Am starting to lose the will to live.... UPDATE PG 5

[Sheryl]

Lyla was over a year before she started barking to get out. Even now if she is playing inside and is preoccupied she will have the odd accident . It was frustrating because she is super smart!

[Geordietyke]

He does the same indoors, I have longlines and all he does is chew them.

He uses different parts of an enclosed area in the garden.  I'm out there a long time after he's done a wee, waiting for something else...... 

Just been out with him - I kept him in the living room, door closed.  He barked to go out but all he does is find stones/leaves and eat grass.  I may have to get him a soft muzzle to stop him doing that.....

[siam]

Just a thought when you were speaking about Simple Solution- Alfie is a prolific digger and I eventually got 'Keep Off' which deters cats or dogs toileting in flowerbeds and tubs and most importantly kept Alfie out from digging. As you don't have flooring down at the moment it might it be worth putting some 'Keep Off' crystals (blue!!) down in strategic places to try to discourage him from toileting inside. I get 'Keep Off' from Pet Planet when I do a food order, but Pets at Home have it for a little more.

[siam]

If you wanted to give the Keep Off a go you could maybe put some crystals in bowls rather than directly onto the floor as I think the scent wafts round about where the crystals are placed.

[vixen]

Oh Lesley 
As there hasn't been any recent postings on Archie's 'habits', I really thought he had cracked it 
You really are an 
Just wondered,  I know that you are with him lots of the time, but if you go out and someone else is with him, does he behave the same?

[HBP]

Not sure if you've already tried this but could you put his crate in the garden? Hudson had a similar, admittedly less lengthy,  aversion to outdoor toileting and also seemed to associate his pen with pooing. So the pen went in the garden for a few days!! I really think it helped break the cycle for him - and also he couldn't prat around in there!

Sorry to hear you're still struggling x

[Murphys Law]

You mentioned putting Alphie in kennels earlier.  If he starts getting the hang of toileting I would not put him in kennels. Murphy has just got back from a weeks stay and had several accidents. Before the kennels he hadn't had an accident in well over two months.

[Geordietyke]

I'm not really sure about the crate being in the garden, knowing my luck, I'd then have a dog who will only poo in a crate 

I used kennels when my previous cocker was 9 months old.  He'd been more or less housetrained by then but he still had had lots of accidents there (absolutely stank when I collected him  ).  It was his first time so I expected him to.  I can't imagine him being trained by the beginning of April when I'm having so much trouble with it.

Vixen - thanks    Yes, he behaves exactly the same when I'm not here.

Note: tonight when I've kept him in the living room with me, he barked to go outside and done a wee and poo (on two separate occasions)!  A fluke no doubt but it shows he CAN do it, so there is a glimmer of hope 

[Patp]

 

[Nicola]

You mentioned putting Alphie in kennels earlier.  If he starts getting the hang of toileting I would not put him in kennels. Murphy has just got back from a weeks stay and had several accidents. Before the kennels he hadn't had an accident in well over two months.

I have to agree with this, Caoimhe was veeeeery slow to housetrain but it wasn't really her fault as I didn't get her until she was over 5 months and she'd spent some time in a kennel up to then and then when she was 10 months and kinda sorta starting to get it she went down to her field trial trainer for the first time and stayed in his kennels for 6 weeks. When she came home it was toileting a go-go in the house and we had to go back to scratch, but then she spent most of the subsequent 3 years going between home and the kennels so she was never entirely reliable when here and I never entirely trusted her not to just go if and when she needed to if I wasn't instantly there to let her out. She only peed indoors though, thankfully we didn't really get poo incidents, and it wasn't all the time, maybe once every few weeks or less which made it all the more frustrating! I do trust her now though - not before time, she was 5 in January! - she has retired from trials and has been at home for the last year and hasn't peed inside for 11 months now (but who's counting ). She still doesn't ask to go out though, none of mine ever do unless they've got a really upset stomach. I'm not saying it's going to take Archie 5 years to housetrain by the way, but I think being kennelled may well set him back given that it's obviously not really his 'thing' as it is.

I'd also add that even with the kennels thing a good part of Caoimhe's issue was laziness on her part; she knew outside=toilet but if I wasn't there to instantly take her out she was quite happy to just pee wherever she happened to be which is something that Ro and Tilly would just never do no matter how desperate they were. She would also sometimes pee in crates and on bedding which apparently dogs don't do! Thankfully we finally seem to have broken the cycle but I admit I still check the floors if I've been out for more than a couple of hours, force of habit It's nothing to do with how intelligent or generally trainable they are though, she might have ruined several carpets but she still managed to become a FTCh

For the time being I would also consider restricting his space in the garden with a playpen so he has less opportunity to mess around, so to speak. I also think that getting a trainer or behaviourist in would be a good idea though as an objective pair of eyes may spot something that is triggering this behaviour - sometimes when you're living through it yourself it's hard to see the wood for the trees.

[Geordietyke]

Thanks for that.  Yes, it's almost "I'll just go here, can't be bothered to trot outside"  kind of thing sometimes.

He only has a small penned off area in the garden, always has had from day one but always manages to find stones/twigs and leaves inside to mess around with (we are surrounded by lots of trees).  Will try reducing it further.

I don't have an option about the kennels, I've got no-one to look after him.  It's only for 2 nights fortunately. 

[Nicola]

Ah ok, well 2 nights won't make much difference in the grand scheme of things. I hope you see some real progress with him soon, I know how frustrating it is if you know they can do it but they just don't want to!

[Archie bean]

  That sounds better!
Really sorry he's still being a little minx.  it's interesting that he barked this evening when he was in the lounge. My Archie went through a phase at about 6 months old if pooing in the lounge overnight. I shut the lounge door and he woke me up scratching at it. I took him outside and he did it out there. It was clear he had set up a habit of going in the lounge but could actually hold on until I came to let him in!  It sounds as though your Archie has also formed a bit of an indoor habit. I just wish I could think of a way of breaking it.
I'm wondering if Pat may be right and the chipboard has got a bit soaked and is attracting him. I'm not sure if your hall is small enough but maybe some off cuts of Lino laid down as a temporary measure might make it easier to clean? If he makes a beeline to go in the crate could you get it out again but don't open the door. Maybe he would scratch to get into it and then you could whip him outside, reinforcing his cue word when he goes. Just random thoughts. I know you are already doing all the right things, it's just taking him a teeny bit longer than some. xx

[Emilyoliver]

Note: tonight when I've kept him in the living room with me, he barked to go outside and done a wee and poo (on two separate occasions)!  A fluke no doubt but it shows he CAN do it, so there is a glimmer of hope 

So this may sound daft/stupid/odd/ridiculous/other.  Tonight when you've kept him in the room with you he's asked to go out and performed. So the key may be exactly that - keep him with you at all times. Unless you are walking or playing with him, put a line on him say 1- 2m long and tie it to your leg (the monks of skeet did this with their gsd puppies as part of bonding process). This way he cannot toilet anywhere where you can't see him. And when you move so does he. Take him out every hour as usual and any time he looks like he needs to go. It is quite obvious when dogs need to poo, and you will notice him about to start and can then take him out straight away as soon as you see the signs.  It will be very awkward and may well require a few days off work, but it's all about consistency IMO.

[HBP]

Note: tonight when I've kept him in the living room with me, he barked to go outside and done a wee and poo (on two separate occasions)!  A fluke no doubt but it shows he CAN do it, so there is a glimmer of hope 

So this may sound daft/stupid/odd/ridiculous/other.  Tonight when you've kept him in the room with you he's asked to go out and performed. So the key may be exactly that - keep him with you at all times. Unless you are walking or playing with him, put a line on him say 1- 2m long and tie it to your leg (the monks of skeet did this with their gsd puppies as part of bonding process). This way he cannot toilet anywhere where you can't see him. And when you move so does he. Take him out every hour as usual and any time he looks like he needs to go. It is quite obvious when dogs need to poo, and you will notice him about to start and can then take him out straight away as soon as you see the signs.  It will be very awkward and may well require a few days off work, but it's all about consistency IMO.

Not ridiculous, this is what I had to resort to to curb Hudson's protest pooing/ pooing behind my back habit!! Pain in the neck but works.