A BARF Diary.

[happydog]

BARF Days 3-6 .
Today is day 7 of Fern on BARF. Sorry this is a bit long but I have only just had time to catch up. Life has intervened....

She has worked her way through my original BARF shopping list and greeted each meal with the same enthusiasm and polished everything off. She has crunched chicken and turkey bones, carrots and celery sticks(she spat those out after crunching ). She has still been having the occasional Bonio and garishly coloured chopped hide chew.

Poo and a worrying moment 1.
Her poos have been variable, but to date no diarrhoea or constipation. Mostly small, odourless, harder and much easier to pick up.  The day it turned bright orange  (after a surfeit of carrot) was interesting until I realised why .

A worrying moment 2.
Fern walked around for ages with a piece of turkey neck in her mouth one day. It was there for so long I thought she had got it stuck. I went to investigate but it wasn't. It was only partially defrosted when I gave it to her and she was sucking on it like an iced lolly. Eventually she crunched it up.

Quantity
  I am beginning to wonder whether Fern is getting enough in terms of quantity. She is a very active dog and seems hungry although her appetite has always been good. I had another look through my books.
Schultze only measures in cups full which for a beginner I found unhelpful. How big is a cup? There is no guide for feeding between a 10lb and a 50lb dog either. She also considers organ meats as well as raw bone such as turkey necks as an extra to be fed outside the guidelines. I found it too confusing.
On turning to Tom Lonsdale I found his recommendation much more informative. 20% of your dogs weight in raw meaty bones over a 7 day period. Now that I can understand. Nice and simple  . This means I can just wack the mince and chicken wings/turkey necks on to the scales each day for a few weeks until I get an idea of what it looks like. No more wondering what the ratio is of meat to bone on every flipping thing I feed. For Fern she will need 2.35Kg of meat and bone per week. Which equates to 336g/day if I feed her every day, or a bit more if I am fasting her for a day a week as he suggests (not sure about that yet). I shall be looking at feeding 350-400g/day until Fern puts on a little weight. If she gets too fat I shall reduce it. Veggies are extra.
If any of you actually work out that I have based this on a weight of 11.75Kg instead of Fern's weight of 11.15Kg as I put on my first post, this is because that is the weight I would like her to be .

Friday
Beef mince, chicken wing and turkey necks 375g in total

The first batch of whizzed veggies have run out. I have replaced then with:
Parsnip
Celery
Cauliflower

She loved these too. I wasn’t sure about the parsnip for some reason. Possibly just me putting a human slant on a dogs dietary preference.

She was eating her chicken wing in the garden last night after her veg and mince meal. She is still taking it gently and looking at me with eyes full of wonder at this new food after every few mouthfuls. A dog barked outside and instead of abandoning her food and rushing to the gate to have a good old nose, she grabbed the wing first. There was no way she was going to leave that unattended  .

Next week.
 I shall be trying to see if I can get a fresh fish or two, and as OH no longer shoots - looking to our local farmer for the odd rabbit and pheasant carcass. I shall also be buying some liver, probably ox as Fern will need a greater variety of organ meats that just the frozen heart chucks I have in the freezer. I note that offal, or organ meats need only be fed every couple of weeks, up to a maximum of two or three times a week.
The other thing I shall do is to contact a BARF friendly butcher about six miles away that I found listed on Tom Lonsdales web site:
http://www.ukrmb.co.uk/showcontent.toy?contentnid=7379
(a rather militant site I felt, but good in some ways - providing you are selective. He obviously has his own axe to grind….)

Supplements
I am still not entirely convinced about Fern needing any supplements with BARF and at the moment am wondering whether this is all part of the supplement media hype for humans that we have transferred to our dogs. I have read, for example that ‘dogs have no known requirement for Omega 3’. Muscle meat (not just brain -but is in highest quantities there) contains both Omega 3 and 6, with a higher ratio of 6. The more animal fat consumed the less Omega 6 is required. The role of Omega 9 is I believe, a relatively recent ‘discovery’ in relation to its function. I agree with Joules on this. If Fern has a wide and varied diet using good quality foodstuffs there should be no need for supplements. I shall conduct my own research in to this and if I discover otherwise I shall own up straight away! 


Today(Sat) Fern will be having an egg with her dinner (which may well be tinned sardines* for a change). I seem to have forgotten to give her any this week.
*probably about 12 inches worth Annette 

[Penel]

Don't get toooo hung up on the variety thing - mine basically have chicken / lamb / tripe / pilchards / eggs - and Lola ONLY has pork and tripe and pilchards.... and also I think you're right about the supplements, mine hardly have any nowadays, just trying to use up the omega 3,6,9 capsules I still have.  I have no idea at all what mine eat in weight, I do it totally by eye, and if they look skinny I feed them more, if they look fat, I feed them less - not very technical I know, but miles easier.

[happydog]

I buy omega 3,6,9 capsules from Holland and Barratt and put a few in with the veg when I blend it; I pick out the capsule cases out when I put the veg in the ice cube trays 

Rachel. I know that all  oils are heat sensitive -and the EFAs will denature if they are heated in any way (which is why they should be never be added to food if you might need to defrost quickly, e.g. via microwave or warm water).
  Doesn't freezing have a similar effect?

[happydog]

Don't get toooo hung up on the variety thing

Point taken Penel  . I think I just wan't to see if there is anything Fern doesn't like...
I also want to give her some bone alternatives as so far she has only had chicken wings and poultry necks to crunch.

[kate.s]

Sam's conversion to BARF seems to be going well too. This morning he polished off his bowl and he has also had an egg, shells and all, that he loved. How often can they have eggs?

Also, I was wondering where I can get poultry necks?

[happydog]

Up to 2 or 3 eggs a week should be fine. The poultry necks I have are Prize Choice supplied  by Anglian Meat Products (A.M.P) (frozen food for working dogs). Although I got mine from my local pet shop freezer I think Pets at Home Sell A.M.P. Here is A.M.P's website on their 'find a local  stockists page. http://www.prizechoice.co.uk/ They also do home delivery.

[ladylola]

Talking about sardines I gave ours the ones in extra virgin olive oil. more expensive I know, but is tomato sauce better.

[happydog]

Changes to Fern since beginning BARF
I suppose that anyone thinking of changing to BARF will be interested in any changes, positive and negative, that occur to their dog. Although this is only day 8 I have already noticed:

Improvement in concentration. Selective deafness is reducing slightly. She seems to be listening to me more when out on walks off lead. No reduction in her energy levels though  .

Coat. Definately shinier.

Eyes. For the last week her eyes have been slightly runny.  I am guessing that she is detoxifying. I notice from other posts that some dogs initially get the runs, some get flaky skin. With Fern it seemed to only affect her eyes. That has now all cleared up as from yesterday.

Edited to add: Oh and I almost forgot. Over the last couple of days Fern has been making happy, contented little grunting noises when she has come and sat down with us after her meal. That's something she hasn't done in years. I am taking that as a sign of approval  .

[happydog]

Talking about sardines I gave ours the ones in extra virgin olive oil. more expensive I know, but is tomato sauce better.

I have no idea ladylola. I gave Fern tinned sardines in tomato sauce last night because that is what I had in the cupboard. I am not sure whether there is any nutrient value in vegetable oils for dogs or not .

[DennyK]

I give the ones in tomato sauce because the Holy Grail (AKA Penel) does it.  If it's good enough for her dogs....

[kate.s]

The things I've notced with Sam (and it's only a little things so far) is he has got a lovely wet nose all the time now, it had been becoming quite dry at times, and also although his poo was a little soft today he isn't doing anywhere near as many as he was even though he is eating really well. 

[Claire]

Changes to Fern since beginning BARF
Over the last couple of days Fern has been making happy, contented little grunting noises when she has come and sat down with us after her meal. That's something she hasn't done in years.

Aaahh that's lovely. Bless her...makes all the handling of raw meat and time spent whizzing veg so worthwhile doesn't it?

I can identify with the carrot poo!  I let Ruby have a whole carrot probably about once a week as she really enjoys them, but we always have that the following morning - doesn't do her any harm.

I don't supplement Ruby's diet - from her coat, her energy levels, her teeth, her happy nature and her poo , you can see that she is one healthy little dog in prime condition.  I did buy some apple cider vinegar, and she's had the odd spoonful of that in her food, but I can't remember now what it's supposed to be good for.

Nor do I weigh out the food.  A lot of the meat comes in set sizes so some meals are larger than others.  I suppose she has less food when it's an oxtail or a chicken drumstick meal, and more when it's chicken wings (cos I give her two) or pieces of lamb with bone in them - which the butcher chops into generous portions.  Turkey drumsticks I have a cleaver to cut up, but usually only manage to split into 3-4 pieces, so that's always a big meal - but often if she's had that for breakfast I might miss dinner, unless she's pestering for it.

I have a fair idea if I'm overfeeding her, as she will bury food in the garden if she's not all that hungry!

Great diary, by the way!

[Penel]

I give the ones in tomato sauce because the Holy Grail (AKA Penel) does it.  If it's good enough for her dogs....

pmsl you guys 

Tilly is 8 yrs old now and has been on a raw diet since she was bout 3 yrs old.  Those of you that have met her I hope agree she looks very healthy (apart from when she has rolled in green poo)    The others have been raw fed since I have had them but as they aren't as old as Tilly I don't think it "counts" as much.... I think its when they get older that you really notice the benefits of a raw natural diet.  Having said that Hattie is 2 and a half and has been to the vets once in her life, that was to be spayed.

[happydog]

This diary seems to have started a BARF revolution. Well OK not quite, perhaps that is an overstatement , but there seem to be a few people on COL deciding to move over to BARF recently.

First I would like to say that it was due to my reading posts by 'the mighty Penel' that first caught my interest in BARF -and seeing those fabby pictures of her superbly  fit  and happy dogs bouncing around all over the place or lying around looking contented and disgustingly healthy grabbed my interest. So thanks Penel 

Secondly and this is for those of you who are really worried, as I was, with this bone crunching and bits getting stuck issue. Now this may not make a blind bit of difference to Fern but it makes me feel better.  I stick to the following rules:

1. I never feed Fern before a walk. I only feed her after one, when she has calmed down a little. The idea of her bombing about at high speed with all that freshly crunched bone inside her makes me feel uneasy somehow  .

2. She only ever gets fed in a calm and quiet atmosphere, away from children, loud noises, visitors, other dogs or any external distractions that may mean she feel she has to leave, rush or guard her food.

3. Fern never gets crunchable bone (chicken wings etc) as the first part of her meal. She gets a bowl of raw mince/ offal and whizzed raw veg first. This is so, in my mind, she will sate her appetite before the bit that needs her undivided attention -in the hope that she will crunch slowly and thoroughly before she swallows.
I also have this, probably crazy, idea that the first part of her meal will be ready in her stomach to stimulate the digestive process and to cushion any sharpish bits of bone that follow.

None of this is due to anything I have read. It is all a product of my imagination (and a teeny bit of biological knowhow) but it does help me to feel a bit more relaxed about it . If it helps anyone else who has similar thought processes then that's good  .

The other things I keep reminding myself of is that:
1. cooked bone splinters as heat alters its molecular structure. Fern only ever gets fed raw bone which is much more pliable.
2. Their digestive system is NOT the same as ours and they have evolved over millions of years to thrive on raw bones and meat.
3. Raw meat containing fat is actually good for dogs. They use them as a source of fuel much like we use carbohydrates. Feeding all lean meat to a perfectly healthy dog is actually not a good idea.

[CraftySam]

In the morning we are starting BARF.

Until Saturday I'm using the frozen blocks from PAH, as I hadn't got my act together in time for getting everything last weekend. Thanks to Rhona W, I'm following her menu, everythings planned and ready to go.

Keeping my fingers crossed that Sapphi and Max don't get upset tums like we did after the first chicken wing they had.