Is this a working or show cocker?

[Helen]

Probably the name of the pup - as that's what you left a deposit for.

pups aren't being kc registered 

[lallen]

Kenine is an affix assigned by the Kennel Club for a particular year  - Kennel Club has rules about what names can be used - eg you can't use brand names, words that are a breeder's registered affix, or names over a certain number of letters. When you register a puppy, you give a preferred name and an alternative name. If neither are permitted, you can opt for the Kennel Club to choose a name for you. If they do this they use one of their own affixes - a different one each year, and Kenine is one of those.    So in that particular year there could be hundreds of pups of different breeds with that affix.  I think they rotate the affixes and this one was used in 2009 so would make the dam 5 years old which is probably right.

Did the breeder tell you why, if the dam and sire are both KC registered, that he is not registering the litter?

I think I may have boobed. The bitch is not kc registered. she just has pedigree paper which I am now beginning to understand, are worthless. So what you're saying is that the name he has given, Kenine dream, would only apply if the are kc registered? Sorry, for my lack of knowledge

[supergirl]

Probably the name of the pup - as that's what you left a deposit for.

pups aren't being kc registered 

Doesn't matter - breeder can call them anything they like.  Two of my dogs aren't registered but they still have the Kennel affix

[Nicola]

The dog would have to be registered to have the 'Kenine' affix, it's the Kennel Club's own affix which anyone (with any breed of dog) can choose to use if they don't have your own; it changes every year but always begins with 'Ken-' and that one was for 2009 as already said. If the bitch isn't KC registered she won't have a registered name so she can't be Kenine Dream. I'm assuming he hasn't shown you any health test certificates for the parents either?

Honestly, I wouldn't waste any more time on this breeder when there are plenty of good ones out there, although as JeffD has said if you're looking for a working Cocker as a pet you need to be aware that some of them require very high levels of mental stimulation and training.

[Helen]

I think I may have boobed. The bitch is not kc registered. she just has pedigree paper which I am now beginning to understand, are worthless. So what you're saying is that the name he has given, Kenine dream, would only apply if the are kc registered? Sorry, for my lack of knowledge

Yes - pretty much. 

as for papers being worthless it depends on the pedigree papers and the breeder. My KC registered pedigree papers and dog are genuine so it is very meaningful as far as I'm concerned.  

As Nicola says, walk away from this one - it's not just about identifying what the sire is, the whole way this litter is bred smacks of back yard breeding.  

[Sarah.H]

Just to touch on the subject of the show cocker coat - Millie is half worker and half show but has a huge thick coat so I just clip it all off every so often  . My parents dog Charlie also gets the same treatment although I tend to leave an inch or so of feathering on his legs, tummy and chest.

[Snoopy]

I have to say having a working breed of any kind isn't for the faint hearted or inexperienced. They generally need so much brainwork and training it isnt practical in a pet home.

I say generally because I know there are exceptions, as some of you will be quick to point out. 

I've had working dogs in the past and know how different they are to the show breeds. Then again I've had show breeds that never lie down and would go all day.....

These days it's very fashionable to have a worker and new owners are unaware of the difference between the two besides the physical differences.

If its only the coat that's putting you off a show type, you could have a shorter trim without the long feathers.

[odieandgizmo]

Have you made any decisions yet? I hope you have a clearer mind and don't worry about not 'being in the know', I know exactly how you feel! I have Odie,a 13month old beagle,who I can say since getting him at 9weeks old (and before actually) I knew a lot about beagles,typical traits etc etc. but having gizmo,11week old cocker, I'm not prepared at all! Sure I have all the 'stuff' bed,collar,lead etc, but feel like I'm slightly lacking in info! And as for being KC registered and pedigree,I didn't know you can't have one without the other, so if they are KC registered they are pedigree (only found out 2weeks ago,as I thought gizmo wasn't a pedigree,but was told he is KC registered so he is a 5gen pedigree!) it's all confusing!   Confused.com lol!!

[lallen]

Have you made any decisions yet? I hope you have a clearer mind and don't worry about not 'being in the know', I know exactly how you feel! I have Odie,a 13month old beagle,who I can say since getting him at 9weeks old (and before actually) I knew a lot about beagles,typical traits etc etc. but having gizmo,11week old cocker, I'm not prepared at all! Sure I have all the 'stuff' bed,collar,lead etc, but feel like I'm slightly lacking in info! And as for being KC registered and pedigree,I didn't know you can't have one without the other, so if they are KC registered they are pedigree (only found out 2weeks ago,as I thought gizmo wasn't a pedigree,but was told he is KC registered so he is a 5gen pedigree!) it's all confusing!   Confused.com lol!!

Hi. Thanks for your words of support. Yes. I have made a decision. I have decided to pull out of getting this particular pup, take a breath and a step back and start again, this time with more care. I emailed the breeder in question stating i no longer wanted the pup as I was pretty certain the stud was a show cocker and I therefore wanted my deposit back. Guess what? He didn't reply! Previously he replied to my emails within minutes but not this time. Guilty as charged I think. If I had been accused of wrong doing and was innocent I would defend myself strongly until I was blue in the face... onwards and upwards I guess...... thanks again.

[Helen]

will lock this one now as you've decided against the pup 

I hope this thread has given you more information on how to source a well bred pup and hope in time you find the right one