it is quite a hot bed for workers round here and we use same vet anyway) - there must be one or 2 software packages they use and the weight range is something like 11-14kg for a cocker - not a lot of good if you have a lean muscular worker that weighs 18kg as some males can be.
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where can I post to find out if parents of my baby are show or working?
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where can I post to find out if parents of my baby are show or working?
On the Pedigree board HERE (http://www.cockersonline.co.uk/discuss/index.php?topic=2019.0)
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Thanks but this is just all way too confusing
I have his KC papers, but I have no idea how to tell if they are show or working?
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a quick giveaway (apart from posting his pedigree) is to see of there are any Sh Ch or Ft Ch in his pedigree. Sh Ch indicates Show Champion (Show style cocker), and Ft Ch is for Field Champion (which are working dog trials)
You may have a mix too ;)
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hiya
on dads side there are SH CH but neither on mum's side
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i think you should post his pedigree on a new thread ;)
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(http://i275.photobucket.com/albums/jj291/debsallen/barney2008.jpg)
ok now I have done what we are supposed to and added width=640 hope this works, sooo sorry if it does not
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Debs, it's probably best if you start a new thread on the Pedigree board. If you have a copy of your pup's pedigree, just post the first few generations on the Pedigree board and we'll be able to tell you what kind of pup you have and whether anyone has any relatives. From the photo, he looks to be show-type but you can't always tell from a photo.
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Probably the greatest working cocker of all time was Field Trial Champion Speckle of Ardoon who won the Cocker Championship three times in the 1970s.
Speckle was out of an Elan (working pedigree) bitch, by a Tireragh (show pedigree) sire, that went back to the famous Sixshot show kennel.
Because working cockers don't have to match a standard or blueprint in the breed it doesn't matter how big or small they are, or whether they are "mismarked". The only criterion is that they are biddable, will hunt, and will retrieve, and that they are registered as cockers at the Kennel Club. Some people think that there have been some sneaky springer spaniel genes clandestinely imported into the breed in the last twenty years. This may have led to an increase in size in some working cockers, but there are also small cockers working which look more like show cockers. You pays your money ..........
John