crate hell

[Karma]

I suspect the issue this weekend was that she could hear stuff was going on and wanted to be involved.  It's hard for a young inquisitive mind to be excluded from stuff that's happening...
However there are plenty of dogs who happily learn that they need to spend some time apart from the family, even when they are in the house.

I don't think you are crating too long - and I've certainly never heard that you shouldn't put a pup in the crate asleep... She gets a good break between the morning and afternoon, and you say that she is generally happy to go in there.
I do think, perhaps, when you are about, that it might be better to try a stake or similar so that she can be in the garden with you, but not getting in the way... that way she's not going to learn that being in the crate means she's missing out on stuff...  

Generally speaking, as a working cocker, the earlier you can get in with some additional mental stimulation the better... you will prevent the sorts of problems that can arise through lack of stimulation (destuctiveness etc).  Gundog training is good as it will harness her natural abilities (and you can start the basics at a young age).  When she is older, agility is also a fun thing to try.  Also just basic clicker training (for fun tricks etc) can be hugely rewarding and good fun for you and your dog.  

Honey is 3/4 working cocker - she is left through the day when I am at work.  I get home at lunch, though sometimes only for 30 mins (normally it's nearer an hour).  We don't crate her when we are out (she is left a bit longer than your pup - and was as a pup), but she is confined to particular rooms - this was our compromise due to the length of time we were looking at leaving her.  However she definately looks forward to being left... we recently had a week off and she was exhausted at having the consant company, so dogs definately do adjust to different routines as long as they receive quality attention when they do have company!  

[JaspersMum]

Mine are not crated (other than open crate they can go in if they want) but they are shut into a safe room when I'm at work.  They are fine (unless the cat sits on the roof) whilst I'm out but I'm sure they'd be very vocal about being shut in and knowing that I was at home.  Hopefully that's all it is and normal service will soon be resumed.

Having said that Charlie hated his crate but has always been fine crated at shows 

[mooching]

I do agree that mine settle when Im not in much better than when i am. I couldnt for example put them in in order to do the housework (not that id need to).

I'm thinking that that might well be the reason that the OP's puppy didn't settle that Saturday when she was out at work and her dh was in the garden. The puppy likely knew he was there and wanted to be around him.

Its also worth noting my dogs have ALOT of hobbies. Both are going through obedience classes and basic gun dog. As well as me privately teaching them Rally obedience and heel work to music. We also do agility with the oldest and are looking into flyball. And somewhere in that we manage to help organise group dog walks.

This is a major major consideration/difference IMO. Your dogs have plenty to stimulate and occupy both their bodies and their minds - so, therefore, as you say, when they are in their crates, it's their "chill" time.

I'd definitely want to encourage the OP to do more training and activity with her puppy, especially basic gundog training (how old were yours when they started this?)

[Sarah1985]

My oldest started at a year but my youngest has been doing it from being tiny (privartely). I dont do any  formal classes as none of the clubs round here use methods i agree with. However we have one to ones once a month to give us things to teach them before the next class and we practice about once a week.

I believe the classes round here take puppys from 6 months but i suspect that has alot to do with the use of chock chains rather than a puppy being incapable of the activities any younger.

[haygar]

I just want to say that ive slept on a few issues and think maybe i was a little harsh on those trying to help me. i do apologise

Im just finding Daisy really really hard work if im totally honest. She has started her biting again , she doesnt do a thing you tell her to do or not to do more like it. she growls and snacks at you when you stop her from doing things she wants to do and then the crate issues started( from no where) so just a bit fed up. Especially as ive never had a dog before and just want to do the best for her. I love her to bits and would not part with her for anything now. I know its all puppy behavior and i find it amusing most of the time but lately she has caused quite alot of damage to our home and garden/yard (that is not that big) and think i was just having an off day yesterday.

I will definatley look into more training for her and we had already discussed doing agility courses with her when shes a bit older and whistle training.and she is already enrolled on the course after puppy classes..

Last night we went down beach and she was retrieving her ball from her launcher bringing it back and dropping it for a treat  so its moments like those you feel are worth it. its just a big learning curve for me, OH  and Daisy but im sure well get there.....

regards

[Karma]

Take heart.... as someone said earlier, she is approaching the age when adolescence can kick in, and a lot of the behaviour  you describe is typical adolescent behaviour. 
When Honey was in her adolescence, she was certainly more destructive than in her puppyhood... especially as secondary teething (the back teeth bedding in) can give a serious NEED to chew extensively....  she would devour Paddywack sticks in seconds (she takes her time with them now) and she just needed something to chomp on.  This was when she destroyed our sofa bed matress, but chewing holes in it and unstuffing it.... 

Also pushing previously accepted boundaries and generally turning a deaf ear are pretty common at this age.  Just take a deep breathe and remember the good times... if a training session isn't going well, stop it, and just play some games.... keep enjoying your dog, and you will get through the other side with a lovely adult dog!!! 

[Sarah1985]

Sorry if i was stroppy to.

 I do get alot of critism from follow dog owners about the hours my 2 are locked in crates for and I can get very defensive. Everyone situation is different and its about finding the balance that works for the individual and their dog(s).

Dont worry Haygar your doing great and you just need to hang on in through what is undoubtable the worst age (behavior wise) in a dog life.

My oldest can be a nightmare at somethings (namely ball stealing  )and i think every dog has a different naughty behaviour. Just enjoy the good times and you'll get there with the bad things (or so im told)

[mlynnf50]

Hello Hagar,  I think your little one is about the same age as Selby, and sounds to me is behaving just the same, I think they are reaching the "teenage years" Selby always did as he was asked like sitting and stay but now its like i am talking to myself, it just reminds me of when the children were teenages, so hang in there my children and now lovely responsible adults so we can just hope that the same will happen.  He also is trying it on all the time, pushing boundaries, but the other side of the coin is that he will now give cuddles that we couldn't get when he was younger so that just makes it all worth while, he goes in his crate most of the time with the door open, we thought we were doing something wrong as he never came out for a cuddle.

 if we are outside we put him on a long lead with a stake in the ground and he is fine, although OH keeps telling him he doesn't need the help he keeps offering.  If we are at home he is free to go in and out of his crate when ever he likes, but at the moment he is sat under my chair, but IF we go out he goes in his cage
and in the car he travels in his crate.

Good luck with the training.