two pure black parents having roan pups

[DennyK]

This is fascinating!

Paddy's mother was black, father gold.  He's black with a white bit on his chest.

Is it possible/advisable to find a true "pure black" (being overly simplistic - black dominant, black recessive) and mate it with another "pure black" to get a raven-black dog? 

If it's not possible, why not?

If it's possible, but not advisable - why not?

thanks

Denise

[Jane S]

Not sure what you mean Denny Black is never recessive in Cockers - it's always dominant. If you mean are there solid black Cockers that carry no other recessive colour genes then yes these certainly exist in show lines - they can only produce black pups even when mated to a partner that carries for gold or black & tan (although some of the pups will carry the other partner's recessive genes forward). If both parents are "dominant" blacks & carry no other recessive colours, then yes all pups will also be "dominant" blacks.

[Michele]

Not sure what you mean Denny Black is never recessive in Cockers - it's always dominant. If you mean are there solid black Cockers that carry no other recessive colour genes then yes these certainly exist in show lines - they can only produce black pups even when mated to a partner that carries for gold or black & tan (although some of the pups will carry the other partner's recessive genes forward). If both parents are "dominant" blacks & carry no other recessive colours, then yes all pups will also be "dominant" blacks.

Because Neneh's breeder line is black to black dominated, even when I mated her to a gold dog she had all black puppies, and when mated again to a black dog who also sires golden & black & tan, she still had all black puppies.

[CAG]

somewhere in the line you have blue roan did you breed the parents yourself if not have you really studied the pedigree.  if you mate  a black with a blue you will get black puppies but those pups will carry the blue line so if they have pups they will be mismarks' but if they are mated with a roan you will get a very dark roan.  

[tracee]

             there are no roans in either of the parents,grand parents,great g parents, g.g.parent, but there is an orange/white in the ggg.grand parents.

[Jane S]

There has to be particolour on both sides of the pedigree Tracee (not necessarily a blue roan) - you probably need to go back further in the lines and you'll maybe find it. Another alternative is that there may be an error in the pedigree somewhere ie pups were registered with incorrect parents (not necessarily deliberately - errors do happen but without DNA evidence, there'd be no proof)

[tracee]

                 thanks jane, i will delve futher.

[ellisdavids]

we have a black bitch that we breed with a golden dog, we had 5 beautiful puppies all golden, if black is dominant then why did we have all golden puppies?

[Jane S]

The predicted results from various matings are based on averages worked out over quite a large number of puppies which is why you might see unexpected results if you just look at one litter in isolation. Your black bitch obviously carries gold and it was just by chance all the pups were gold. If the litter had been bigger, you might well have had black pups too.