Author Topic: Great....except for when others are around!!  (Read 1134 times)

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Offline rachy85

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Great....except for when others are around!!
« on: April 16, 2012, 12:47:44 PM »
Rocco is now 15 months old, and his recall (both calling and recall to the whistle) is fine....except when other dogs are around!!!

I'm trying to make things exciting...i've tried high value treats, and now starting to become worried when we are out that he won't come back!!

A couple of weeks ago he ran so far ahead when out in the fields that i couldn't keep up with him and ultimately he went issing. Turns out he met up with a woman walking her dog ahead and by the time i got round the corner she had turned in the opposite direction and Rocco was nowhere to be seen! He followed the lady home, which was about 1.5miles away in a little village and then had chance to look at his tag and phoned me (and by now 30mins had passed and i was in tears!! haha)

This time we called him, whistled and nothing he just left. When i picked him up he was happy as Larry and wasn't bothered that he had been without me for 45mins. (He is very very sociable!!!!)

I always let him see other dogs if we are out and owners say it's ok (and round here i kow which dogs are ok and which aren't) so it's not as though he dodn't interact with any. Also a lot of the time he gets walked with my dad and their other 2 dogs, or one of my many friends with dogs, so he is well socialised.


I just wondered if anyone has any tips on how to try and change this so he is more reliable at coming back?
Much appreciated

Rachel

Offline praia

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Re: Great....except for when others are around!!
« Reply #1 on: April 16, 2012, 05:53:09 PM »
You can't expect a good recall around distractions when you haven't first proofed the behavior.   Allowing a dog to roam off the leash and expecting it to recall from other dogs when you haven't first proofed that behavior is just setting it up for failure and making training for acceptable behaviors that much more difficult.

Honestly, most dogs don't care about food or even you when something as exciting as meeting another dog or chasing a possible prey item is their other choice.  Instead of relying on a high value food reward, rely instead on building the fluency of your dog's recall. Start from the basics, use a long line, and gradually build up the level of distraction. Constantly practice recalling to the point where it's an automatic response from the dog, not something he weighs in his mind (e.g. liver cake or playing with another dog).

Offline KayJay

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Re: Great....except for when others are around!!
« Reply #2 on: April 16, 2012, 07:20:21 PM »
To be honest, sometimes I think that lots of socialisation with other pups is overrated! I don't mean to sound po-faced or miserable, but so many people take their pups to classes and allow or encourage unstructured, free-for-all play, without setting in place rules, even just down to letting it wrestle with the dog next to them while waiting their turn, and then wonder why their pup can't/won't pay them attention! The same applies when out on a walk, letting them play with every dog they see; so what is the pup going to think whenever it sees another dog? PLAYTIME!! There's nothing wrong with allowing a good romp, but it has to be with the understanding that when mum says come, you COME! Then you get something lovely and get to go back and play too!!

I must have looked a real killjoy when Dazzle was a baby at class, but I didn't want her saying hello to every dog she saw, or every person there, I didn't want her mugging others for food because she'd been given titbits by other people, I wanted her to see ME as the most exciting, fun and rewarding thing in her world. As a result we can mix with loose dogs and their people and she ignores them, she's not the least interested in playing until I tell her she can; she does love other people and likes other dogs (as long as they don't get too pushy or bounce all over her) but she'd much rather do stuff with me, and when we're training she has a tendency to tell any dogs that approach to bog off as she's doing stuff with mum, instead of checking out and bogging off.

I've said it before and I'll say it again; a dog that doesn't have a solid recall should be on a long line untill it's trained reliably. Every time the dog runs off it's reinforcing the behaviour of running off and making it more difficult to teach NOT running off. And it's dangerous! Find something that he REALLY loves, I mean goes nutso over, use it as his reward and condition an automatic head-turn response to his name or recall cue, such that he doesn't think just acts. Start it in the house, take it into the garden, a quiet park or field, gradually raise the level of distraction, and for now don't let him self-reward by running off to play with other dogs. If it were my dog I wouldn't let him socialise off-lead with other dogs for now, not until he could focus and listen to me around distractions, and found me amazingly fun and exciting. Then I would allow limited interaction under controlled conditions (using a long line and/or an enclosed space) and use lots and lots of recall/reward/release games.
Kay Jennings CAP 1 & 2
www.fourpawsonedirection.co.uk

Offline rachy85

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Re: Great....except for when others are around!!
« Reply #3 on: April 16, 2012, 10:29:47 PM »
I feel like a terrible doggy mummy :-(

Thanks for your replies I better get to work again!!

Offline janandted

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Re: Great....except for when others are around!!
« Reply #4 on: April 16, 2012, 10:37:24 PM »
I feel like a terrible doggy mummy :-(

Thanks for your replies I better get to work again!!
Me too  :embarassed: ph34r

Offline KayJay

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Re: Great....except for when others are around!!
« Reply #5 on: April 16, 2012, 11:11:46 PM »
You're not terrible doggy mums......I just think people underestimate how much work needs to go into building the sort of relationship where attention is offered freely and coming when called joyfully automatic, even when there are other dogs to play with. I was probably prepared ahead of time, I got a working cocker to compete in agility with (among other things) and was aware beforehand that they can be a bit....erm....easily distracted and sniffy, so from the beginning I worked at gaining and keeping her attention, her focus and especially her recall. It's been a continuous process, we still work on it (she's 21 months now and just started competing) on the basis of "use it or lose it" but it's well worth it!
Kay Jennings CAP 1 & 2
www.fourpawsonedirection.co.uk

Offline rachy85

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Re: Great....except for when others are around!!
« Reply #6 on: April 16, 2012, 11:50:24 PM »
Rocco is my first dog and I did start puppy classes with him, but the woman running it was really disparaging when I couldn't keep his attention. Rather than guide me how to do it she sent me outside away from the group to 'practice'. But I didn't know what to do!!
Silly me didn't go back, as she continued to do it week after week. Everything else I've taught by reading up on it but I can't seem to crack this :-( x

Offline jessandme

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Re: Great....except for when others are around!!
« Reply #7 on: April 17, 2012, 09:21:59 AM »
There is a really good post by Top Barks at the top of this section, one of the stickies, it is about how to teach a truly reliable recall.  Here.

I can recommend it, it works.  Make sure you use a long line, not one of the extendable leads. 


Offline KayJay

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Re: Great....except for when others are around!!
« Reply #8 on: April 17, 2012, 11:58:17 AM »
Here's a really good video (if it posts!) on how to teach attention......the kissy noise could be replaced by the dog's name or some other sound. It's being used as a positive interruptor but is equally teaching attention!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TBvPaqMZyo8&feature=share
Kay Jennings CAP 1 & 2
www.fourpawsonedirection.co.uk