CockersOnline Forum
Cocker Specific Discussion => Puppies => Topic started by: sweeps mum on July 26, 2004, 08:30:04 PM
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Our blue roan boy Sweep is now five and a half months old and has become increasingly darker as time has gone on. When we look at photos of him at 8 weeks he was mostly grey but now he's lost his white star and is almost black all over. Is this usual? Will he akter in colour again?
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It's funny you should say that, as we were looking at photo's of Molly as a puppy at the weekend and she was very pale on her body, with a few black patches, and now she is very dark blue roan, very lovely I might add! :wink:
So I'm not sure all pup's do this but Molly did! :lol:
Lizzy Molly and Evie
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Cooper is 7 months and the same thing has happened with him :wink: Once the the puppy fluff is stripped out you will be able to see sweeps markings clearly again. I spent about an hour stripping the fluff out of Cooper's head yesterday (while he slept :roll: :) ) and his star has reappeared. It takes a long time and if I hadn't had the chance to watch Gilly in action (she started off his head for me) I'd still be pulling like a sissy :lol: :lol: We're getting there now though! :) Sweep will soon have his lovely roan colouring back :P
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Another Chameleon blue-roan owner here. Pickle was pale grey when he was teeny, and had clear black patches on his back. He's now 9 months, and when he needs a haircut he looks like a black dog, as his fluff grows in very dark and covers up all the silvery tones.
He's been to the groomer today, and what a transformation! He's silvery grey again, with his lovely black patches back on display!
So, in total agreement with Shirley - the roan colouring will still be there, it's just hiding under the puppy coat :wink:
Emma and silvery-grey Pickle xx
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Can only reiterate what's been said. Had the same with Jasper :lol:
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We have seen Molo's colour change in the 4 weeks since we first 'met' him :o .
We had a preference for a 'Dark' roan (although to be honest, I would have been happy with any colour, even purple, as long as he was healthy and happy :lol: ) and the breeder advised us not to look at the puppy fur, cos when they are tiny they are very light, but to look at the skin pigment under the fur as this gives a better idea of final hair colour. Molo has dark skin on his tummy, and sure enough the white fur he had under there at 4 weeks has changed to a really dark colour over the last four weeks.
You can also see a difference in his facial fur if you compare the 6 week and 8 week piccies in the gallery.
I'm looking forward to seeing how he will change over the next few months!
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we noticed that bellas fur dident stop changing colour till nearly a year so hes probably just a very dark blue roan ,i think they call this steel grey ?
Blue roan pups always start out mainly white with a few black patches and get darker as they get older some end up light some really dark like my girl .
Once his puppy fluff comes out you will probably see sweep has lovely markings but still the lovely deep colour :wink:
This is bella when she was 7 months or so old http://www.cockersonline.co.uk/photo/New-R...ad_hair_day_001 (http://www.cockersonline.co.uk/photo/New-Rogues/bad_hair_day_001)
:shock: she had terrible fluff at that age as you can see :roll:
and How she turned out after all that :lol:
http://www.cockersonline.co.uk/photo/Parti...olours/scan0005 (http://www.cockersonline.co.uk/photo/Particolours/scan0005)
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This is normal - the roans always darken as they mature. Our Gem was white all over except for a black spot near her tail and one on her head - now she is nicely roaned all over and has black legs!
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I love the black legs, Linda......Molo's sire has these, and they also run through the males on his dames side too; they are such a rich colour, almost like velvet - beautiful!
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Hi
Just wanted to say that it's the same for oranges too. Molly was almost entirely white with orange ears when we got her at 7 weeks but now (a year later) she has a lot of roaning on her back and gorgeous orange freckles on her face. Beautiful :lol: but then I would say that :D
Cheers
Tracey & Molly
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Silas has really darkened too.He's 16 weeks now and is almost entirely black apart from a bit of grey on his legs and bum!!He did start off life with just a black patch on one shoulder and one on his back just above his tail.Cant wait to see what the grown up version will look like.
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Ollie, our orange roan, is now 10 weeks and is much darker than when he was born. His colours have been getting visibly darker and more widespread by the day, and I expect he will carry on altering as he matures. He looks gorgeous though, and I can't wait to see what he'll look like when he's a 'man'. :D
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I love the black legs, Linda......Molo's sire has these, and they also run through the males on his dames side too; they are such a rich colour, almost like velvet - beautiful!
Hi Rachel
I agree with you about the black legs and it does seem to be prevalent in certain lines I've noticed! Wonder who Molo's sire was and whether there is a common denominator? Gem's are inherited from her sire's line was Reinots Renoir JW but he goes back to Avandora Ladykiller.
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I love the black legs too :) They are often seen in the Bitcon line & also in lines which go back to Cilleine Echelon - Hightrees breeding lies behind most Bitcons & also Echelon so this could be the common denominator maybe (think I'm right that there will be a lot of Bitcon in Molo's pedigree?)
Jane
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I love the black legs too :) They are often seen in the Bitcon line
It's where Jasper's comes from - I've looked through his predecessors and you can see the colour pattern coming through :wink:
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That is interesting about the origins of the black legs Jane! :D You're right I'm sure because she does have Cilleine Echelon a few times in her pedigree and some Hightrees breeding and some Bitcon ancestry!
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Quite right Jane, Molo has a Bitcon sire (Columbo at Islanza) although I don't have his full pedigree on his sires side (yet, :wink: ) and he also has Bitcon on his Dames side, as his Grandsire, Glowhill Rob Roy (who appears in many COL pedigree's I believe :) ), was sired by a Bitcon.
Jane, I haven't heard of Hightree or Echelon before; do you have any further info? I admit to being a bit of a 'family tree' buff, and have challenged myself to see how far back I can trace Molo's pedigree :shock:
Thanks
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love the black legs too They are often seen in the Bitcon line & also in lines which go back to Cilleine Echelon - Hightrees breeding lies behind most Bitcons & also Echelon so this could be the common denominator maybe (think I'm right that there will be a lot of Bitcon in Molo's pedigree?)
Neo's Great Great Grand Sire was Cilleine Echelon, however there is alot of black & white in his line so I guess that's why he's light blue and spotted!!
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Jane, I haven't heard of Hightree or Echelon before; do you have any further info? I admit to being a bit of a 'family tree' buff, and have challenged myself to see how far back I can trace Molo's pedigree :shock:
Hightrees was a well-known Cocker kennel back in the 1960s/1970's - you'll find a bitch called Hightrees Love Serenade back in the pedigree of many well-known Bitcons such as Sh Ch Bitcon Troubador. Sh Ch Cilleine Echelon was one of the top Cockers in the 80's - he did a lot of winning in the show ring & also was a successful sire. If you have a copy of Joyce Caddy's "Cocker Spaniels Today", you'll find a photo of him on p91. His sire was Hightrees Sweetalk of Lochranza who was also the sire of one of the early Bitcon Champions, Sh Ch Bitcon Babycham.
Tracing Cocker family trees is fascinating - you'll be able to find quite a bit of info out by entering names into Google & seeing what comes up (many breeders have pedigrees on their websites). If you get stuck, just ask as quite a few of us have extensive pedigree databases & old records etc :)
Jane
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Yes your right about the black legs being in the lines , bella has these its funny because they all stop at the exact same point , her mother was pet named socks because of this :lol:
We have lots of bitcons in there .. troubador , moonlight, after dark , blue cascade, shy talk ,siver reble, pacific blue , shytalk blue cascade and a load more .
We have cilliens in there too echlon and hightrees love serenade , pinkyburn pedomiter( dont know where they got that name from :lol: )and Sweetalk of Lochranza . normanviews midnight runner of classicway . crosbiean cascade , deanwood star venture , >mistfall meddler also had black legs ,
I have a bit of info on the echlon lines , i will let you know when i find my list of history . Ive missplaced it at the moment :roll: but when i get my hands on it ill pm you :)
I have a few pictures on my pedigree http://groups.msn.com/ukenglishcockers/you...urwebpage1.msnw (http://groups.msn.com/ukenglishcockers/yourwebpage1.msnw)
I have a pic of troubador on there . when i have more time i plan to put some more pics on if i can figure out how to fit them on :shock:
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I have a few pictures on my pedigree http://groups.msn.com/ukenglishcockers/you...urwebpage1.msnw (http://groups.msn.com/ukenglishcockers/yourwebpage1.msnw)
I have a pic of troubador on there . when i have more time i plan to put some more pics on if i can figure out how to fit them on :shock:
Be careful :wink: Photos are copyrighted & you shouldn't really post photos on websites without the photographer's permission & a copyright notice. I have photos of most of the dogs mentioned above but unless I've taken them myself, they're not mine to publish on websites so I would only send them privately to anyone interested. Last year, a canine photographer took a website owner to court for using his photos without permission & won his case :shock:
Jane
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oo yes your right i see your point . Ive sorted it ,ive made it private viewing :)
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it's quite exciting waiting to see what colour there going to end up? Jarvis was very white when we got him and now he's mostly black with a sliver looking strip down his back he hasn't been stripped yet just tidied up so im looking forward to another change in his colour when he does.
Lorraine
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I love the black legs too :) They are often seen in the Bitcon line & also in lines which go back to Cilleine Echelon - Hightrees breeding lies behind most Bitcons & also Echelon so this could be the common denominator maybe (think I'm right that there will be a lot of Bitcon in Molo's pedigree?)
Jane
Yep, my Poppy has the black legs, that's from the Bitcon too!