Show Cocker Speying - Positives & Negatives

[Oscar22]

Hi All,

We have a Show ocker who is now around 18 months, and who has had 2 seasons.

We are very much unsure about having her speyed due to some of the apparent (anybody know if these ACTUALLY happen or not) negatives of doing so; tendency for weight loss, change in coat (tendency to turn 'woolly'), different character/behaviour, etc.

There are evidently some health benefits (although I thnk we've missed the greatest benefits by waiting until 2 seasons) and wondered what people's opinions and experiences were?

We just love her the way she is (her coat, behaviour, etc.) but don't want to be selfish if the health benefits aren't that great. Likewise we would do it in an instant if the negatives weren't actually genuine.

Thanks in advance for responses.

Oscar22

[juju]

Izzy will be nine in a couple of weeks. She was spayed when she was just over two years old. She still has her shiny coat but I realise some do end up with woolly coats. I was advised not to have her spayed too early so that her body could mature. I was not intending for her to have pups and I wanted the health benefits that come with being spayed.
          Julia

[Oscar22]

Julia,

Many thaks for your reply, that's really helpful.

Oscar22

[JohnMcL]

Thanks for posting this Oscar22. Our vet called to remind me that Nutty needs speying. She’s 5 months old today, I was caught off guard, my garbled response was to ask what the medical benefits are. I can’t remember exactly what he said but she’d avoid a group of cancers and Pyro. I said I’d call him back.
The thought of an operation horrifies me never mind her being away from me for more an 15 mins. We are practicing time alone and 15 mins is all we’re up to yet as I’m taking it slowly.
I don’t know what her coat’s going to look like as she’s still fluffy. I’ll do a ton of reading before making a decision but the health benefits need to be enormous to allow this. I can’t get my head around her being a baby.
I’ve recently lost a dog to my ex, I know I’m overly protective with Nutty.
I also didn’t like that it sounded a little like a sales call, my vet never calls me.

John.

[pam1]

I think 5 months is far too young.  I have always been told to wait for the growth plates to finish before speying, which is normally after 12 months at least.  Maybe your vet is a bit short of cash! 🤔

[bizzylizzy]

I think 5 months is far too young.  I have always been told to wait for the growth plates to finish before speying, which is normally after 12 months at least.  Maybe your vet is a bit short of cash! 🤔

My thoughts exactly! I know the original question was concerning speying not castration but the principle is the same - I‘d personally be very wary of a vet recommending speying/castration without a medical reason and I never really understand the argument of cancer prevention, unless there‘s an underlying problem that makes it more likely (my dog had an undescended testicle for example which potentially posed a problem, so we did decide to have him castrated at the age of 5), we‘d all be having bits chopped off otherwise! 
Everyone and everydogs circumstances are different and in no way am I attempting to make an argument either for or against, its personal choice but to suggest speying a dog at 5 months just for the sake of it seems very unethical and outdated to me, so much development is still taking place and the general medical opinion these days, as far as I know, is to wait at least until after puberty.
Humphrey‘s coat most definately suffered, its become very woolly and needs a lot more attention and we also have a bit of a battle with keeping his weight under control, neither of which matter as long as he‘s healthy ofcourse but I wish I hadn‘t had to have had it done and I‘d say think about it carefully before you make the decision.
 

[vixen]

When I had a male GSP I belonged to a vet practice that had multiple sites.  They urged me to get Max castrated at 6 months.  I didn’t and instead joined another vet’s practice.  A one man outfit.  When I asked him about castration, he said wait and see how Max deals with his sexuality as he only operated if there was a health or behavioural problem.  SO Max was not castrated.  Sadly this vet retired and I had to go back to the original practice.  When Max was about 6 he became ill and became very thin and was taken for a consultation.  The first vet we saw there recommended castration as a way of putting weight on him  .   Castration - a cure all for every male problem.  I wonder if the male vet had also been ‘done’ ?        I refused and after tests it was revealed his lose of weight was due to kidney cancer. 
It seems nowadays that new  vets have a ‘script’ of what services to offer and when to neuter.  They must stick to these to continue to bring the money in.
My two girls were spayed though after they had had two seasons.  After much research I found that there are more benefits to have females neutered than males. 
My solid girl’s coat got much thicker and woolier afterwards but only the black parts of my blue roan were affected.

[JohnMcL]

Thanks so much for posting your experiences. I think 5 months old is far too young and I’ve not had enough time to research whether 18 months or over 2 is beneficial to her health yet either. I’m not anti nor do I want her to have pups. I don’t have a male dog and I’ve become a Velcro Parent  I’d do it in a flash if it was medically necessary, as we haven’t seen a vet since the second vaccination that’s ruled out.
The ‘phone call was very out of the blue, perhaps they are struggling or on sales targets - both scary for owners who aren’t connected to somewhere like here!
I wasn’t going to post about it as I am always asking for your help yet don’t have much to give back yet. I am ever so grateful members are always great, thank you.
Oscar22 - I hope you’ve found clear medical research to help with the difficult decision.

John.

[bizzylizzy]

Thanks so much for posting your experiences. I think 5 months old is far too young and I’ve not had enough time to research whether 18 months or over 2 is beneficial to her health yet either. I’m not anti nor do I want her to have pups. I don’t have a male dog and I’ve become a Velcro Parent  I’d do it in a flash if it was medically necessary, as we haven’t seen a vet since the second vaccination that’s ruled out.
The ‘phone call was very out of the blue, perhaps they are struggling or on sales targets - both scary for owners who aren’t connected to somewhere like here!
I wasn’t going to post about it as I am always asking for your help yet don’t have much to give back yet. I am ever so grateful members are always great, thank you.
Oscar22 - I hope you’ve found clear medical research to help with the difficult decision.

John.

John, - please don‘t worry about asking too many questions, - its the questions/replies that keep the discussions going,  most of us have been where you are now and we all benefit from each other in some way or another. We have a saying here in Germany „ He who doesn‘t ask remains ignorant“    I always find it reassuring to hear other opionions! 

[cazza]

Thanks for posting this Oscar22. Our vet called to remind me that Nutty needs speying. She’s 5 months old today, I was caught off guard, my garbled response was to ask what the medical benefits are. I can’t remember exactly what he said but she’d avoid a group of cancers and Pyro. I said I’d call him back.
The thought of an operation horrifies me never mind her being away from me for more an 15 mins. We are practicing time alone and 15 mins is all we’re up to yet as I’m taking it slowly.
I don’t know what her coat’s going to look like as she’s still fluffy. I’ll do a ton of reading before making a decision but the health benefits need to be enormous to allow this. I can’t get my head around her being a baby.
I’ve recently lost a dog to my ex, I know I’m overly protective with Nutty.
I also didn’t like that it sounded a little like a sales call, my vet never calls me.

John.

WOW I am gobsmacked that your vet has called you with Peanut only being 5 months old

For what it’s worth, I had my first working cocker spayed about 3 months after her first season, as I didn’t want to breed from her and Ash will be the same - Ash also has a small inbolical hernia which they will deal with at the same time

[Oscar22]

Thanks All.

From the masses of reading we've done, it appears the longer you leave it the less the health benefits actually become - it is just so difficult to get facts on the health benefits, or facts on the negative side effects of speying.

The main health benefits seem to be cancers of uterus/womb; obviously this risk is removed entirely but I don't think it is a massive problem anyway. Mammary cancer is more of a problem, but I don't believe speying makes a difference to that.

Oscar22.

[AndyB]

I have heard that spaying before the dog has had her first season can result in some urinary incontinence in some cases.  Definitely wait until she has had one season.  She is only a baby after all. 

[Oscar22]

To be clear, ours is 15 months, not less than 1. And has had 2 seasons so far, hence the need to now make a decision.

Thanks.

[vixen]

When my two girls were spayed after 2 seasons, it had zero effect on their personalities 
It took a while for the change of coat to become apparent  ( I thought for a few years that it hadn’t affected their coats at all ) but then as previously stated, Marley (solid black) started to get woolly and whilst previously I had been able to just use a comb and rubber band , I had to resort to a comb king. Only the black parts of Stevie (blue roan) were effected.
Even though they had both been spayed, Stevie developed mammary lumps.  Due to her age (11) I wouldn’t let her go through a suggested mammary strip and the lumps never got any bigger.

[Toofast]

Sorry to jump on board with your discussions.
We keep all of our girls entire without any problems or health issues. We have the Working Type Cockers. Varying ages from 3 years to 11.5 years, and many others before these.

I have attached a couple of articles about spaying / castration choices.

http://affinitydogtraining.co.uk/training-info/neutering/

https://www.wolftucker.co.uk/blog/neutering-your-dog-making-an-informed-decision/