CockersOnline Forum
Cocker Specific Discussion => Health => Topic started by: sal spring on July 13, 2009, 06:28:10 PM
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My vet has a policy of not speying bitches until 3 months after their first season so as to reduce their chances of becoming incontinent later. I have spoken to others who have had their girls speyed before their first season so as to eliminate the chance of them getting certain cancers. Also I am not so sure about spotting exactly the day when she first comes into season - I would hate to miss it and end up with a pregnant puppy. Please can you help with any advice.
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my vet recomments speying before the first season - which suits me down to the ground!
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There's a fair bit of debate on the 'ideal' age to spay a bitch and nobody can really say what it is. Some vets prefer to do it at 6 months as this does pretty much eliminate the risk of mammary cancer (as well as the usual cancers and pyometra which are ruled out by spaying) and most rescues will spay pups at 6 months if not sooner. Other vets prefer to wait until the dog is more mature and this is usually taken as being 3 months after their first season. Personally if I was having a bitch spayed I would go for the second option and let her mature and develop fully before being spayed; having one season does not increase the risk of mammary cancer by much at all compared to having no seasons. However this is just personal choice; as with most things it's really a matter of weighing up the pros and cons of each option and deciding which one suits you best.
If your girl comes into season she can't get pregnant on the first day, there's only certain window of time during the season where she will be receptive to males. Any boys which try it on before this are likely to get fairly short shrift from her.
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Hattie is being spayed next month, she has had her 1st season, it was just my personal choice to let her have a season. It was quite easy to tell Hattie was comming into season as she was cleaning her lady bits a lot.
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Hattie is being spayed next month, she has had her 1st season, it was just my personal choice to let her have a season. It was quite easy to tell Hattie was comming into season as she was cleaning her lady bits a lot.
This is a good help to me cos Lucy is 5 1/2 mths now and perhaps will have her 1st season anytime soon. It will give me something to look out for. My vet said she could be spayed 3 mth after her 1st season. Good luck with Hattie next month...
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All my girls have been spayed 3 months after the first season, gives them time to fully mature :blink:
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It does appear that various Vets have differing opinions on the best age/time to spay. :-\ Personally, i am in the wait until 3 months after their 1st season camp, and i agree with some other 's that feel it is best to wait until they are more mature.
You may notice a change in temperament before your bitch comes into season i.e she may be moody, appear tired or not herself. :-\ also her 'lady bits' the vulva area do swell beforehand. There is also a wide age range of when they have their first season, which could be approx. between 6 and 18 months. One of my girls was 11 mths old and my other was nearly 15 months old. So I wouldn't be constantly concerned about this as your girl may not have hers for quite a few months yet. :D You will probably see little spots of blood on your floor, when she does start, and to confirm for yourself that it is from her, then just get some plain white kitchen roll and place it on her area for a few seconds to double check.
I would just like to add i have been reading a very interesting post on another reputable dog forum and there is advice about Pyometra. It does mention that it is still possible for a spayed bitch to have Pyometra. :o :-\
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I would just like to add i have been reading a very interesting post on another reputable dog forum and there is advice about Pyometra. It does mention that it is still possible for a spayed bitch to have Pyometra. :o :-\
Sorry to sound a bit dense here Wendy but I thought Pyometra was an infection of the womb (i know there are 'open & closed pyos).....
now here's the dense bit ph34r.......isn't spaying the equivalent of a hysterectomy?.....where would the infection develop if there's no womb
......no laughing now ::) :shades:
Edited to add although I said womb I meant the doggie equivalent ;)
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It does appear that various Vets have differing opinions on the best age/time to spay. :-\ Personally, i am in the wait until 3 months after their 1st season camp, and i agree with some other 's that feel it is best to wait until they are more mature.
You may notice a change in temperament before your bitch comes into season i.e she may be moody, appear tired or not herself. :-\ also her 'lady bits' the vulva area do swell beforehand. There is also a wide age range of when they have their first season, which could be approx. between 6 and 18 months. One of my girls was 11 mths old and my other was nearly 15 months old. So I wouldn't be constantly concerned about this as your girl may not have hers for quite a few months yet. :D You will probably see little spots of blood on your floor, when she does start, and to confirm for yourself that it is from her, then just get some plain white kitchen roll and place it on her area for a few seconds to double check.
I would just like to add i have been reading a very interesting post on another reputable dog forum and there is advice about Pyometra. It does mention that it is still possible for a spayed bitch to have Pyometra. :o :-\
Thank you very much for your good advice. I have never heard of Pyometra so I'm glad lindseyp has asked the questions....I shall wait for your reply.... :D
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Please let your bitch have a season before spaying,some vets are now recommending its done very young sometimes as young as 4 months >:( TBH i think its cruel as the puppy is still mentally/physically immature. :'(
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I would just like to add i have been reading a very interesting post on another reputable dog forum and there is advice about Pyometra. It does mention that it is still possible for a spayed bitch to have Pyometra. :o :-\
Sorry to sound a bit dense here Wendy but I thought Pyometra was an infection of the womb (i know there are 'open & closed pyos).....
now here's the dense bit ph34r.......isn't spaying the equivalent of a hysterectomy?.....where would the infection develop if there's no womb
......no laughing now ::) :shades:
Edited to add although I said womb I meant the doggie equivalent ;)
This is my understanding of the possibility of a spayed bitch having pyometra:- because it is caused by a bacteria entering either the womb or womb stump and because the urethra enters the vagina, bacteria from a uti can travel back through the cervix, also bacteria from any diarrohea which comes into contact with the vulva. Because a spayed bitch isn't immune from these conditions, then it is still a possibility for an infection from those sources.
I must admit being a bit shocked about this but do think it makes sense. (if you want to pm me i will let you know where you can read more info on this)
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I spoke to my vet at length about spaying 2 weeks ago and he said pyometra is caused by the womb lining breaking down so I don't see how it can be possible to still get it after a spay. Maybe you were reading about keyhole spays where they only take the ovaries but even then I thought that without the ovaries they would not get pyometra. However please don't think I am doubting whoever wrote these comments I am just confused as to how they would get it. I will trot off in a mo to do some more research.
He also said its personal choice about age but he prefferred them to have one season. I have debated for a while what to do about spaying and have decided its the right thing to do ( with help from my vet and the lovely members of COL). the reasons being he said it reduces chances of mammary cancer, womb cancer, pyometra etc and generally spayed bitches live longer. I was worried about incontinence and he said he felt it was more about technique rather than the spay itself and that he had seen it but not in one of his spays, he had better be right!!!! I have to wait now until 3 months after their next seasons.
I read in a dog mag a few months ago about bone platelets not closing properly if spayed at a juvenile age but as my bitches are both older ( 2 and 16 months) it was not something I questioned him about. there were lots of negative reasons in the magazine to not have them done at a young age and I personally could not put a young puppy through it as they have so much growing up to do surely they need their sex hormones to help with this. but that is just my personal opinion.
I can tell when my girls are due, one gets very grumpy and usually they start to lick their lady bits more. they swell quite big and you will also see blood for a few days. Its later on in the season thats the danger time not the first few days.
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A spayed bitch can get what's called a 'stump pyometra' in remaining womb tissue where the main body of the uterus has been removed, it's not common and can be hard to diagnose as if a bitch is spayed then pyo is not normally suspected but it can still be very dangerous for them.
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Thanks Nicola, I was not aware of that , what a scary thought though. I wonder how common that is compared to normal pyometra?
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Thanks Nicola, I was not aware of that , what a scary thought though. I wonder how common that is compared to normal pyometra?
Ditto that from me too ;)
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I don't think it's particularly common and usually appears to be linked to hormones - such as if some ovarian tissue has also been left behind during spaying.
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I'm feeling pretty bad reading this because we made the decision to have Hattie spayed before her first season at about 7 months. She's actually registered with two vets because we're in London for work during the week and we had conflicting advice from them. It was a REALLY REALLY tough decision but in the end we decided to have it done early and it doesn't seem to have been a bad thing... She got over the operation really quickly and is just as slender, healthy and lovely as before and is continuing to grow up into a great dog (she's nearly a year old now)
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Cerinrich if Hattie is healthy and happy then you have no reason to feel bad. There is no right and wrong in this situation, you do what you feel is best for you and your dog. Plenty of dogs are spayed before their first season (like most rescue pups for a start) and grow up absolutely fine and likewise plenty are done afterwards and are equally ok. There are risks involved either way but you just have to weigh these up for yourself.
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My vet has a policy of not speying bitches until 3 months after their first season so as to reduce their chances of becoming incontinent later. I have spoken to others who have had their girls speyed before their first season so as to eliminate the chance of them getting certain cancers. Also I am not so sure about spotting exactly the day when she first comes into season - I would hate to miss it and end up with a pregnant puppy. Please can you help with any advice.
There is a thread about dogs in season and spotting the first signs
http://www.cockersonline.co.uk/discuss/index.php?topic=44072.0
I have done it both ways - My first dog Indie was speyed at 6 months and Misha was speyed after her first season. Can't say that I have seen any difference with regards to their health, but Misha is only 20months old, so probably to soon to tell if there is any effect. Misha didn't come into season until she was 12 months old, and it might be worth speaking to your breeder to see what age her dogs tend to come into season. I have to say I couldn't miss the fact that Misha had come into season (1) her personality changed, she was very clingy; (2) there was some blood spotting; (3) girly bits were really swollen.
I think in the end its a personal choice as to whether you do it before or after first season, as there seems to be valid arguments for both. My reasons for getting Misha speyed after her first season was that many people had said that the personality of the dog seemed to improve after a season, less clingy and more confident. Given that Misha showed signs of being fearful of other dogs as a pup I decided to let her have the first season. She isn't afraid of dogs at all now, but this could be due to the fact that I spent much more time socialising her with lots of other dogs, and also because Roly is very confident with other dogs and this could also have helped.
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havent been on here for a while, but just thought i would add that i had my Collie X speyed when she was just over 6 months old (ie: before her first season). She will be 13 yrs old in a couple of weeks and apart from the odd minor infection has always been completely. I would do the same again.
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Thank you 'supergir' I have found your thread very informative. mary :D
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Cerinrich... Don't feel bad. We had Honey spayed before her first season... it was the right decision for us at the time and while I sometimes wonder if she would have had the same level of grumpiness with other dogs through her adolescence had she been spayed later, I don't regret the decision... We may well make a different decision with a future dog, but we won't know until the time, as we won't know what other factors may influence the decision.
I did a lot of reading about the pros and cons of spaying at various ages, and it wasn't a decision I entered into lightly. Honey was nearly 7 months by the time she was spayed. It is a subject that will never get 100% agreement on, however I do think it is unnecessary to brand people cruel for opting for an early spay... :-\
Please let your bitch have a season before spaying,some vets are now recommending its done very young sometimes as young as 4 months >:( TBH i think its cruel as the puppy is still mentally/physically immature. :'(