Maisy's "play biting" is reaching new levels

[Jan/Billy]

RE: THE COMMENT ABOUT BEING IRRESPONSIBLE

I didn't say YOU were irresponsible , the Vet who wrote about it received criticism and so did the magasine for publishing the article in the first place  It was branded "irresponsible"

Personally i don't think it's a good thing to do at all, there are too many potential bad consequences.

Under no circumstances would I force my dogs' heads down to the floor or hold on to their noses, imo this would just be encouraging them to bite me more and I wouldn't blame them for doing it. I can also imagine ending up with some very confused and upset dogs who would be worried every time my hand came near their head or neck that they were going to be pushed down to the ground.

Exactly! Wouldn't wanna take the risk of my dog ending up fearful of me each time my hand reached out to them.

[spanielcrazy]

Misunderstanding!  

I dont't mean grabbing, squeezing, pushing or anything like it. I simply hold the dogs muzzle, just in front of the eyes, with an open hand for a second or two. My fingers are not wrapped around the muzzle, it's just my open thumb and forefinger on top of their muzzle. I don't fight the dog or force any position on them, in fact there is less pressure than when I hold their muzzle for grooming. I just meant that I use a very slight pressure that may move their nose down and inch. I haven't used it in ages, the last time was when my puppies were in a bitey stage, and they had persisted in biting after a yelp, ignore and "no"

It does not make them handshy at all. it's totally non-violent. Believe me, I would never ever do anything harsh or frightening to a dog. Way back in the "Dark Ages of dog training", the Alpha Wolf/pack theory/dominance methods, I am ashamed to say I did the "Alpha roll" a couple of times on one of my Dobermans. What an awful thing to do! I have never forgiven myself for that, and for other serious training mistakes I have made.

I would never post or suggest anything that could backfire and harm the dog, or the relationship between dog and owner.  

[jools]

Nina, does Maisy show any other signs of aggression at all: guarding of food, possessiveness with toys etc?

[Jan/Billy]

I am ashamed to say I did the "Alpha roll" a couple of times on one of my Dobermans. What an awful thing to do! I have never forgiven myself for that, and for other serious training mistakes I have made.

I don't think you will find anyone who hasn't made a mistake, and if they say they haven't then they are lying  

I tried to make Billy wait before I walked through a door ( to prevent him being dominant)  

[spanielcrazy]

:

I tried to make Billy wait before I walked through a door ( to prevent him being dominant)  

Probably worked about as well as it did for me, eh? 

[jools]

:

I tried to make Billy wait before I walked through a door ( to prevent him being dominant)  

Probably worked about as well as it did for me, eh? 

Tried it with Millie too....she just thought I was mental 

[Cazzie]

Maisy seems to be a lively confident young pup. If she was my dog I would be alot firmer with her. I would NOT leave the room if she did this to me I would nip it in the bud there and then. All my dogs as pups are never allowed to bite me regardless whether its in play or not I leave them to do that with the other dogs. If they do get carried away and bite as a pup I WILL hold there muzzle and say a firm NO. They soon get the message. If a young pup bites another dog which is deemed to be unacceptable the dog tells it off, it doesnt walk away it sorts it there and then. The dog soon thinks twice the next time.

I use VERY strong voice tones to my dogs when they do something that is unacceptable and if they EVER did get carried away and start biting I would not hesitate in holding them by the scruff of the neck and give them a talking to, it does NOT hurt them, it makes them stop and think and pay attention. My dogs also are NOT hand shy as I NEVER hit them, I give them a dam good dressing down with my voice. I must also say that have NEVER had any issues of unacceptable aggression or behaviour from any of my dogs as they are NOT allowed to get away with it as pups. If you start early with this discipline you do NOT have these problems later on.

[Jan/Billy]

If you start early with this discipline you do NOT have these problems later on.

I don't agree.

Yes there will be dogs that will not be affected by scruffing, shouting etc but there are some that will and I would never take the risk of ruining my pup.

I used the ignore method with Billy. When he was a pup if he nipped me I immediately turned by back on him and walked away. They soon get the message.

[Cazzie]

If you start early with this discipline you do NOT have these problems later on.

I don't agree.

Yes there will be dogs that will not be affected by scruffing, shouting etc but there are some that will and I would never take the risk of ruining my pup.

I used the ignore method with Billy. When he was a pup if he nipped me I immediately turned by back on him and walked away. They soon get the message.

Jan some dogs DO need to be brought into line and these generally are the  slightyl older more outgoing dogs such as Maisy sounds, some pups do not need to be told off in this manner as they are of a quieter nature and dont need it and yes I agree could be put off and I would never do this to a quiet dog but I am talking about  outgoing confident dogs and you CAN tell the ones that are most likely to need brought into line right from an early age. There are some dogs that do not respond to ignoring them and treats and so on and respond better to a stronger discipline. Just like kids 

[hblower]

have you tried a water sprayer our cocker kept jumping up and was niping and generally being silly.  the dog trainer where we go said to use a water sprayer and the word OFF at the same time when they jump up on you or the sofa and as soon as they get off the say good off and praise them.  if he is having a funny 5 minutes we only have to pick up the water sprayer and he keeps off the sofa and goes into the garden.

[Helen]

i would recommend an apdt trainer.....none of us can see how maisie is acting and what she is actually doing and therefore cannot make a judgement call on her personality or extent of the problem

[Sarah16]

I am having the same problem with Mollie at the moment, she will run up and start jumping and nipping (i'm covered in briuses too). If Maisy is coming into season this could be making her feel a bit grumpy. My vet confirmed that Mollie has just started her season - I took her for a digestive problem but got him to check her at the same time.

I have been given some great advice on this forum, but I think the main thing is be consistant and not keep trying different approaches, which unfortunately I have  and just confused her more. I agree it is difficult to ignore them when they keep biting at your feet, sometimes it is difficult to get out of the room when they are hanging off you. I have found the house line has worked quite well as i can gently pull her away without being confrontational - Mollie does seem to give up quicker now. As for holding their mussle if I did that to Mollie I Know she would bite me and it would make matters worse.

[Cazzie]

I would only ever hold a young puppies muzzle for biting and if done from day 1 they should not continually bite as they grow older there for you wouldnt have to do it to a slightly older dog. As said we cant give advice on dogs as we do not know them or see exactly what they are doing and Beanie would be wise to contact an appropriate traininer to help her. We can only comment on what we would do or do with our own dogs. I hope you get wee Maisy's biting sorted which im sure you will, she is an absolute sweetie

[Nicola]

I am ashamed to say I did the "Alpha roll" a couple of times on one of my Dobermans. What an awful thing to do! I have never forgiven myself for that, and for other serious training mistakes I have made.

I tried to make Billy wait before I walked through a door ( to prevent him being dominant)  :005

I do this with all of mine and I'm pretty strict about it... it's absolutely nothing to do with dominance I just don't want to be barged out of the way by them charging through every time a door or gate is opened and it means that I can make sure there are no distractions/hazards present before I let them come through. Alfie and Tilly will automatically sit when we get to the front door or to a gate on a walk and they also wait when I open the boot of the car until they are told to jump out.

[Jan/Billy]

I am ashamed to say I did the "Alpha roll" a couple of times on one of my Dobermans. What an awful thing to do! I have never forgiven myself for that, and for other serious training mistakes I have made.

I tried to make Billy wait before I walked through a door ( to prevent him being dominant)  :005

I do this with all of mine and I'm pretty strict about it... it's absolutely nothing to do with dominance

In your case no, but a lot of people say you should do this to prevent your dog becoming dominant .

If an occasion arises where i need Billy to stay I just ask him to stay, but I don't make him wait to go through doors in the house .