viewing a pup without Mum. . .

[Joules]

Please don't go - the whole thing sounds dodgy to me.  Unless you can speak to her original breeder to clear up these questions, it sounds more likely that this is a front for a puppy farm    I know you are torn but please do not be swayed by your heart unless you are 100% sure you are not perpetuating these dubious breeding practices  

Good luck - the right pup is out there for you and if you are already in touch with a reputable breeder you are almost there 

[vanessa]

Thanks Joules

you have all been so kind. . .

[Cayley]

If you haven't done so already, have a read of this link that explains what to look for in a reputable breeder  .

http://www.cockersonline.co.uk/discuss/index.php?topic=2019.0

[wrenside]

Hi Vanessa,
Sounds like an absolute minefield to me, and I'm afraid like everyone else I'd suggest that you don't go any further with this little pup. 
Puppy farming is an absolutely awful trade and unfortunately the only way to stop it is if the demand for farmed pups is stopped, and that means that pups like Megan should not be bought, however hard it is to turn your back it's for the best. 
A puppy bred from a reputable breeder should be the bench mark for every potential puppy buyer as it helps ensure that the welfare of the individual pup, it's parents and the breed as a whole is upheld. Also as a buyer you will be given a lifetimes worth of support from the breeder, which is invaluable for a first time dog owner, and still very useful and important for experienced dog owners.
From a repuatbly bred pup you will also be able to trace back it's ancestry and have a better idea of any inherited conditions or behavioural problems (which should have been minimised through health tests).
If the gentleman that has Megan at the moment is very ill and has been for a while, then I very much doubt Megan will have come from a reputable breeder in the first place, as the man would have been considered as not being able to offer a good home. Also like others have said a reputable breeder would have taken the pup back or helped in finding a new good home for the pup without question.

Give your local dog warden a call and explain the situation with Megan and they may investigate, so try and help Megan in that way, but do not buy her 

Stick with the reputable breeder you know and get a pup from their litter, as you will be garanteeing your boys a healthy, confident, well socialised little pup with all the friendly back up you could possible want. Maybe disscuss Megan's situation with the reputable breeder, so that they may be able to keep an eye on her and possibly help with her situation.

Good luck with getting your first puppy and whatever you choose to do, you will always have friendly advice from us on this forum to help you 

Best wishes

Mary 

[vanessa]

Thank you Mary
what great advice, I will speak to the breeder I'm going to see as she lives not far away from this chap who owns Megan. I feel I have to do something to help, and you are right, it seems dodgy, she wouldn't have been sold to a man who is physically incapacitated, especially if he has other dogs. I have been naive to even enter into conversation with him, but this is all a learning curve for me. I knew coming on this forum would help and I am so glad I did   

[emilyjw]

I think most of us have learnt an awful lot from this forum, one thing is just how addictive it is 

Good luck

[wrenside]

Hi Vanessa,
yes of course you should want to help Megan and I'm sure everyone on this forum will try and help you help her  Just don't buy her because that will simply free up another space for another puppy farmed pup to fill and then it'll just carry on and on. 
Do talk to the breeder of the reputably bred pups as I'm sure they'd want to know about any potential puppy farming going on in the area and may well take an active interest in Megan's situation and help sort it out without helping to fund the puppy farming industry. Some of the people on this forum run dog rescues and I'm sure they'll be able to offer some more specific advice on ways to help Megan, without buying her. They're also the people who get the puppy farmed pups dumped on them when they get past their cute fluffy stage, but the positive thing about rescue centres is that they do make sure that all the dogs they rehome go to good homes and they also don't in any way fund puppy farming. Maybe Megan will find her way to a rescue centre, in which case all of us on this site will know about it and probably offer her a home, giving the donation money to the right people and to a cause which will help other dogs 

Megan is very lucky to have someone like you looking out for her and I'm sure her situation will be resolved with your help 

So as a plan of action I would go and see the reputably bred litter with your boys, ask the breeder lots of questions about health testing, the pedigree, the parents etc... and be prepared to be asked equally as many questions about you and your home etc.. by the breeder, meet the mum of the pups, make sure the pups are show cockers rather than working type (if show is what you want) and then if you are happy with everything think about choosing a particular pup.
Then I would talk with the breeder about Megan's situation and tell the breeder the location of Megan and who the owner is. The breeder will more than likely be as concerned as you are about the situation and may well have knowledge of local people or services which may be able to help. The fact that you've identified a possibly farmed pup in the area and not dived in to buy her will also show the breeder that you're a serious puppy buyer who has done their homework and has the welfare of the dog at heart, I'm sure they'll aid you in helping Megan as much as you possibly can. 


Good luck

Best wishes

Mary

[kellyjayne]

Hi Vanessa, I havn't got anything to add that hasn't already been said, but just wanted to say good luck 

[Gilly]

I agree with everything that has already been said. I would like to add DO NOT keep your children off school to go and see a puppy. I will tell you why 
I had a local couple buy a puppy off me in March and they made the most sensible decision when choosing their puppy. They did NOT bring their children with them the first time they came  They wanted to make sure they liked me (as a breeder), they also wanted to make sure they were a 100% about their decision without the pressure of their children. We had a chance to have a really good chat, they picked the puppy, not the children and then they came back 3 days later with the children to 'introduce'z them to the puppy they had picked and they all chose a name for him. They all came back everytime they came to see him until he was ready to go home but I had a lot of respect for this family for being so sensible 

[Joules]

I agree with everything that has already been said. I would like to add DO NOT keep your children off school to go and see a puppy. I will tell you why 
I had a local couple buy a puppy off me in March and they made the most sensible decision when choosing their puppy. They did NOT bring their children with them the first time they came  They wanted to make sure they liked me (as a breeder), they also wanted to make sure they were a 100% about their decision without the pressure of their children. We had a chance to have a really good chat, they picked the puppy, not the children and then they came back 3 days later with the children to 'introduce'z them to the puppy they had picked and they all chose a name for him. They all came back everytime they came to see him until he was ready to go home but I had a lot of respect for this family for being so sensible 

This sounds like really excellent advice - the children should only see the puppy once you have decided it is right for you    Imagine the pressure if you decided that this breeder was not right for you for whatever reason    I would certainly wait and take them the second time once you have decided and are happy with the breeder and pup.     I know they are excited but they will see the pup soon enough   

[CraftySam]

I agree with what has been said 100%. Going to see Megan would spell disaster because it would be sooo incredibly difficult to walk away. You have to remember that there are reasons for this guy wanting to sell her without papers, at a reduced rate and by spinning a tall tale. She's likely to be puppy farmed, could have health and temperament problems. You own a dog for a very long time, could be 14yrs or more and thats a long time with a dog that has alot of problems.

I agree with Gilly's suggestion too.  I know how hard it would be for me to walk away after seeing a litter let alone if I had children begging and pleading to have one!

I feel I have to do something to help, and you are right, it seems dodgy, she wouldn't have been sold to a man who is physically incapacitated, especially if he has other dogs. I have been naive to even enter into conversation with him, but this is all a learning curve for me. I knew coming on this forum would help and I am so glad I did   

Now I do not think that this man is in anyway genuine in the story he is telling you, or that you mean anything untoward by your comment above.    Just thought you might like to know that it is possible for people in wheelchairs and who are physically incapacitated to own and look after their dogs perfectly well.
I use an electric wheelchair most of the time and crutches the rest, and have had four reputable breeders sell puppies to me! I have four dogs, who I devote all my time to looking after and they get all the exercise and care they should and would from an able bodied person. Now thats not to say that every person with a disability will be in my position, but I know that it is a common misconception that any person with a disability can own a dog successfully.
Obviously this guy knows how to pull at people's heart strings with this story/reason for selling his puppy which is another reason to avoid him like the plague! Think about it, he already owns dogs and therefore he knows what effort it takes to look after a dog.....it should be no great surprise to him! And if he's going with the fact his dogs don't get on with the 14 week old pup, sometimes it can take alot longer than 6 weeks for a dog to accept another dog/pup coming into the family. So with either story it just doesn't add up! Stay Away!!!!! 

[*Adele*]

I can't really add to what has been said already, some fantastic advise without a shadow of a doubt! We were slightly different, we took our two kids to see a backyard breeder and somebody who wanted their bitch to have one litter before having her spayed! I wanted to be sure that OH and the kids were happy in the presence of a cocker puppy and I wasn't bothered about wasting these peoples times if I'm honest! My daughter who was 4 at the time was hooked on a puppy from each breeder but I explained to her why we wouldn't be getting a puppy from either place and she took this very well!

I also fell for a couple of these pups and it would have been easy to fall for them but I stuck to my guns and waited for the right breeder and puppy! It was well worth it!

[vanessa]

Thank you to everyone for their comments.All really useful, won't bring the boys with me after consideration!  Craftysam. . . PLEASE do not be offended by my posting, I  maybe didn't word it in the correct way and I am deeply sorry. Its just that if the guy was genuine; I did wonder how he was managing, he told me what was wrong with him is all. I don't want to upset anyone on my first day of posting and I will need all your invaluable advice in the coming months. So once again Im sorry. . . .

[wrenside]

Hi Vanessa,
don't worry about your post, I'm sure everyone understood your concerns about the owners sutability for a young pup was based on what he'd told you and not a generalised misconception. Like Crafty Sam has said people who are disabled can give very good homes to pups, but the fact that Megan's owner is trying to use his health situation to explain the reason for the sale is very suspicious, and the origional breeder, if reputable, would have taken the pup back from him by now, so it looks like Megan is a puppy farmed dog 

Please don't feel that you've upset anyone, Crafty Sam is only making sure that the record is straight about the fact that people with disabilities can offer very good homes to pups, I'm sure no one thought that you were trying to offend anyone 

I think that's a good decision not to take the boys along with you for the first visit to see the litter of puppies, it should help give you some really valuable one on one time with the breeder in order to really sus out whether the breeder and litter are right for you, and of course have a chat about Megan 

Good luck, and do keep us updated! Have you got any photos of the litter from the breeder? 

Best wishes

Mary

[Jane S]

Just wanted to update this thread to say I've now remembered where I've seen the photo sent to Vanessa and it's a library pic of an English Springer used on the KC website to advertise their Puppy Sales List - it's not even a Cocker puppy Just goes to show how careful you have to be.....