Not going enough?

[jonnytrabant]

Three weeks ago when we picked Harry up, he was on Purina Beta and was poohing up to 8-9 times a day!! Changed to JWB puppy food, took about a week and the change has been fantastic was going after every meal, bout 4 times, I knew when he would be wanting to go. However he is now down to only twice a day and it could be anytime, not necessary after a meal. In fact he could have two meals and not even go, like yesterday which I was with him all day and he had umpteen chances to go.  It was also annoying as he had his first puppy class last night and I knew he wanted to go, and consequently it affected him at the class, where he clearly wanted to go, but not being at his normal garden made him clearly upset. So the car journey back home was him in the back crying like mad and me driving like a loon!

My question is. Is there a proven method to make him go to the toilet out side rather than the garden? I've tried word association but apart from sniffing like mad he still won't go, and just pulls hard on the lead to get home, so much so that when we got back from his walk this morn he couldn't even wait till I got the back door to the garden open and wee'd on the kitchen floor. So I waited in the garden to see if he would poo, not a chance. He had been up since 6.30am and had had his breakie so off to the shops I went and came back to a huge poo which to be fair he did on the puppy pad in his pen.

Could he be constipated?

[flower1]

Seeing as he went, although not in the right place, I wouldn't have thought he was constipated. Not really had a problem with our cockers going but my Grandad had a rough collie that would only go on grass, number ones or twos.
I've not tried it myself but I had heard that when teaching a dog to go outside, if they have gone on paper/puppy pads, rather than throw it away, to put it outside with the paper/pad so they learn that its an outdoor activity. Though as he knows to go on the pad, it might be enough to just put the pad out. If you have a patio then it might help to put it on there so he knows other surfaces are ok to go on and will be happier to  go on the path when out for a walk. If he gets the hang of that, perhaps taking the pad when you visit friends or family and seeing if he'll go in other people's gardens to break the habit of only going at home. Don't know if it will help but it might be something to try. I'm sure other people will be along soon.

But he's still only little so I'm sure he'll get the hang of it.

[jonnytrabant]

He has done both movements in my parents garden. So he not relying on my garden. I think what I'll do is feed and water him, and try and guess when he's due and take Hume to the big field nearby and see if he goes,mic he does then I'll treat him with some chicken breast.

[lola B]

well Rosie is raw fed so i suppose it is different but she does 2 a day like clock work

[MaggieR]

Its not unusual for pups to only want to go in a familiar environment when they are young... think there can be too many distractions, things to think about in the wider world sometimes and its not till they get more relaxed with being out and about they relax and realise they can go to the toile there too. It doesn't make for the most convenient of days/evenings sometimes - but they'll get there, just as with everything else. 

[jonnytrabant]

well Rosie is raw fed so i suppose it is different but she does 2 a day like clock work

I see the 'raw brigade' are campaigning again

[MaggieR]

well Rosie is raw fed so i suppose it is different but she does 2 a day like clock work

I see the 'raw brigade' are campaigning again

Not sure that counts as campaigning... more just saying that maybe 2 a day isn't an issue but also noting the dog is raw fed 

[Black Beauty & Silverfox]

Hi

I'm not a raw feeder, but my pup enjoys JWB as does Harry.
Mine is now seven months but from the early days she would very rarely poo away from her own toilet. We'd return from our walk and whilst I opened the front door she would wee on the lawn, I'd then let her out into the back garden where she would immediately poo
I remember she would whizz round and round in a circle to find the right spot, must know the right spot now [or grown up] because she goes straight to it, no whizzing
I would have thought two poos a day is about right and he's not over fed, I'd be more conscious of the consistency of the poo rather than the quantity, but he's certainly not constipated  


Mel.

[LynneB]

well Rosie is raw fed so i suppose it is different but she does 2 a day like clock work

I see the 'raw brigade' are campaigning again

Statement of fact surely??

[lola B]

well its a fact that raw takes a different amount of time to digest and so i thought that maybe dogs fed other foods would need to go at different times thats all 

[jonnytrabant]

Didn't mean to be negative Lola, ive been on nightshift for the ladt month, so i apologise if my comment came across in the manor it did. Its just that every time someone has diet/feeding problems then there seems to be wave of 'change to a raw diet' 'my dogs never been better' and so on. Whilst not knowing the full facts about raw v manufactured diets, I do know that it's more expensive (cue people writing its not, it's not) and time consuming and if it works for them then whoopee, great. But there is a school of thought that it's not the great end to dietary problems.
However, many people, including myself, believe raw meat is associated with potential dangers.

This is quoted from the dog channel

Potential problems from raw foods include:Bacterial contamination. Raw foods have been shown to be contaminated with bacteria, including Salmonella and E. Coli, and in some cases, the rate of contamination may be significant. (One report found 16 percent of all chickens on the market were contaminated with Salmonella.) Zoonotic concerns Dogs that ingest bacteria, even those dogs that don’t show signs of disease themselves, may pass the bacteria into the environment where it can infect humans. Parasites. Parasites (and their eggs and larvae) that would likely be destroyed by cooking, may be present in raw meat, and could infect pets. Intestinal upset. Some dogs develop loose stools when fed a raw diet. An incomplete diet. It has been noted that some of the published raw meat and bones diets do not contain all the AAFCO-standard nutrients, and that some dogs fed these diets have developed bone abnormalities due to the insufficiency's.

It concludes

The final objection to raw diets is on the basis that they may not be a complete diet. This fits into the controversy of whether our dogs have inherited their evolutionary “wolf ways,” or have adapted to our diets of cooked carbohydrates and processed foods.

It is still a fact that there are far more dogs on manufactured, man made diets than raw diets.

I suspect that this subject will run and run

I am off to bed zzzzzz's

[Black Beauty & Silverfox]

Didn't mean to be negative Lola, ive been on nightshift for the ladt month, so i apologise if my comment came across in the manor it did. Its just that every time someone has diet/feeding problems then there seems to be wave of 'change to a raw diet' 'my dogs never been better' and so on. Whilst not knowing the full facts about raw v manufactured diets, I do know that it's more expensive (cue people writing its not, it's not) and time consuming and if it works for them then whoopee, great. But there is a school of thought that it's not the great end to dietary problems.
However, many people, including myself, believe raw meat is associated with potential dangers.

This is quoted from the dog channel

Potential problems from raw foods include:Bacterial contamination. Raw foods have been shown to be contaminated with bacteria, including Salmonella and E. Coli, and in some cases, the rate of contamination may be significant. (One report found 16 percent of all chickens on the market were contaminated with Salmonella.) Zoonotic concerns Dogs that ingest bacteria, even those dogs that don’t show signs of disease themselves, may pass the bacteria into the environment where it can infect humans. Parasites. Parasites (and their eggs and larvae) that would likely be destroyed by cooking, may be present in raw meat, and could infect pets. Intestinal upset. Some dogs develop loose stools when fed a raw diet. An incomplete diet. It has been noted that some of the published raw meat and bones diets do not contain all the AAFCO-standard nutrients, and that some dogs fed these diets have developed bone abnormalities due to the insufficiency's.

It concludes

The final objection to raw diets is on the basis that they may not be a complete diet. This fits into the controversy of whether our dogs have inherited their evolutionary “wolf ways,” or have adapted to our diets of cooked carbohydrates and processed foods.

It is still a fact that there are far more dogs on manufactured, man made diets than raw diets.

I suspect that this subject will run and run

I am off to bed zzzzzz's

Hi again

That's all well and good, but how's your dog?


Mel.

[jonnytrabant]

Mel

Yes we seem to have drifted off the original subject. Again my impatience is the problem. Harry is starting to go outside now rather than the garden, he still has a wee there but first thing and last I am taking him outside and last two nights he's had his pooh there.

Like yours he's having two sometimes three a day, not runny. Good quality, if you can have it   

Feeding wise, he's down to three meals of about 65gr of JWB puppy food at 7am, 1pm and last meal about 6pm we take what he's left away at about 7pm. I don't think Harry will be a big eater, I know that some dogs will eat more than others. Had him weighed at the vets yesterday and he was 4.1kg at 12 weeks, but his mum and dad are small. So iam not worried.

[Black Beauty & Silverfox]

Hi again

Oh you can't beat a bit good quality are we really talking about poo

Pleased it's working for you.

If you would like a potty training sheet that worked fantastically well for us I'll mail it to you.


Mel.

[jonnytrabant]

Think you already did Mel.

Harry's not too bad on tHe face of it. He's sort of 50/50 in terms of weeing and poohing outside away from the garden, but I've only been encouraging him since Monday and everyone I've spoke to says it could take a while.

As regards to the house, he still does the odd wee every three days or so, not sure how that fits in the context of other dogs but I know I am on the right track, after all he's only 12 weeks.

But your right Mel, my heart explodes with joy when I see a good quality poo. Top notch don't you think?