colour not recognized by Kc

[Marina and Saartje]

@ Marina and Saartje i know ute but i mean a other breeder

Okay I thought it would be ute because she's a sable breeder also. both the solid as well as the roan.

the new trent mixing solids and partie is more dangerus for the solids i think. with this mix we loose the clear solid gene and type.
i am a solid breeder with the classical colors and it will be from year to year harder to find dogs witout sable and witout partie colors (tis i searce by min 8-9 generations) in there pedigree.

Totally agree with this.  I'm not a breeder but I can see that where there is a mix of parti and solid, a few generation later suddenly there's a pup with a white foot or a white nose 

I know how difficult it somethimes is to express youself in a different language as your own...

[Cayley]

I have wondered if there were any sables in the UK before they started being imported a few years ago, it seems odd that out of the thousands of cockers here we didn't have any  .

[doughy]

i have been told that sables were born 1932 but most of them were not registered or they were registered under another colour !

[Jane S]

I've often wondered if sable is a naturally occurring colour in Cockers, that's always been there under the radar, why it's not been seen in working lines. As far as I know, there's not been a sable Working Cocker and yet every other colour/pattern can be seen in working lines (even if some are not common). You'd have thought a dominant colour pattern like sable would have popped up somewhere along the line and yet it hasn't so far

[Cayley]

I hope it stops these opportunistic breeders, there's one charging £1,500 now  .

[lindseyp]

I hope it stops these opportunistic breeders, there's one charging £1,500 now  .

Agree with you Cayley but while some eejit pays it, they'll keep breeding   

 

[sandie72]

I hope it stops these opportunistic breeders, there's one charging £1,500 now  .

Agree with you Cayley but while some eejit pays it, they'll keep breeding   

 

We have 2 cocker spaniels Belle who is Sable Roan and Kayla who is a Chocolate Sable and I must defend their breeder and say that she doesn't charge anything like £1500. She has been breeding for around 30 years and started breeding the colour through the love of the colour and not for money.  When I went to visit the litter I did'nt even know what the sable looked liked but totally fell for the colour.
I realise there will be people out their doing it for money but that is not the case here. I must admit I feel a bit sorry for the way the colour is spoken about.

[lindseyp]

I hope it stops these opportunistic breeders, there's one charging £1,500 now  .

Agree with you Cayley but while some eejit pays it, they'll keep breeding   

 

We have 2 cocker spaniels Belle who is Sable Roan and Kayla who is a Chocolate Sable and I must defend their breeder and say that she doesn't charge anything like £1500. She has been breeding for around 30 years and started breeding the colour through the love of the colour and not for money.  When I went to visit the litter I did'nt even know what the sable looked liked but totally fell for the colour.
I realise there will be people out their doing it for money but that is not the case here. I must admit I feel a bit sorry for the way the colour is spoken about.

My comment wasn't aimed at you or your breeder sandie     I don't have any idea who your breeder is & sounds like you are more than happy with her breeding ethics  - your two are adorable by the way  Sorry if my comment offended you 
Personally I have nothing against the colour - in fact I think it's very stunning. My comment was made in ref to the breeders who do jump on the band wagon to make financial gain for what is only a cocker spaniel at the end of the day - it's colour maybe unique & different but does that warrant the price tag that some are asking??

[Ninasmum]

We have 2 cocker spaniels Belle who is Sable Roan and Kayla who is a Chocolate Sable and I must defend their breeder and say that she doesn't charge anything like £1500. She has been breeding for around 30 years and started breeding the colour through the love of the colour and not for money.  When I went to visit the litter I did'nt even know what the sable looked liked but totally fell for the colour.
I realise there will be people out their doing it for money but that is not the case here. I must admit I feel a bit sorry for the way the colour is spoken about.

For what its worth i think its a beautiful colour    & your dogs look fab 
I think its a terrible shame the KC have decided to now not recognise the colour. 

[Cayley]

I hope it stops these opportunistic breeders, there's one charging £1,500 now  .

Agree with you Cayley but while some eejit pays it, they'll keep breeding   

 

We have 2 cocker spaniels Belle who is Sable Roan and Kayla who is a Chocolate Sable and I must defend their breeder and say that she doesn't charge anything like £1500. She has been breeding for around 30 years and started breeding the colour through the love of the colour and not for money.  When I went to visit the litter I did'nt even know what the sable looked liked but totally fell for the colour.
I realise there will be people out their doing it for money but that is not the case here. I must admit I feel a bit sorry for the way the colour is spoken about.

The well bred ones are the same price as all the other colours  .

[Marina and Saartje]

I have a sable to... a Goldsable and didn't  have to pay more than the normal prices So there are more sane breeders, but heard some breeder ask something like 1500 euros...... ridiculous  

Eventhought it's a lovely dog you have in Belle, Sandie72, it's a roan and a solid mixed and that's what makes me worry (in showline)

[sandie72]

Hi Linseyp, Not at all offended by your comments. I absolutely looooove my cockers and they have a fantastic temperament. To be honest I have come across quite a lot of controversy about the colour but since I don't intend breeding or showing then I am not that concerned.
My groomer has solid black cockers and does very well showing (qualified for crufts next year) and she is not keen on the colour due to it coming through into the solid lines (which I can totally understand)
Must admit though on spending time with Belle she cant praise their easygoing nature enough.     
Oh and Belle sits her silver award and Kayla her bronze next week one after another...I am gonna be a quivering wreck. 

[sandie72]

We have 2 cocker spaniels Belle who is Sable Roan and Kayla who is a Chocolate Sable and I must defend their breeder and say that she doesn't charge anything like £1500. She has been breeding for around 30 years and started breeding the colour through the love of the colour and not for money.  When I went to visit the litter I did'nt even know what the sable looked liked but totally fell for the colour.
I realise there will be people out their doing it for money but that is not the case here. I must admit I feel a bit sorry for the way the colour is spoken about.

For what its worth i think its a beautiful colour    & your dogs look fab 
I think its a terrible shame the KC have decided to now not recognise the colour. 

Thank you. 

[Loudon]

This is something which I wish someone could explain. Beautiful sable dogs, yes,  but where did this colour come from?

I maybe wrong, and I just know other COL members will advise me but when you look at the old books there is no mention of sable. If you breed from the standard colours in any mating I just don't see how we get sable. I have been an avid reader of the old books and have been following the shows since I was in my twenty's and I'm now 58. I know, how sad! About 8 years ago I stopped going to shows due to my late wife's illness and I had to go on kidney dialysis as well. Over a year ago I had a transplant and then I started going to the shows again. At the very first show I had to ask  an exhibitor what colour was a particular dog as I had never seen it before and was told it was a sable.

I don't suppose it would be etiquette in COL to ask but I certainly would like to see the pedigree of an original KC registered sable and then some geneticist explain how this came about.

[Doro]

the color comes from england through a dog sold as black and tan and exported to the Squiers Kennel in USA (although sold as black & tan, this dog was a sable). He was the male Elmbury Cinnamon Teal, born 16.01.76 breed by mr. roger hall-jones.   his pedigree >> http://www.gloriette-artemis.net/wikipedi/english-cocker-spaniel/gb/dog_4805.html
he was the father from the sables in europe.

mr. james mel phillips, dated 1938, published in the jornal of hederdity #29 write abaut the sables and the sable gene.
most the sables in england  was disappeard becaus the color was not like. it was a wrong color and often noned as bad black and tan. in usa the sabels was registratet. hosking's nancy (1930), gypsie (1934), the pied piper of fieldhead ( 1938), zipper's sable boots (1939), pete hold (1941) and the sisters sable boomer and sable brock.
in this time the sable was a random product. also the scheduled sable breed stard in the 70th with the dogs from dirk squiere
The breed in germany stard 1985 with the dogs Squier's Litle Surprise and Squier's Squier's Secret Wonder im kennel vom Heidebusch. the dogs come after this two bitches start her trip around europe and the world. i be realy shure that all sable puppes who born today in europe, the solids and the roan sables,  have one of this two bitches in her pedigree.

you can read the article from mr. james phillips here >>>http://www.cocker-colours.com/james_mel_phillips_1938.html



that is the quick story abaut the sables