Tail docking law

[Gilly]

What I'm saying is that the religions that carry out circumcision do not give the babies a choice  :?: and my comparison was referingto an earlier point made about freedom of choice  :wink:                    

[Mike]

Yes they certainly do, but like I said before, I'm not getting into the issue of judging whether something like circumcision for religious reasons is right or wrong as that's a whole different and complicated debate and I really don't feel qualified :wink: Happy to carry on talking about docking though :wink:                    

[Magic Star]

I think this is one of the healthiest debates I've become engaged in on a forum and I'm all for good debate and conversation.  It's nice that we can all put our thoughts across and swap ideas and I do like it when people get me to question my ideas - it's thought provoking and stimulating so thanks!    

the bottom line - whether we prefer a tail or not, whether we agree that docking should be banned or not - we are all able to enjoy the breed and a healthy debate about it and I think that's a good thing.

Hi Jo

I agree with you it is thought provoking and sometimes you think of things that perhaps you hadn't thought about before   Maybe  in extreme cases, change your views completely :wink:    

Its nice that we have all had our say and hopefully I havew not offended anyone in any way, I know I don't feel offended, I accept that people have different views about things, its what makes the world go round :wink:   One thing we all agree about though, is cockers are gorgeous, happy, loyal dogs, with or without tail :wink:                      

[Colin]

I much prefer the docked look, own 2 docked cockers and would choose docked over non-docked in the future if there was no ban (presuming health issues were all equal).

Despite this I must confess that I really can't see any justification for docking puppies tails for purely cosmetic reasons, others may disagree but I don't think risk of damage is a good enough reason and it does appear to be uncommon in undocked dogs. So I woud support a ban on docking non working dogs. Maybe we'd all become used to seeing undocked cockers and grow to love the look eventually.

Mr Unprincipled Hypocrite.

PS. I have no opinions on circumcision.                    

[Sarah_S]

You are allowed to show docked dogs born before 1997 if I remember it right. so we have had docked and undocked cockers in the ring at the same time. And no, just because some were docked didn't mean they were winners.  :wink:

The standard hasn't changed although I'm not sure if there's any difference in the balance of the dog. Some say there is, others there aren't.

You're still able to hide the tail in showstand, so you only see the dogs tail when moving. Some tails are not very nice, while others are beautiful to watch and some are carried to high.
Things you don't realise when they are docked.

If you were a judge and you had two dogs of equal quality, but one of them docked and the other had a rather ugly curly tail. Which one would you prefer?  

docking has it advantages  :wink:                    

[Magic Star]

I much prefer the docked look, own 2 docked cockers and would choose docked over non-docked in the future if there was no ban (presuming health issues were all equal).  

Despite this I must confess that I really can't see any justification for docking puppies tails for purely cosmetic reasons, others may disagree but I don't think risk of damage is a good enough reason and it does appear to be uncommon in undocked dogs. So I woud support a ban on docking non working dogs. Maybe we'd all become used to seeing undocked cockers and grow to love the look eventually.  

Colin,

I think you have hit the nail on the head there, the debate should be about whether the reasons for docking are justified, not about whether we prefer a docked tail to an undocked, or the other way around :wink:  

I guess its what your used to, to a point anyway!                    

[bluesmum]

Your right Emma I think it is just what we are used to :wink:

When I look at Blue with his beautiful tail I couldn't possibly imagine him without it and yet when I look at Bailey who is docked I couldn't picture him with a tail!!! :roll:  

To me they both look exactly how they should - two very lovely cockers! :wink:                    

[Gilly]

I agree with Colin...I prefer the docked myself...and that it's my personal preference  :wink: I have a docked cocker and couldn't imagine her with a tail..the same as people with undocked couldn't imagine theirs without a tail

Yes they certainly do, but like I said before, I'm not getting into the issue of judging whether something like circumcision for religious reasons is right or wrong as that's a whole different and complicated debate and I really don't feel qualified

My point wasn't about the religious issue...what I was trying get at was the freedom of choice issue...I was using this as another example in society where there is no choice for the recipient  :wink: [/quote]                    

[Cob-Web]

Thank you all for such a thought provoking debate!

Until recently I was totally, and I mean completely, against docking.

Then, I fell in love with cocker spaniels and began to rationalise my thought processes; not least becos undocked cockers are still rare.

This debate has helped me keep perspective, not lose it; but I am sure like everything else, politics will eventually take over and legislation will be passed.

Big Brother Rules OK!  :evil:                    

[Luvlylady]

Mm i dont think it would be fair to totaly ban a docked cocker from the ring ....
say we all ended up with docked cockers and there was a particular dog that was doing really well but one day it injured its tail so much so it had to be taken off .
why when its a fantastic breed standard should it not carry on to show.
If you see what i mean.
I dont think they would just stop docked cockers going in the ring all hell would break loose with show people                      

[padfoot]

I personally think the argument regarding tail damage is irrational considering that dogs such as setters are not docked, nor are many working springers.
Why dock show-cockers destined for pet or show (ie not working) homes? I don't see the point really in subjecting the puppy to pain and going to the expense of docking simply for cosmetic reasons.
My cocker spaniel is docked and I really hate the fact someone chopped off his lovely tail   This is why I would only choose a non-docked puppy if I chose to get a pup.
It might be a matter of opinion. But I don't feel that we have the right as humans to chop off parts of our dogs!  And incidentally, no I don't agree with circumcision either, unless for proven health reasons.                    

[Pammy]

I'm not contributing to the debate in anyway - this has been done many many times on this forum - but as moderator I feel this thread has run it's course and is now going round in circles.

It has proved as in the past that there are differeing views on the subject and n'er the twain shall meet

I am therefore locking the thread while everyone has had a chance to share their views and no one has fallen out

If anyone wants to find out more I suggest you do a search for tail docking threads and you'll see a full range of views and reasons for and against. :?

Thanks for your understanding in this.