Help Maniac Puppy!

[Bellbellsmum]

Thanks everyone for the advice. dont get me wrong, she can be a sweety, but when she starts with this manic behaviour it goes on for HOURS and you can do nothing with her.  I've been off work for a few days and already I can see a change.  She is never on her own for more than 3 hours in the day but she obviously knows this is coming and then also has pent up energy when kids are home from school.

I think she needs a definate play time where she gets all the attention.  I've noticed that after this time she usually will just mill around watching me in the kitchen while I cook dinner, and is a lot calmer.

She is definately a mardy girl though.  If she is tired and happy on my sofa and I try to move her she has the audacity to growl at me when I move her.  I decided this was not acceptable and dumped her unceremoniously on the cold tile floor.  She soon came creeping round me trying to get back in my good books  

Today we have been with her all day and compared to last night,  see post further up, she is sniffing round the lounge stopping to chew the odd toy.  Fantastic.

I think its trial and error.  I'll keep you posted. Thanks all.

Love n hugs

[PennyB]

Thanks everyone for the advice. dont get me wrong, she can be a sweety, but when she starts with this manic behaviour it goes on for HOURS and you can do nothing with her.  I've been off work for a few days and already I can see a change.  She is never on her own for more than 3 hours in the day but she obviously knows this is coming and then also has pent up energy when kids are home from school.

I think she needs a definate play time where she gets all the attention.  I've noticed that after this time she usually will just mill around watching me in the kitchen while I cook dinner, and is a lot calmer.

She is definately a mardy girl though.  If she is tired and happy on my sofa and I try to move her she has the audacity to growl at me when I move her.  I decided this was not acceptable and dumped her unceremoniously on the cold tile floor.  She soon came creeping round me trying to get back in my good books 

Today we have been with her all day and compared to last night,  see post further up, she is sniffing round the lounge stopping to chew the odd toy.  Fantastic.

I think its trial and error.  I'll keep you posted. Thanks all.

Love n hugs

Ruby did this but I taught her to get off the sofa by command and she will even allow me to shove her off if I need to now without complaint.

It might be worth teaching your up about the sofa as sometimes dumping her off might not get through (my recent foster cocker just kept jumping back on again in th esame place he was that stubborn). I taught Ruby in a positive way and it seemed to work. I began by persuading her off with a treat and at same time using the 'off' command while also pointing at the floor and when she got off she was given the treat and praised. Eventually I just pointed at the floor using the off command and no treats involved and she'll just move. Now if I walk up to the sofa and attempt to sit down she moves without me asking.

Sofas are also about power. Your pup can also feel as if she got one up on you by being there which is why you need to carefully/positively teach her that she should get off when you want. Certain schools of thought suggest that dogs shouldn't be allowed on sofas because of this

[taniac]

Great advice regarding the sofa, mine aren't allowed up there (unless invited onto my knee).  The extra height it gives them does give them power too.

Jovi was also a really growly pup, he didn't like you picking him up or messing with him (very hard when you have to carry him round before he had his jabs).  I growl back at him and shake his ears, soon has him licking at me with his sorry eyes!

[Bellbellsmum]

I take it back!  She is a devil dog!     She just took a chunk out of my 11 year old daughter who was playing with her. She got totally over excited and drew blood from her arm!

I yelled at her which sent her scurrying behind the sofa, so I dragged her out by her back legs and put her in the "Time out Zone"  She was very appologetic when she came out but it didnt last.

I next found her standing on the dining table because someone had left a chair out!

I said "down" to  her in a deep loud voice which works when she gets on the sofa, but she ignored me and started barking so I swiped her backend with a teatowl I was holding and she got the message, jumped down and did the sideways shuffle and puppy dog eyes at me dribbling urine.  So then I felt bad, but she is driving me mad!  

I feel like its only a matter of time before I loose the plot completely and smack her! (please dont judge me for being honest about this.  I would never do it but she is going to give me a nervous bloody breakdown soon!)

Time outing her is counter productive as she goes in her playpen when she gets too boisterous to calm down, but it makes her worse when she comes out.  Is it just a matter of perseverance??

 

[Cob-Web]

Laura

Do you remember the terrible twos, threes and fours that your kids went through? Try and look at this puppy behaviour in the same way, but condensed into a few weeks rather than months  

All I can suggest is what has been said before; that you ensure that all the family members are consitent in their approach; including your children - who are far more difficult to teach than any puppy!

Maybe your older children could read The Pefect Puppy and take responsibility for teaching the rest of the family how to deal with a particular type of behaviour - yelping when Bella nips, ignoring her when she barks, or deciding together on the words that you are going to use for different commands; OFF or DOWN, SIT, LEAVE etc. This will also help establish your childrens position in the household in Bella's mind; important as she gets older; especially if she remains willful.

Try not to blame Bella for her behaviour, it is perfectly normal puppy behaviour and she could no more stop doing it than stop breathing - you'd have far more to worry about if she wasn't like this, as then there definitely would be something wrong  

It WILL get better, but you have to invest a lot of time, effort and tears now to reach a point where you only get to the end of your tether once or twice a day  

[Bellbellsmum]

Thanks Rachel,   you know she's asleep on the old sofa in the conservatory now looking totally edible.   Simon came home from work and she was in her play pen looking totally sorry for herself.

He's all "have you been a naughty girl again Bella?"  and she looks at him grinning and wagging, and a look like "you wouldnt believe what they.ve done to me daddy while you were out"

She'd been in isolation long enough so we let her out and she was ok then.

[Pammy]

It is a matter of persistence and consistency. As soon as she get's too excited - stop playing or doing whatever it was you were doing. Ignore her, if she doesn't calm - then it's time out zone.

She wants to be having fun and to be with you all. She will soon learn that "naughty" behaviour gets her put away from you so it will work. It just takes patience.

It's hard but try not to get yourself in a battle of wills. She will win if you do that. The only battle is for her to realise that you and your family call the shots.

I don't know if you do any rough or exciting play with Bella - but don't. This is too much for them and sends out mixed messages. Keep everything calm and steady. Have a specific toy or place - better outside, where she can run and get excited. Inddors, try tiring her out with mental exercise - basic command work, sit, stay etc etc.

Commands is another important area - they must be used to mean the same thing. If you use "down" when she's sitting to make her lie down, then you can't use it to for getting off the sofa etc - she will be confused and not know what down means. You might want to use "off" to get her off the sofa and while saying it - pick her up swiflty and firmly and put her on the floor.  

Either way - a firm NO should always mean the same thing - ie stop that.

This is a tough time and will seem never-ending - and some of it will never end coz that's what makes Cockers  But the bolshy infuriating puppy stage will end. How soon though is largely down to yourselves.

Everyone must treat Bella exactly the same - no exceptions and you will get through this.

Chin up - keep at it.

[PennyB]

Could she also be confusing the playpen with what its meant to be. If its a play pen and somewhere to go for a play/quiet time etc. then it may be worth changing the time out zone to somewhere else. They always say with crates (used for a similar purpose) that they should never be used as punishment.

[Cob-Web]

Have a specific toy or place - better outside, where she can run and get excited. Inddors, try tiring her out with mental exercise - basic command work, sit, stay etc etc.

The only way I get any time on COL ( ) is to give Molo an empty and de-labeled 500ml plastic water bottle with a few of his kibble in (leave the lid off) - it gives him a workout on the kitchen floor while I sit at the table 'supervising'  

After about 10 minutes, once he has worked out how to get the kibble out and has flattened the bottle out of all recognition - he collapses for 1/2 hour, exhausted!

I always make sure the bottle doesn't get punctured as the plastic is really sharp once its broken - but he has a brilliant time with it.

BTW this is a very noisy game!

[Tracey J]

I totally sympathise with you Laura, honestly.  There were times when I was in tears over Molly's behaviour.  I felt a failure and totally inadequate that one tiny bundle of fur could be controlling my life!  One thing I found when things got out of hand was to take her for a walk (no matter the weather - which as you can imagine in Scotland, it was usually raining! )  At this age, it wasn't about tiring her out (although it did that too), it was about distracting her with all the lovely smells and noises outside.  Each time I took her out (when things were bad) I always wondered why I hadn't done it earlier - before reaching screaming point.  I'm not known for learning from my mistakes   .  It will get better, but I know time drags when you're miserable.

Chin up.
x

[suki1964]

Laura, Ive been there too - in tears over a bundle of fluff with teeth Alfie is now 5 months and although he still has his moments (hes at the barking stage now) things are so much better and today i realised that I have actually enjoyed him lately

All i can offer is to be as consistant as possible with her and that really does mean the whole family. If your children are little then if they are playing together you or hubby need to be there for now to supervise and to intervene when things get too boisterous - children waving hands around are just too tempting to a pup.

Time outs in somewhere safe and boring are a really good idea if you can manage it. If not just turn your heel and walk away ignoring her. You may find this is every two minutes for now but I promise you it does work.

And for you I would really advise time out for yourself. Pups are hard work as you are finding out. Pups and children you must be totally stressed. Try and find an hour when hubby is home to walk away from it all and let someone else deal with it for a while. If my hubby doesnt do his share of occupying and playing with alfie in the evenings he soon gets to know about it

Keep in there, you will see the light at the end of the tunnel before you know it

 

[LROGERS]

Have you got a baby gate, we had one on the door from the kitchen to the rest of the house from 13 weeks old after going through what you describe.
Only allowed the dog into the rest of the house when we invited her, then if she behaved incorrectly back to the kitchen for half an hour.
It took time but worked. She was 5 months old before she could behave properly in the living room. Again, its about showing who makes the rules you need to master this for what you have yet to come!!!!
We still use the baby gate its good when we have visitors with small children etc.

[Cob-Web]

Have you got a baby gate, we had one on the door from the kitchen to the rest of the house

I agree with this wholeheartedly - we had it already installed when Molo arrived home, and he ran straight through the bars he was so small   He can still get his head through now, so will sit and watch if we are in the living room without him  

 

[Bellbellsmum]

Yes we have a baby gate, but we use it to cordon off the utility room for her as a time out zone.  I'm terrified that if I leave her in the kitchen alone she will eat the cupboards.

Anyway, after our visit to the vet today, Vet confirmed Bella has a really high pain threshold (not a good thing as means dominant personality) and that she was "Very Naughty"  She bit the vet (sort of playfully) and wouldnt stop until the vet pinched her top lip.  Take into account Bella was there because she ate a wasp and had a bottom lip twice the normal size  

I'm really fed up.   I'm seriously thinking we have got a duff dog.  Why me?  The vet said Black cockers are notoriously naughty.  I never heard this before.

Start puppy training Thursday.  Last resort before I hang myself and the dog from the nearest rafter!  

 

[PennyB]

I'm really fed up.  I'm seriously thinking we have got a duff dog.  Why me?  The vet said Black cockers are notoriously naughty.  I never heard this before.

Start puppy training Thursday.  Last resort before I hang myself and the dog from the nearest rafter! 

I think some pups (in general whatever the breed, colour, or sex) are just harder work than others like kids and need careful handling! My mum always said that if she'd had my sister 1st she wouldn't have had another.

As I've said before Ruby was a nightmare dog but I managed eventually.

I don't think for one minute you've got a duff dog. Puppies are generally hard work and a lot harder than we realise or remember (the only pups I grew up with my mum dealt with and then as an adult I had my own and boy was it an experience.

I think its wrong of your vet to make this assumption as its anecdotal.

Good luck with the puppy class. I found with Ruby I combined it with some 1-2-1 classes with the trainer which were well worth it (some just need a little more work on them and careful handling).