CockersOnline Forum
Cocker Specific Discussion => Puppies => Topic started by: Kiki90 on February 24, 2021, 06:40:56 PM
-
I almost don’t know where to begin with this post - please take 5 minutes to read and respond - your advice and comments would mean the world right now.
If you are able to view my old posts you will see that we raised concerns over Watsons anxiety when we first got him at 4 months old. Unfortunately things have really been spiralling over the last 2 months and the situation 2 months on is worse than ever.
I can’t stress this enough - my husband wants to rehome our dog and I have no idea what to do
Since we took Watson home he has been completely obsessed with my husband. My husband doesn’t have a moments piece - the dog follows him from room to room. Even if we have a stair gate up , Watson will go crazy - howling, barking, crying, biting himself, drooling. I will be in the room with him but he will not even pay attention to me he just wants my husband.
If my husband goes to the toilet it’s chaos until he comes back. If my husband needs to go to the shops ( I don’t drive) then I have an hour of the dog going crazy and scratching the doors to escape. I have tried ignoring the behaviour and only responding and praising when he’s quiet , it makes no difference. The neighbours have complained twice to the RSPCA as if we aren’t caring for the dog. We really are. He is so well cared for and he isn’t left alone for more than a few minutes because of these issues but they have said that we must not be caring for him as he has periods where they hear him going rather crazy. And he is LOUD.
I have been doing training where I leave and come back into the room and trying to build it up. I am lucky if I get past 5 seconds without him going crazy.
I have approached a few trainers who are not able to visit due to lockdown and both have said it’s a very extreme case and he may even need medication. My vet doesn’t agree with medications as he isn’t reactive. I am trying to book some training sessions with one of the ladies but she has no availability right now and the advice she is giving is already the steps I am doing.
My husband really has no bond with the dog and says his mental health is declining - he feels trapped and as though he has no freedom since he came along. He is extremely overwhelmed. The first few weeks I put it down to puppy blues - it’s a big life style change , but he certainly isn’t himself right now. I know you might be reading this and thinking my gosh that’s a bit extreme - but I do understand where my husband is coming from. It has been a very difficult few months. We looked at getting a dog for a few years, so didn’t expect to feel like this in a million years.
I adore Watson and feel absolutely awful that this is happening, I feel awful that he gets so anxious but it’s also a huge strain on me and my husband. We work from home and we have had occasions where Watson has just lost it during important work calls, eg if my husband has had to go upstairs because I am on one downstairs, and become incredibly anxious and we have had to come off the call. My husband has been pulled up by his director regarding this.
The local dog Walker and dog day care won’t take him at all due to the behaviour issues and for fear of making him worse.
I am at my wits end - I can’t stop crying, the atmosphere in the house this week is bloody miserable as my husband wants me to find the dog a new home - I’m sure as dog owners you can imagine how much the thought of that breaks my heart. I know Watson has his issues but it’s not his fault that he is like this, he has a lovely personality - yes, a little nutty and mischievous but he is as gentle as can be.
I suppose we were well prepared for sleepless nights, toilet accidents, potentially chewed clothes and furniture but this wasn’t a scenario we foreseen.
To make matters more different we have 2 cats who we obsess over and adore - since Watson arrived they don’t like to come in as he chases them. One is a very large cat who will happily stand his ground and swipe Watson , but the other is tiny and Watson will not leave her alone - he almost locks on to her and won’t stop barking until she is removed from the room . Of course we are also working on this and keeping them separate but it’s another reason for my husband to be upset - he treats this cats like children!
Please pleas does any one have any advice. Please try not to be too mean or judgemental. My husband is generally a good man and loves all of ours pets - I didn’t forsee this outcome AT ALL or I would never have taken Watson into our home as now we risk him having to leave which will not only be hugely upsetting for us but very distressing for him too.
-
I almost don’t know where to begin with this post - please take 5 minutes to read and respond - your advice and comments would mean the world right now.
If you are able to view my old posts you will see that we raised concerns over Watsons anxiety when we first got him at 4 months old. Unfortunately things have really been spiralling over the last 2 months and the situation 2 months on is worse than ever.
I can’t stress this enough - my husband wants to rehome our dog and I have no idea what to do
Since we took Watson home he has been completely obsessed with my husband. My husband doesn’t have a moments piece - the dog follows him from room to room. Even if we have a stair gate up , Watson will go crazy - howling, barking, crying, biting himself, drooling. I will be in the room with him but he will not even pay attention to me he just wants my husband.
If my husband goes to the toilet it’s chaos until he comes back. If my husband needs to go to the shops ( I don’t drive) then I have an hour of the dog going crazy and scratching the doors to escape. I have tried ignoring the behaviour and only responding and praising when he’s quiet , it makes no difference. The neighbours have complained twice to the RSPCA as if we aren’t caring for the dog. We really are. He is so well cared for and he isn’t left alone for more than a few minutes because of these issues but they have said that we must not be caring for him as he has periods where they hear him going rather crazy. And he is LOUD.
I have been doing training where I leave and come back into the room and trying to build it up. I am lucky if I get past 5 seconds without him going crazy.
I have approached a few trainers who are not able to visit due to lockdown and both have said it’s a very extreme case and he may even need medication. My vet doesn’t agree with medications as he isn’t reactive. I am trying to book some training sessions with one of the ladies but she has no availability right now and the advice she is giving is already the steps I am doing.
My husband really has no bond with the dog and says his mental health is declining - he feels trapped and as though he has no freedom since he came along. He is extremely overwhelmed. The first few weeks I put it down to puppy blues - it’s a big life style change , but he certainly isn’t himself right now. I know you might be reading this and thinking my gosh that’s a bit extreme - but I do understand where my husband is coming from. It has been a very difficult few months. We looked at getting a dog for a few years, so didn’t expect to feel like this in a million years.
I adore Watson and feel absolutely awful that this is happening, I feel awful that he gets so anxious but it’s also a huge strain on me and my husband. We work from home and we have had occasions where Watson has just lost it during important work calls, eg if my husband has had to go upstairs because I am on one downstairs, and become incredibly anxious and we have had to come off the call. My husband has been pulled up by his director regarding this.
The local dog Walker and dog day care won’t take him at all due to the behaviour issues and for fear of making him worse.
I am at my wits end - I can’t stop crying, the atmosphere in the house this week is bloody miserable as my husband wants me to find the dog a new home - I’m sure as dog owners you can imagine how much the thought of that breaks my heart. I know Watson has his issues but it’s not his fault that he is like this, he has a lovely personality - yes, a little nutty and mischievous but he is as gentle as can be.
I suppose we were well prepared for sleepless nights, toilet accidents, potentially chewed clothes and furniture but this wasn’t a scenario we foreseen.
To make matters more different we have 2 cats who we obsess over and adore - since Watson arrived they don’t like to come in as he chases them. One is a very large cat who will happily stand his ground and swipe Watson , but the other is tiny and Watson will not leave her alone - he almost locks on to her and won’t stop barking until she is removed from the room . Of course we are also working on this and keeping them separate but it’s another reason for my husband to be upset - he treats this cats like children!
Please pleas does any one have any advice. Please try not to be too mean or judgemental. My husband is generally a good man and loves all of ours pets - I didn’t forsee this outcome AT ALL or I would never have taken Watson into our home as now we risk him having to leave which will not only be hugely upsetting for us but very distressing for him too.
-
I can’t offer advice as what you describe sounds like a problem that does need proper help. I just wanted to say sorry your experience of getting a cocker is so stressful. Have you contacted Top Barks? He is a very experienced dog behaviourist with vast experience of cockers. I don’t know where you are in the country but if you are not close to him he will point you in the direction of a good trainer/behaviourist. I know you said you have already been in touch with some but they are not all equally good and some have no spaniel experience and I think that does make a difference.
A lot of us have used Mark (if you google Top Barks he should come up) and had really good results.
Our first cocker Ben was awful ph34r I hated his puppy months and my husband and I were often at loggerheads because we didn’t know what to do and it was so demanding and stressful not what I imagined having a puppy would be like. Once we understood what to do, what his issues were and what we had been doing wrong and put some work in he was a very special fabulous dog :luv: and we adored him for 14 years. I think the bond we had was closer because we had to work so hard the first few months with him.
I do hope you can get some help for all of you :luv:
-
There are quite a few things you can do to help Watson and in turn help both of you. You both have to want to do this and if your husband feels this way, now, will be be able to focus on training and doing his part? Both of you need to agree on the approach and rules.
You do need help from a behaviourist. If you ket us know your area we may be able to point you in the right direction or make a personal recommendation. Top Barks on here may be able to advise also.
It does sound as though Watson has pretty bad separation anxiety. You don’t mention in your note what sort of routine he has but he should be sleeping around 18 hours a day - to be fair most dogs do all their lives! Tire him out using “brain” games and if he’s not in a routine make sure he starts asap - my guys sleep from around 9pm, wake at 7.30ish, go outside, eat, then back to bed until lunchtime! Afternoons are a bit of training, maybe a walk depending on my workload and back in their crate until tea time. Food, outside, wander round the garden (its a reasonable size) back indoors where they usually doze in front of the fire until 9pm..... do you put Watson in his crate or safe area or is he with you / your husband all the time?
-
Evening both and thank you for taking time to read my cry for help as well as taking time to respond.
I have told my Husband I am happy to just do this on my own but the bottom line in, he needs to be in it as well or Watson isn’t going to learn. Plus the fact is , he is far more likely to train for my husband as he looks up to him. I just feel like my heart is breaking. I adore him and I feel like it’s ruddy awful that he has become so attached to my husband and my husband isn’t interested.
We spoke for years about getting a dog - I can hardly believe that this is the situation I am finding myself in.
Just to answer a few questions that you raised :
Watson sleeps in his crate at night, it has been by our bed but covered so he can’t see us and we have been slowly moving it further away from the bed -
Ideally he would be in the corridor in his crate but this has been a very slow process for Watsons sake. He sleeps well in the crate and he knows when it’s Bed time and will settle quickly.
During the day I have attempted crating him from time to time just to get him used to it and to create a cosy safe place for him to adapt to for when we do need to leave him alone - his reaction to being crated is literally night and day - he becomes very overwhelmed and will exhibit a lot of anxious behaviour - howling at top volume and shows no signs of stopping. It’s so upsetting to watch. This is with us still in the room and close by.
As for routine - he is a wee star. We wake in the morning at 6am, he goes with my husband for a 30 min walk before breakfast. Between 7-10 ish he tends to just relax in the living room. We take him out to the garden to play tug of war or fetch before lunch. He is fed, sleeps some more at our feet while we work. In the afternoon we tend to give a snuffle mat or kong /
Licky mat to keep him occupied for a while which he loves. He is very chilled during the day and will sleep most of the time. He has dinner before going for another half hour walk around the local area.
In the evening he likes to play some more tug of war or just chew on a toy before heading to bed with us.
He is toilet trained , as well as sit, lie down and stay.
He is the loveliest thing. It is just the separation that is causing a lot of stress within the house. This isn’t a marriage council session but it’s so hard when my husband just can’t see the good because he is so hung up on the anxiety. I know it’s hard and I know he has a very severe case of it but we should be at least trying to help him not jumping to rehoming him - I dread to think what Watson will be like if he is removed from his secure home here.
I am in the north of Scotland in the Highlands and I am more than happy to speak with / pay a professional for advice on this matter.
Thank you again . Been crying since I have posted this and feeling downright awful
-
My first cocker was a very difficult pup which is why I’m on this forum.
If I am to be brutally honest with you, Watson is getting far too much attention from you both without earning it. Letting him be in your room overnight or by your feet as you work just “feeds” the anxiety. It won’t be easy and others on here have more experience than I do but my first suggestion is to enforce the separation but to make it as least stressful as possible for you and him. It might be worth feeding him in his crate and accelerating moving him out of your bedroom.
I am connected to Mark at Top Barks and have asked him to look at your post when he can.
-
You are right it needs both of you on board, but it is overwhelming and I suppose if you get support and ideas about what you can do your husband might well come round. To be honest it was me that sorted out most of Bens issues initially as my husband struggled to deal with it. But once things settled he very quickly built a strong and loving bond with him.
Mark (Top Barks) is in York so miles from you I’ve just looked at his website it’s now topbarksfordogs.co.uk have a look and see what you think it’s worth speaking to him to see who he recommends nearer to you. At this stage getting the right person is important who can deal properly with the issues.
If you look at the behaviour section on here over the years there have been so many people pushed to the edge by cockers with either guarding issues or separation anxiety, and they say similar things to you, but also I have seen lots of people work through it and come out the other side so don’t give up cockers can be complex little dogs but so worth the work in the end
-
Whoops sorry Pearly I think I posted at the same time as you, I didn’t know you were connected to Mark, I nipped off to find his website details! He helped us with Ben and our rescue Harry.
-
Mark has suggested looking at the APBC website for a Behaviourist
-
Have you tried adaptil room diffusers? It won't solve the problem, but it could help get the anxiety levels down. It helped my dog when she suffered from separation anxiety.
Other things that can help during training is stuff like aptus relax treats, thunder shirt or anxiety wrap. All good tools to aid while training.
Sounds like Watson has some fun days with you. If he is more attached to your husband you could make sure to be the one to provide walks, food, and training as much as he does. I feel like that builds a connection in a different way than playtime and cuddles.
My dog does not really have separation anxiety anymore. But she will bark/scream in frustration if we leave a room and shut the door so she cannot follow. I tried training, but she just has this habit. If, however, the person leaving the room drops some treats on the floor so she is busy searching when the door closes she is fine an will not get worked up even when she notices they are gone. You could try and see if it helps at all to have your husband give a kong or some treats on the floor when he leaves the room.
Sorry I can't give more advise. But I know the feeling of having the puppy time be more worry than anyone could plan for. And I know what it's like when someone in the household is not agreeing on how to approach the issues. So I absolutely feel for you! Hope you can get some help or see some improvement soon. Everyone feeling miserable is just not fair for any of you.
-
Hi, I can‘t give any additional advice I‘m afraid as it does sound as if you need to talk to someone who can ask the right questions and make a better a proper assessment of the situation. I think Pearly has a good point re the attention he‘s receiving, its obviously a stressful situation for all of you and Watson is most certainly picking up on it. A bit more time out would do you all good and teach Watson that he‘s not the center of attention all of the time.
I hope you can get the help you need and that you‘ll soon be able to relax and enjoy life with Watson.
Very best of luck, please keep us posted!
-
I’m so sorry. I don’t have much more to offer by way of advice to add to what’s already been said. A behaviourist is certainly the way to start - very difficult with Covid though, I agree.
One thing strikes me from reading your previous posts. I see the first owners had Watson’s sister too? Do you think they were 100% honest about why they gave him up? I’m wondering if you’ve heard of littermate syndrome? Could he have been completely attached to his sister and is now really struggling to cope without her? For whatever reason he has attached himself to your husband instead? I’m not sure what the answer is but I’m just wondering if this could at least explain where the problem may have begun.
Cocker puppies can be incredibly challenging at the best of times (I cried many buckets of tears with my Archie - who was absolutely hellish!). If you have taken on a pup that already had some issues you may not have been made aware of then it isn’t surprising that you are struggling. Massive hugs to all 3 of you. I promise it’s worth it in the end so I really hope you can find the help you need.
-
Thank you all for responding. I did outreach to Mark but he no longer deals with separation anxiety. I also messaged 2 others who I sourced through the APBC but I’m yet to hear back. Husband wants Watson to go live with my mother in law from this weekend but A) I know that my mother in law will not cope with him as he needs a lot of time and training and B) Watson will surely be even worse if he is removed from us.
It really feels like a ‘me or the dog’ situation.
Arciebean, I have never heard of littermate syndrome but this could be absolutely viable. To be honest I believe there were reasons why Watson was returned to the breeder and we were not informed. The breeder was in a rush to have him rehomed but we were told this was just due to him going back to work - I am beginning to think the breeder also saw problems in Watsons behaviour and was dishonest with us. He has virtually disappeared since we brought him him and has had no contact with us.
Absolutely stuck and don’t know what to do. If he can’t stay here I don’t even know what the best thing is to do with him - I don’t want him to go to my mother in law as I know he needs a home who is prepared and even has experience in this behaviour.
BRB , crying again!
-
I suggest you talk to Spaniel Assist Rescue and Rehoming; they do a wonderful job at finding new homes for spaniels. Dawn will understand your problems and give the best advice for you all; the most needing help i your puppy! x
-
Hi again,
I was also just about to suggest having a talk with a good reputable rehoming organization, not necessarily to arrange rehoming at this point but to ask if they have any suggestions as to who could help you, I don‘t live in UK so have had no dealings with any specific ones but I would imagine they have experience and contacts.
I‘ve just read through your post again and it did occur to me, from how you described your day, that you yourself don‘t appear to have any one to one time with Watson for training? - i.e. your husband takes him for a walk first thing and then you play etc altogether? I just wondered if you could take him out, away from the house and your husband, and do some training with him, - maybe start with focusing his attention on looking at you ( lots of videos etc online to help you, clicker training is also a good way to start) . My thinking is, that if you can get him to look to you for the guidance and security he seems to be looking for, it might help his self confidence. - any sort of training exercise which he can learn to carry out successfully and then be praised for for achieving would help.. The one to one would not only help the bond between you and Watson but also put a bit of distance between you and the situation in the house, which is clearly stressful for all of you. The calmer you can remain, the nearer you‘ll be to finding a solution. I do hope you can resolve it!
-
I suggest you talk to Spaniel Assist Rescue and Rehoming; they do a wonderful job at finding new homes for spaniels. Dawn will understand your problems and give the best advice for you all; the most needing help i your puppy! x
Unfortunately they aren’t rehoming at the moment but I will certainly message regarding the situation and hopefully she may have some advice. This is just such a horrible thing to go through and really feeling miserable about it all. :embarassed: :embarassed:
-
Hi again,
I was also just about to suggest having a talk with a good reputable rehoming organization, not necessarily to arrange rehoming at this point but to ask if they have any suggestions as to who could help you, I don‘t live in UK so have had no dealings with any specific ones but I would imagine they have experience and contacts.
I‘ve just read through your post again and it did occur to me, from how you described your day, that you yourself don‘t appear to have any one to one time with Watson for training? - i.e. your husband takes him for a walk first thing and then you play etc altogether? I just wondered if you could take him out, away from the house and your husband, and do some training with him, - maybe start with focusing his attention on looking at you ( lots of videos etc online to help you, clicker training is also a good way to start) . My thinking is, that if you can get him to look to you for the guidance and security he seems to be looking for, it might help his self confidence. - any sort of training exercise which he can learn to carry out successfully and then be praised for for achieving would help.. The one to one would not only help the bond between you and Watson but also put a bit of distance between you and the situation in the house, which is clearly stressful for all of you. The calmer you can remain, the nearer you‘ll be to finding a solution. I do hope you can resolve it!
Bizzy, apologies -
I should have mentioned we do small bouts of training with Watson throughout the day. Just 10 minute type sessions as he just looses focus if it’s any longer. I tend to do this mid morning while he is hungry ahead of breakfast and then slightly later on before tea time. My husband does some training with him while out on their evening walk.
He knows sit , stay and lie down although he chooses to ignore those half of the time unless he thinks he is getting something out of it.
Today has been awful. Watson has been howling and barking all morning while my husband is on work calls. Feeling incredibly anxious myself trying to keep him quiet. He also pooped on the floor which isn’t like him but he was pacing around so much I maybe missed the sign that he then needed out.
Husband is not in a good mood due to having to leave one work call abruptly as Watson was getting extremely loud and agitated.
Stressful situation for all involved :huh:
-
My point was, that your husband seems to be doing the morning and evening walking and is also involved in a lot of the training! - If you‘re trying to break the dependency on your husband, it would surely be sensible for you to take over the role of walker, trainer, feeder etc.
I really feel for you, its an awful situation, you’re obviously very stressed and I don‘t want to appear judgemental but you‘re clearly not on the same page as your husband at the moment, so if you’re determined to keep Watson and need to convince him that you can change things around, you have to be prepared to actively take over the whole responsibilty of Watson yourself or give him up altogether. If you don‘t think you can do it without your husband and he‘s finding it too stressful to continue, then that might be the kindest option.
-
My point was, that your husband seems to be doing the morning and evening walking and is also involved in a lot of the training! - If you‘re trying to break the dependency on your husband, it would surely be sensible for you to take over the role of walker, trainer, feeder etc.
I really feel for you, its an awful situation, you’re obviously very stressed and I don‘t want to appear judgemental but you‘re clearly not on the same page as your husband at the moment, so if you’re determined to keep Watson and need to convince him that you can change things around, you have to be prepared to actively take over the whole responsibilty of Watson yourself or give him up altogether. If you don‘t think you can do it without your husband and he‘s finding it too stressful to continue, then that might be the kindest option.
I quite expect some judgement to be honest as I have had friends and family irresponsibly take on pets and then struggle / re home then and maybe I am just getting karma now as I used to always say it was silly of them to take on pets without being 100% sure they would cope. We planned for a dog for 4/5 years would you believe and I have no found myself in this position.
I am agoraphobic and Watson was part of my over all plan regarding getting out more. I do a short lunchtime walk around the block and the play in the garden but as my husband is a keen walker / runner it was always planned he would do the morning and evening walk.
We are lucky enough to have two good friends who are professional dog walkers so we always planned to use them when my husband wasn’t around for example if he was travelling for work - however due to Watsons anxiety they have essentially told us they can’t take him. Likewise , the local doggy day care does not accept dogs that have anxiety.
So as much as we did try to plan for what would happen when I had bad mental health days or my husband was away - those plans have come to a halt due to the behavioural issues.
I have filled in a form this afternoon which is for the spaniel rescue - I will see what happens from here.
Feel awful to have failed Watson but without my husband onboard with me, I don’t think I can do it on my own.
We have 2 children in the mix who are missing out too due to dad being stressed and having to catch up on work late at night and mum being kept busy with training and calming the dog.
I grew up with dogs my whole life, all of which were hard working hunting dogs as we lived on large
Land and were involved in game-keeping , so I really felt prepared to bring our own dog home after waiting so many years until the children were a little older.
Thank you everyone who has taken time to give a response and withhold from posting anything too judgemental or hurtful, I know that it must sound awful that we are having to make this decision but it really is the last resort for us.
-
Having an anxious dog is not easy. None of us want to willingly take one on and most of us wouldn’t know how to cope with one if we did. No one is judging you - BizzyLizzy was trying to convey the message that part of Watsons attachment to your husband is that he is doing the lions share of training, exercise and feeding and to break the cycle of attachment.
Cockersonline members will support you with whatvever decision you make.
Some things to think about.
Dogs are similar to non-verbal children. They need to know the rules and know when they are broken. As the owner you need to set those rules and keep to them. With an anxious dog it’s even more important to have a routine, with consistent commands and all in the house playing their part in that consistency. Giving cuddles without them being earned is exactly what our cockers crave, any attention is good attention including being told off, shouted at or worse and yet the dog wants more! Only play with him if he’s earned the right! That is, he sits down and settles when asked - when he wakes he gets affection. He will quickly pick up that sleeping/quiet = happy times!
You mention he has quiet time in the living room in the morning. This is the ideal time to do some crate training with him - only feed half his breakfast and save the rest for the time he usually settles down, put the remainder in a bowl, inside the crate and let him wander in and out. Make sure his crate is completely covered so it’s dark. Restrict his access to anything else (do you have a utility room you can put his crate in or hallway?) where his bed and covered/safe space is the most appealing. Be calm with him, as he settles down to sleep give him a settle command, I use “snooze” which is a throw back to the alarm clock when my first cocker was a pup and she was in the bedroom with me. It doesn’t take long for them to associate sleep with the command and of course, sleep means fun afterwards.....
Forget his walks. They are really for your husbands benefit. Right now I would focus on getting him to be calm and in that routine. The morning walk will be filling him full of Adrenalin, yes he’ll sleep after but he’ll do the same with ten minutes brain training - sit and not move, walking to heel in the house etc. Take him for the walk at lunchtime so you both get to bond, it doesn’t need to be far, use it for training once you are out. When you get back, ask him to settle again, use half his dinner if you need to. Make sure he goes to bed at night around 8.30 pm to 9pm. An over tired dog gets fractious just as children do......
You’ve already discovered that by making a dreadful noise, Watson gets lots of attention. He doesn’t understand that being shouted at isn’t good. So, deep breath, ignore him. No words. No eye contact. Guide him by the collar out of the back door into the garden, as soon as he is quiet tell him he’s a good boy and reward him with s small fuss. If he starts again, do the same. He will be confused to start with. It will soon dawn on him that being quiet gets a fuss, making a noise means he goes outside! You may want to put a short lead on his collar to make it easier to get him outside.
For most separation anxiety (the normal stuff) the recommendation is to not make any fuss as you go out but to give the settle command. Most importantly, when you get back, you ignore him - no words, no friendly greeting, no eye contact, no fuss, nothing. Not until he is calm and quiet. Once he knows to be quiet you can give him a gentle fuss.
The most important part of this training is to let him know when he is being good! If he’s quiet tell him “good boy”. Don’t make a big deal of the first time he doesn’t howl but gently tell him good boy - there’s nothing better in life than being told when you’ve done well, right? He’s anxious, he doesn’t understand, let him know when he’s getting it right.
It will be quite a while before anyone in the family will be able to play with him or interact full on - it may be a bit of tough love on both sides but it’s worth a try, otherwise it does seem like re-homing is the only option.
Perthshire Gundog Rescue are very good and will be a lot closer to you. Cocker and English Springer Spaniel Rescue (I volunteer with them) are also very good but not rehoming at the moment and may have a challenge collecting your boy.
If you would like anymore help or want to talk about Watson please PM me. I’m not a behaviourist but have had an anxious dog and have a dog with separation anxiety at the moment so have an idea what you are going through.
Take care,
Jayne
-
I‘m sorry, as I said, I wasn‘t being judgemental at all as, although I wasn‘t aware of these additional facts, I understand that you‘re trying to do the best for Watson. I wish you well and do really hope you can find a solution that will suit you all. All the best. x
-
Sorry to hear this - I am not offering advice but if you contact Springer rescue for Scotland http://springerrescuescotland.org they maybe able to help - yes I know it's springers and Watson is a cocker before anyone points it out
I am not sure if some of the people involved with Springer rescue for Scotland are still members on here - but I would definitely recommend speaking to them (not necessarily for rehoming but they maybe able to advise of someone in your area that could help)
Wishing you all the best :luv:
-
Just wanted to say that you have my sympathies! Our puppy used to be pretty obsessed with me, would cry if I left the room and my partner was still in the room. We made a big effort to get my partner to do most of the feeding so she was less bonded to me. When she was around 5 months we had to go on holiday and sent her to a luxury doggy hotel - I was so nervous that she would lose the plot but she was completely fine and when she came back she had perfect bite inhibition and was more confident. She initially hated her dog walker (just refused to walk) but then we swapped her dog walker to a different person with a different energy who she LOVES.
But your case does sound very extreme! And it also sounds like you are doing all the recommended things.
If you have to rehome him it’s sounds like sooner would be better than later, and perhaps in a cat free home with children so there is attention and bustle. Puppies are infants and I am of the theory that a solid secure start helps them naturally grow confidence and reduce anxiety, but I’ve never had to deal with proper case of separation anxiety so not well qualified. Puppy blues are so hard. You just have to make the right decision for you and the decision that’s best for your puppy too. x
-
You have my total sympathy, I have had Cockers for 40 yrs, and currently have my older girl who is nearly 11 (topaz) who is 2, Topaz and previous dogs no problem,.. leaving travelling, anxiety etc etc, Amber our youngest is very clingy with me , and gets distraught if I go out , altoh I admit not as bad as yours sounds, but the upshot is, everything I do I feel I have to rush through or get back, she whinges all the time, howls sometimes, and I have felt very low this week as I feel my life is now virtually over and I am a prisoner to this dog, she doesnt travel well, she has a high prey drive so frequently disappears on walks causing me great heartache, on a lead she pulls and I feel as tho I am spoiling her walks by keeping her on a lead, so usually relent, then spend 1/2 hr trying to find her. She suffers from allergies so my days seem to be spent trying to work out her diet, which she will promptly leave.....and yes I have been in tears and got to the point I actually didnt want her to come back when she ran off today....I am so desperate to get my life back, instead of it being a daily grind o moidering about some aspect of her, I would give my life for her she is the most loving and adorable dog but I am 65 I just cant cope with her disobedience , she can be a yard away from me and just wot respond, if she is on a scent she is off, o one occasion crossing a main road, and but for lock-down and less traffic would almost certainly have been killed. I too am at my wits end, my Hubby seems to get great pleasure from my misery, I think he regards it as punishment for having dogs, which he was willing to have ..until they are problematic (mostly cause by him), he wouldnt entertain the cost of any form of training as he doesnt walk them so doesnt have a problem, If I am REALLY honest, I have seriously considered walking out and not coming back on more than one occasion, sick of it all and no support whatsoever....Sorry not much help but just to let you know I totally understand how you feel and totally sympathise
-
Cazza is correct, they deal with cockers too. Worth contacting them. Apologies, I'm not sure where you are in the country, I have managed to miss that bit. Spaniel Aid are also worth contacting, they hope to be reopening again soon.
-
I do not think anyone here is judging. Some of us currently have, or have had issues with both dogs and health, mental and physical. Like someone said, a cocker puppy is a challenge even under normal circumstances, and you are struggling so much extra. It's not surprising that you are overwhelmed.
I do think there is a lot of good advice so far. Like:
- You taking Watson out as much as you are able to, if it is only one short walk, then you were still the wonderful person who provided it for him.
- Set up a schedule so he gets a predictable daily routine. With mealtimes provided by you at approximately the same time every day.
- Guide him by the leash outside if he starts disturbing work calls could help. No fuss, just bring him away from the situation, break the pattern of unwanted behaviour. Act confident and unemotional. Show him that you know what to do, and he can trust you ;)
Remember, he doesn't need too much adventure and exercise right now, he jus needs safety and predictability.
He can get lots of love and attention, but he also needs to be ignored in between the cuddles and playtimes. If he is fed, walked, had his playtime/cuddles, ignore him for a few hours with a clear conscience.
Maybe you can agree on a common tactic to try one week and not argue about it until you review it next week. If your husband is frustrated all the time, and you are anxious about that, then the puppy will pick up on that. I know it's easy to say from the outside. But owners of difficult dogs often put too much pressure on themselves. We are not perfect, and problematic dog behaviour does not get fixed overnight even if we do everything correctly.
If you find a way to rehome him into a suitable home then I will not judge. Unil then, or if you decide to keep him, be kind to yourself and just do your best. He needs to see you provide resources, he needs you to show him what you expect from of him and he needs safety. If you can't do it some days due to your health, then don't feel bad. Just do what you can, when you can, all we can do is our best.
I promise we do not judge, but many on the forum have valuable experiences and solid knowledge to share. In an effort to get the important points across, advise can maybe appear a little direct in written format.
-
Cazza is correct, they deal with cockers too. Worth contacting them. Apologies, I'm not sure where you are in the country, I have managed to miss that bit. Spaniel Aid are also worth contacting, they hope to be reopening again soon.
She's north of Scotland in the Highlands
-
Cazza is correct, they deal with cockers too. Worth contacting them. Apologies, I'm not sure where you are in the country, I have managed to miss that bit. Spaniel Aid are also worth contacting, they hope to be reopening again soon.
She's north of Scotland in the Highlands
Thank you Cazza. Definitely talk to Springer Rescue Scotland, you have nothing to lose at this point and everything to gain. There are people up your way that were involved with the rescue, hopefully that will still be the case. They will be able to guide you with trainers/behaviourist who may be able to help you, I am sure, if that is what you choose to do. I am sorry things have turned out this way for you, and your family. I hope you can find a resolution that works for you all.
-
I am so sorry to read this. Have a look at the other post in Puppies, I’ve added as much as I know about separation anxiety which did work with Pearl.
I can help with recall and obedience (remember Coral?) best chatted on a phone call, it will be far too much information to type and I risk typing the wrong thing! Send me a PM if you would like my contact details. It does get better, honestly!
Jayne
-
I am no expert by any stretch of the imagination but this is how I read the situation....you say your husband has no bond with Watson and presumably as such shows little if any affection. Could it be that Watson picks up on this and is desperate for your husband to like him, what you see as an obsession with him is actually a cry for affection from the dog. Imo Watson is following him everywhere in order to befriend him. A very wise man who was a member of this group (Jeff...RIP) once told me via a PM chat that cockers hate to be ignored and that for them being ignored was the very worst form of correction.....that's my take on your situation.
-
Does anyone do Husband training? I know what you both feel with this added stress. I got the ‘it’s me or the dog’ stand off. The dog stayed naturally, and the cave man sulked. He wasn’t brought up with dogs, and had no empathy. Wouldn’t listen to my dog training techniques, from the basic eye contact on. He likes my scruffy terrier because of the one in Just William books, but is still a zombie on walks, casually holding a lead with a couple of fingers.
Cockers and tears go together
-
PS
I just had my wife read the OP post without reading any replies incl my own and her take on it was exactly same as mine with no prompting from me.
-
Both Phoenix and IPS make extremely valid points.
-
Do other members feel, as I do, that this thread should be merged with the one of the same title (and by the same OP) in Behaviour and Training, that way it would be easier for all concerned to keep up with posts and advice given to poster as this is an incredibly difficult subject.
-
Do other members feel, as I do, that this thread should be merged with the one of the same title (and by the same OP) in Behaviour and Training, that way it would be easier for all concerned to keep up with posts and advice given to poster as this is an incredibly difficult subject.
Yes, I thought the same. The poster hasn‘t come back however, I do hope we haven‘t lost her....
-
Do other members feel, as I do, that this thread should be merged with the one of the same title (and by the same OP) in Behaviour and Training, that way it would be easier for all concerned to keep up with posts and advice given to poster as this is an incredibly difficult subject.
Yes, I thought the same. The poster hasn‘t come back however, I do hope we haven‘t lost her....
Good idea - I'm on it!
I have merged the two topics on this subject into this one. There may be a bit of duplication, but at least it's all in the same place ;)
-
Hello everyone
I’m sorry for the sudden silence when you have all been so kind as to take time to read and comment it’s help and advice.
For an update, Mr.Watson has been at my mother in laws house on a ‘holiday’ since Sunday night. I am not wanting this to be long term and I know it maybe isn’t a wise idea in case this was to make his anxiety worse - but I needed to get some breathing space as did my Husband. Watson has been having a great time as she has a lovely rescue dog - they have been playing and keeping each other entertained. I met up with them yesterday and this evening for a walk and to say hello to Watson.
He is doing the same behaviour there as he would he , eg howling and barking when left behind the stair gate or left alone but other than that he is no ‘worse’ while on his holidays so we plan to leave him there another few days!
It has been such a difficult few months , I honestly just didn’t expect this. I looked after 8 puppies from birth to 10 weeks in 2019 alongside my manager at the time as I worked from her home office - it was tough going but that was nothing compared to this one puppy.
This isn’t a couple counselling session but my goodness I don’t understand why my Husband spoke of wanting a dog and then has this attitude. He has been huffing and puffing about getting up at 6am with the dog, but the minute he’s gone he’s been getting up at 6am quite happily for exercise / running. Beggars belief
-
You have my total sympathy, I have had Cockers for 40 yrs, and currently have my older girl who is nearly 11 (topaz) who is 2, Topaz and previous dogs no problem,.. leaving travelling, anxiety etc etc, Amber our youngest is very clingy with me , and gets distraught if I go out , altoh I admit not as bad as yours sounds, but the upshot is, everything I do I feel I have to rush through or get back, she whinges all the time, howls sometimes, and I have felt very low this week as I feel my life is now virtually over and I am a prisoner to this dog, she doesnt travel well, she has a high prey drive so frequently disappears on walks causing me great heartache, on a lead she pulls and I feel as tho I am spoiling her walks by keeping her on a lead, so usually relent, then spend 1/2 hr trying to find her. She suffers from allergies so my days seem to be spent trying to work out her diet, which she will promptly leave.....and yes I have been in tears and got to the point I actually didnt want her to come back when she ran off today....I am so desperate to get my life back, instead of it being a daily grind o moidering about some aspect of her, I would give my life for her she is the most loving and adorable dog but I am 65 I just cant cope with her disobedience , she can be a yard away from me and just wot respond, if she is on a scent she is off, o one occasion crossing a main road, and but for lock-down and less traffic would almost certainly have been killed. I too am at my wits end, my Hubby seems to get great pleasure from my misery, I think he regards it as punishment for having dogs, which he was willing to have ..until they are problematic (mostly cause by him), he wouldnt entertain the cost of any form of training as he doesnt walk them so doesnt have a problem, If I am REALLY honest, I have seriously considered walking out and not coming back on more than one occasion, sick of it all and no support whatsoever....Sorry not much help but just to let you know I totally understand how you feel and totally sympathise
Goodness me, I am sorry to hear this. I completely empathise with the feeling of being trapped - believe me! For 2.5 months I haven’t been able to even stand up from my chair without triggering an anxious response and whining from Watson. I feel awful to say it but it’s been exhausting and really not the experience we expected when taking a dog home. Of course you have to take the bad with the good and the happy moments make you forget for a time what the issues are but it really does take it’s toll doesn’t it?
Watson has absolutely zero recall. For a dog who is incredibly food driven in the house, as soon as we leave the front door to go for a walk he has no interest at all in his treats no matter what I have tried. It’s been extremely difficult to train him as he is so scent driven and for a show cocker I suspect he has a working line as he is prey driven too. He pulls so hard on the lead that walking is not enjoyable , he would be happier off the lead but the one time we did let him off he took off at rapid speed and wasn’t seen again until 45 minutes later. Even then it took ages to catch him as he was leaping about in front of us as if to say ‘ catch me if you can! ‘
A lot of people have recommended behaviour therapy to me, which you could maybe look into in the hope of regaining some more freedom if you have a bit of a more relaxed , less anxious pup on your hands! But the road seems so long when you are just at the starting line and already feeling down trotted and tired!
-
I am no expert by any stretch of the imagination but this is how I read the situation....you say your husband has no bond with Watson and presumably as such shows little if any affection. Could it be that Watson picks up on this and is desperate for your husband to like him, what you see as an obsession with him is actually a cry for affection from the dog. Imo Watson is following him everywhere in order to befriend him. A very wise man who was a member of this group (Jeff...RIP) once told me via a PM chat that cockers hate to be ignored and that for them being ignored was the very worst form of correction.....that's my take on your situation.
Hi ips’ thank you for your thoughts and comments. I can’t even begin to say how much this forum has helped in terms of advice and being a sounding board. I completely appreciate where you are going with this, I had thought similar before... however my Husband does tend to give Watson a lot of attention despite his moans and groans as he is a softy at heart really and also he has me watching him to make sure he’s making an effort! Watson enjoys cuddles with him between work calls and lays with him on the couch at night. He also lays on his feet during the day while he is working from home however as someone mentioned, this may be fuelling the attention needing behaviour! :huh: :embarassed:
-
I am no expert by any stretch of the imagination but this is how I read the situation....you say your husband has no bond with Watson and presumably as such shows little if any affection. Could it be that Watson picks up on this and is desperate for your husband to like him, what you see as an obsession with him is actually a cry for affection from the dog. Imo Watson is following him everywhere in order to befriend him. A very wise man who was a member of this group (Jeff...RIP) once told me via a PM chat that cockers hate to be ignored and that for them being ignored was the very worst form of correction.....that's my take on your situation.
Hi ips’ thank you for your thoughts and comments. I can’t even begin to say how much this forum has helped in terms of advice and being a sounding board. I completely appreciate where you are going with this, I had thought similar before... however my Husband does tend to give Watson a lot of attention despite his moans and groans as he is a softy at heart really and also he has me watching him to make sure he’s making an effort! Watson enjoys cuddles with him between work calls and lays with him on the couch at night. He also lays on his feet during the day while he is working from home however as someone mentioned, this may be fuelling the attention needing behaviour! :huh: :embarassed:
Hi
Well it's an interesting one then 🙄 maybe it's just become a learned behaviour somehow. Maybe he will grow out of it. I remember my WC being an absolute pain at six months having said that she still is 🤣
-
I am no expert by any stretch of the imagination but this is how I read the situation....you say your husband has no bond with Watson and presumably as such shows little if any affection. Could it be that Watson picks up on this and is desperate for your husband to like him, what you see as an obsession with him is actually a cry for affection from the dog. Imo Watson is following him everywhere in order to befriend him. A very wise man who was a member of this group (Jeff...RIP) once told me via a PM chat that cockers hate to be ignored and that for them being ignored was the very worst form of correction.....that's my take on your situation.
Hi ips’ thank you for your thoughts and comments. I can’t even begin to say how much this forum has helped in terms of advice and being a sounding board. I completely appreciate where you are going with this, I had thought similar before... however my Husband does tend to give Watson a lot of attention despite his moans and groans as he is a softy at heart really and also he has me watching him to make sure he’s making an effort! Watson enjoys cuddles with him between work calls and lays with him on the couch at night. He also lays on his feet during the day while he is working from home however as someone mentioned, this may be fuelling the attention needing behaviour! :huh: :embarassed:
Hi
Well it's an interesting one then 🙄 maybe it's just become a learned behaviour somehow. Maybe he will grow out of it. I remember my WC being an absolute pain at six months having said that she still is 🤣
I think it’s possibly learnt - we did get him slightly later I suppose than what maybe other dog owners did eg he didn’t arrive with us until 4 months. I think he was possibly never left on his own before hand and maybe even had his litter mates for company so now he just can’t cope with the loneliness! Ah I just love him and the personality he has it’s just so incredibly difficult when you feel completely trapped and unable to do anything without it being a mission!
-
Definitely one of those times when you really wish they could speak! I was thinking about Watson since you last posted, and I did wonder about companionship. Aside from protesting when he is 'behind bars' :005: do you think he is generally more settled and happier with his doggy friend in the mix? You may well be onto something when you talk about him possibly having siblings for companionship until now. I definitely think this is fixable, and not wishing to be disrespectful, you will need a behaviourist to help.
-
I am no expert by any stretch of the imagination but this is how I read the situation....you say your husband has no bond with Watson and presumably as such shows little if any affection. Could it be that Watson picks up on this and is desperate for your husband to like him, what you see as an obsession with him is actually a cry for affection from the dog. Imo Watson is following him everywhere in order to befriend him. A very wise man who was a member of this group (Jeff...RIP) once told me via a PM chat that cockers hate to be ignored and that for them being ignored was the very worst form of correction.....that's my take on your situation.
Hi ips’ thank you for your thoughts and comments. I can’t even begin to say how much this forum has helped in terms of advice and being a sounding board. I completely appreciate where you are going with this, I had thought similar before... however my Husband does tend to give Watson a lot of attention despite his moans and groans as he is a softy at heart really and also he has me watching him to make sure he’s making an effort! Watson enjoys cuddles with him between work calls and lays with him on the couch at night. He also lays on his feet during the day while he is working from home however as someone mentioned, this may be fuelling the attention needing behaviour! :huh: :embarassed:
Hi
Well it's an interesting one then 🙄 maybe it's just become a learned behaviour somehow. Maybe he will grow out of it. I remember my WC being an absolute pain at six months having said that she still is 🤣
I think it’s possibly learnt - we did get him slightly later I suppose than what maybe other dog owners did eg he didn’t arrive with us until 4 months. I think he was possibly never left on his own before hand and maybe even had his litter mates for company so now he just can’t cope with the loneliness! Ah I just love him and the personality he has it’s just so incredibly difficult when you feel completely trapped and unable to do anything without it being a mission!
Sound's like yours is an extreme example of a normal cocker trait. My one is on me all day I can't go anywhere without out her and if I do she ain't happy, she just has to be with me all the time. I just accept that you "wear" a cocker.
-
As regards litter mates, our girl who is now 2 we thought would be fine with our other Cocker Spaniel, and tho after initial disbelief Topaz has settled beautifully with her and they get on like a house on fire....but even so when we go out she sits and yodels, doesnt help that we go out rarely, (both retired)so she doesnt really get the chance to get used to it.