CockersOnline Forum
Cocker Specific Discussion => Health => Topic started by: mel1961red on January 25, 2010, 06:56:55 PM
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Hi Just Taken Bailey for an 8 month check and to book him in for castration and vet thinks he may have a heart murmur all be it shes not sure as he was shaking so much and as she said if its there its only a grade 1 and not to worry , but I really am worried and you know how it is I asked nothing at the time but when I got home thought I should have asked lots of questions, she did say that they would listen more when he was under for his castration Op but now I'm worried about the anaesthetic he shops no signs of anything wrong no panting no tiredness and has soo much energy I wanted to ask and I know its different for all, but can they go away? Do they get progressively worse what can they do for him? etc etc also when he lays on my lap I can always feel his heart beating on my leg and wondered about it as it doesn't beat evenly like I thought dogs did, would I be able to know that without a stethescope or do all dogs have heartbeats like that I am so worried now Ive only had him since August and he is my first Cocker, it took me a year to get over loosing my last dog which was a miniature daschund whom I spent over £1000 on a back operation at 6 years old and nursed him back to walking again he went on to live another 7 years after so it was well worth it. I don't seem to get much luck with animals and couldn't bear the fact of loosing Bailey at an early age any advice welcome I love this sight it has helped me so much and is a comforting as a vets visit sometimes to put your mind at rest hopefully they would have told me if he wasn't up to having the anaesthetic before they do his castration but she did only say it was very very quiet
Please Help
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This is exactly what they said about Kali and that she nearly missed it, it was so minor. Kali gets really excited at the vets and whines and cries and two lovely ladies here on COL told me that sometimes that can mimic a murmur or can be mistaken for one. Kali is almost four and her murmur has stayed the same.....if indeed it exists! Try not to worry xxx
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I was one of the lovely ladies ( :shades: ) that said that to Sheryl - to be perfectly honest if Bailey was trembling so much in fear it is HIGHLY likely this stress was causing the erratic heartbeat. Please don't worry too much - I don't know if your vet would be able to examine him at your car to check his heartbeat again to see if there was indeed a murmur?
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Try not to worry, it is most possible that the stress of being in the vets caused the erratic heartbeat however incidently my old boy had a heart murmour diagnosed when he was around 3 years old and he went on til he was 17 and the heart murmour didn't get any worse throughout his life. When have you got the castration booked for? Perhaps it would be a good idea to get Bailey re-checked to put your mind at rest if you have a while to wait. I know its easier said than done but please try not to worry too much.
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Please try not to worry, it could be that Bailey got himself worked up being at the vets, thereby causing the erratic heartbeat.
My last dog had a grade 1-2 heart murmur all his life, it was only when reached 12 that the vet decided to put him on some heart medication. In the end it was the side effects of medication for HD that caused his death.
When the vet told me about the murmur I was so upset and worried whether he would be able to live a full life - but he was fine and lived a normal life.
Sometimes when we went to the vet, his murmur sounded worse, but that was because he used to get himself so worked up being there.
My dog underwent anaesthetic for a large operation on his elbow, and also to remove a retained testicle - he was fine both times.
Hope this helps.
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I would also say try not to worry. :shades: It could be Bailey was stressed/anxious in the Vets & 'appeared' to have a Heart Murmur. Also, the Vet told you not to worry. If i remember correctly Heart Murmurs are graded 1 - 5 :huh: 1 being the least concern. Believe me, if your Vet was worried, he would be referring Bailey to a Specialist. ;)
My Vet once told me Alfie had a slight heart murmur (when he was about 3), not to worry etc.. then the next time he checked him over he didn't have a heart murmur ::) :blink:
At the time i did feel annoyed the vet had us worried but obviously pleased that Alfie was fine (really think it was the stress of visiting the vets, he does get very nervous there).
If you are still worried you can ask to be referred to a Specialist, but hopefully if/when your Vet checks him again, and as Helen said it would be a good idea if the vet can come out to your car to do this, then Bailey will probably be absolutely fine. :luv:
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My last cocker was diagnosed with a heart murmer when he was young and went on to live a healthy and active life - we finally lost him aged almost 12 due to another condition. It never once caused him any bother. I agree with what the others say, try not to worry about Bailey, perhaps the vet will be able to put your mind at rest at his next check up :luv:
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My last cocker, Sophie, was diagnosed with a heart murmur when she was a year old. She lived until she was 14 years of age, on no medication and was still walking up to 7 miles at a time 3 weeks before she died.
I am sure that Bailey will be just the same.
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Thank you every one as I said the vet said she will check him in the 15th of Feb when hes under as she will have a better idea then
as he wont be so stressed just hope its nothing serious
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Some murmurs can come and go, and all are graded from 1 to 6 (6 being the worst). Most minor mumurs do not generally require any medical treatment and would just be monitored.
The main thing to be aware of is keeping your dog as healthy as you can so that his heart will be less stressed should it be that he does have a murmur, so keeping his weight low, giving him good food, stable home and exercise will help him stay in optimum health.
Stress during examinations can sometimes mimic the sound of a minor heart murmur particularly when we are talking about a grade 1.
It is a good idea to remind the vet that she was going to recheck his heart rate under GA as that should conclude what is or isn't there. Personally re heart specialists I'd only persue that route should my dog be displaying symptoms of a compromised circulatory system.
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Thanks for advice do you think I could tell if he had one as when he lies on my lap I can feel his heart beat though my leg and it doesnt what I call bet at a regular pace but do dogs hearts beat like that any way ?
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No probably not. Its a typical whooshing sound that can be heard through a stethoscope.
My husband has a small heart murmur but if you were to feel his pulse it feels regular.
The main thing here is your dog is running around being very active doing all the usual doggy things so even if he has a murmur it is not affecting his quality of life and if it remains low grade likely never will. Most murmurs detected in pups disappear with the first year of life and some dogs born without murmurs can develop them later on so unless he has symptoms its unlikely any treatment will be prescribed.
Keep him active, slim and healthy and his chances are as good as anyone else for leading a long and happy life.
If I were you as this clearly is a worry to you, when he goes in for his op, or even beforehand have another consultant with a vet and have with you a list of questions that you'd like answering so that you feel happier about it all.
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Hi
People will be getting sick of reading my worries, as you can see by my previous post Bailey has a possible heart Murmur hes 8 months and is going to be castrated soon and vet picked it up on check up, its come to light that although I thought I did the right thing in taking Bailey from a lady that had two very young children and then got pregnant again so couldn't cope that I may have acted in haste. I brought Bailey for a considerable amount of money from her and was told she got him from a breeder but there were no papers for him (I know how stupid I was now) but I would never change him and don't regret getting him.
My thoughts are now that if indeed he has this murmur he was probably born with it and maybe thats why he had no papers. Are there any other tests that I should ask the vet to do to discount other things do you think, as maybe this breeder was pulling the wool. I collected him from this Lady's house and her reason was genuine for letting him go so I know it wasn't her, but now I'm worried about other tests that maybe I should have to check him, as hes going to be put out soon should they be done whilst he is under?
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I've merged the thread asking about tests with the original heart murmur thread as they're both on the same subject.
Personally I would say that there isn't really any need to have tests done on Bailey, from the original post the vet said that he has a possible heart murmur but it could just have been the stress of being at the vet and even if he does have one it's a grade 1 which is very minor. I would ask the vet to give him a general check up and to re-check his heart when you take him in to be castrated in a couple of weeks so you'll know if he actually has a heart murmur or not but even if he does a grade 1 murmur is unlikely to need any medical treatment or affect his life. You can speak to your vet about your concerns but try not to get too stressed about things that may not even be there ;)
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I agree with Nicola.
Lots of young pups are picked up as having heart murmurs and they do grow out of them, most fairly quickly. Having a heart murmur is not a reason for a dog not having papers, thats a separate issue, they may be lost, he may never have been registered by the breeder are most likely reasons. Anyone who buys a pup has the same anxieties as you and we all head to the vets for a check up. Most check ups include vet looking in eyes, ears, mouth for problems, feeling pups legs and how good his movements are so highlighting joint problems, checking their genitals and bottoms and listening to their heart and lungs, which I've no doubt is what your vet did for your pup. If you have not considered insurance then now is a good time to get him insured as it will mean less worries financially should there be problems with him in the future, if he isn't already insured then the heart murmur will be excluded for the time being, but usually if he has been heart murmur free for 12 mths then it will then be covered.
No one will be sick of your questions, you are trying to do the best for your dog.
As for full investigations to check for other problems, if your vet does a thorough check then consider him fit and enjoy him whilst you can, but that goes for us all.
Hope this helps.
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Paddy has just had a murmur (graded at 2 on a scale of 1 to 6) diagnosed at age 4. I was told not to worry.
As someone else has posted, you can't hear an irregular heartbeat - it's a whooshing sound in the middle of the beat - so instead of "da-dum, da-dum, da-dum" you can hear a faint "da-whoosh-dum, da-whoosh-dum". Vet told me what to listen for and gave me the stethoscope to listen to it. I've lain on sofa with Paddy wrapped up on my and put my ear to his chest and can just hear it. It's the valve not closing properly, I think, and that's what the "whoosh" is mid-beat.
HTH.
Denise
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Hi All
Thought I would update you after Baileys Castration op, as its been three long days now any way the upshot is when we arrived for the pre med he was checked and his heart listened to and guess what no heart murmur OMG I'm so relieved and she got a good listen both sides as well, the Op went well and when I picked him up you would never had known he had been under the knife as he was bouncing around all over the place I have slept with him for three nights as they couldn't find a collar to fit him and I was back the next evening as he was nibbling at them and it was on the verge of an infection so now on antibiotics. Considering he cant go out for proper walks hes been really good and its now healing up nicely though I'm worn out as you don't sleep as well any way been up the Pets at Home Store today and got him a lampshade as at some point hes going to have to be left . I would like to thank everyone for their support as it really frightened me when I thought he had this murmur, glad the ops over as well and cant wait till I can take him out on his walks again where he can run and run like he loves as hes a working cocker and needs to run.
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Pleased everything went well for Bailey, must be such a relief for you. :D
Hoping Bailey will soon be out and about on his walks. :luv:
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Thats good news for you. :D
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That is the best news ever!! So happy for you xxx :blink: :blink:
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Fantastic news, you must be so relieved :luv:
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So pleased for Bailey & you. :luv:
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I'm glad the news is good.
Just to reassure you a little; my first cocker, Niki, was passed to me when he was a few months old - no idea how old, with no papers of any sort, let alone KC, he suffered from gastro enteritis because he raided the rubbish and had a mild heart murmour all his life. To be honest we often didn't get or give him his heart tablets - mum was in charge in those days and he stayed with both us and my brother so he just got on with it.
He lived to a ripe old age of around 12 and a half ish - well we had him just over 12 years, and he still had a grade 1 heart murmour at the end.
Today I wouldn't suggest dogs with no papers but saying that not every dog that is unregistered is bound to have nasty diseases. It is pot luck and hopefully your baby will be quite healthy. Try and give him a good diet - it can only help him! :blink:
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So pleased all ok :luv: x
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Excellent news...hope Bailey is back to full fitness super soon :luv:
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Great news for you :luv:
Pleased his operation is all over and he is resting up :005: :luv:
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Thanks so much for all you lovely comments Bailey is back to himself and Im glad to say that after 5 days he still has all his stitches a miracle !!!
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Yay, wtg Bailey....now just stop worrying your Mum :luv: