Health testing

[Rachelre10]

Hi, I would like to breed my cockers and want to go about it properly.  Therefore I want to health test them have been looking into breeding for several months and don't plan to breed for another year, but I am unsure as to how you go about health testing I was told that animal health trust, I have been in contact with them and they do not do tests for cockers?

Thanks x

[elaine.e]

Have you had a good read of the "stickies" on the breeding board?

This one tells you things you need to consider before contemplating breeding
http://www.cockersonline.co.uk/discuss/index.php?topic=3428.msg32148#msg32148

and this one tells you about health testing
http://www.cockersonline.co.uk/discuss/index.php?topic=63629.msg925471#msg925471

[elaine.e]

Can I ask why you want to breed? I think from looking at your previous posts you have a solid coloured dog, a parti coloured bitch and have just bought a solid coloured puppy. Do you intend to breed your solid dog and parti bitch, as that would be unusual. Most breeders breed solids to solids and partis to partis after careful consideration of the pedigrees of the dog and bitch they plan to mate.

Do you know if the parents of your Cockers were health tested? Their breeders should have told you and if health tested should have the paperwork, that can then be checked on the KC website, to prove that the parents have been tested and what the results were.

Breeding is a huge undertaking and in the current economic climate breeders sometimes find themselves with unsold puppies eating them out of house and home. It's also difficult, if not impossible, for a newcomer to select an appropriate dog for their bitch unless they already have a lot of knowledge about pedigrees or an experienced breeder as a mentor.

[Jane S]

One other point to consider is your location - you live in an area which is populated by many puppy farms (some licensed, some illegal) which makes it difficult for small, hobby breeders to find good homes for their puppies (I had a friend who lived in your area and no longer breeds but she found it very difficult firstly being tarred with the puppy farm label because of where she lived and then finding homes when puppy farm pups were always available and being sold so cheaply)

[Rachelre10]

Thank you for your advise, I love the breed and really want to experience breeding myself.
I don't just want to breed without considering all aspects and all problems that could arise that is why I want to health test my babies, the breeders of mine all had one parent health check.
so I still need mine health checked to be sure no health issues arise, I understand that certain areas have bad reputation and people can get tared with the same brush but I feel if I go about things properly, people will see that and i will have all paperwork to prove so.
I have done a lot of research into Milo (my black male) pedigree and I'm keen to learn more and more about the breed.

Thanks Rachel x

[piph]

I may be pilloried for saying this    , but, there are often negative comments on here when other members express and interest in becoming a breeder.  If you have thoroughly investigated, and learnt all you can, and go about it in the right way, taking advice from the breeder/s of your own dogs about studs etc, and you have an established breeder who is prepared to mentor you, then go for it!  If we didn't have 'new' breeders, then eventually all cocker breeders would become too old to continue, and there would be none left.

Good luck with your enterprise and I hope it works out well for you.

[Rachelre10]

Thank you very much !
Everyone has to start somewhere x

[BeeBoo]

Completely agree 

[Cayley]

The chance of your dogs being suitable for each other is slim. There are about 5,000 Cockers bred every quarter and I would say about 100 of those litters are well bred show types if that. What makes your puppies stand out amongst the others  .

[Rachelre10]

Well I am going to have them health tested first of all, to ensure no health problems could arise from my pups.
I will then join the kennel club assured breeder scheme, and get myself a kennel club affix.
If I go and do everything I possibly can to make sure I have beautiful healthy pups, I don't see how it's any different from everybody else on here.
Like I have said previously I need to start somewhere x

[Sharon]

I think even if you did everything correctly, as Jane as pointed out, because of the area you live in, which is full of puppy farmers, you may struggle to find homes for your pups.  I too have a friend in your area that has now given up breeding, her last litter she ended up selling for £300 as she couldn't find homes for them, she was an Assured Breeder and all her dogs tested too, she also had her affix.

[Helen]

Health is not the only pre-requisite for breeding.  Conformation, temperament, and excellence (whether it be in showing, agility, working, trialling) are all part of the package imho.

Are your dogs show or working lines or mixed?

[Cayley]

Well I am going to have them health tested first of all, to ensure no health problems could arise from my pups.
I will then join the kennel club assured breeder scheme, and get myself a kennel club affix.
If I go and do everything I possibly can to make sure I have beautiful healthy pups, I don't see how it's any different from everybody else on here.
Like I have said previously I need to start somewhere x

How much research have you done into your dog's pedigree, is it just see if they are unrelated. Health tests are only one part of breeding, what makes your dogs suitable to breed from, there is no point breeding for the sake of it. There is a thing called kennel blindness where people are blind to their own dogs faults. If you think your dogs are ideal then you would not be a responsible breeder. Breeders that say all their puppies are beautiful are not realistic, you should be breeding show types that could be shown or working types that could be worked. Having a litter is extremely hard work and finding homes can be very difficult.

[Nicola]

Health is not the only pre-requisite for breeding.  Conformation, temperament, and excellence (whether it be in showing, agility, working, trialling) are all part of the package imho.

Exactly, health testing is important but it's only part of what makes a dog good enough to be bred from. There are far too many indifferent quality dogs being bred just because they have a clear DNA test when this should be only part of the package. To go about things correctly you start by developing an interest in the breed and proving that your dog is a good enough example to warrant being bred from, by having it objectively judged either through showing or working/trialling and health tested, and THEN you maybe think about breeding. You also research lines and traits to find the best stud for your bitch - it is extremely unlikely that it is the dog that happens to live in the same house. Cockers are a vastly over-bred breed, and the vast majority of these litters are poor or indifferent quality pet breeding; unless you have a very good reason for it - and if you do you'll also have a waiting list for your dog's offspring - you're putting your bitch at a very real risk just to add yet more dogs to an already extremely overcrowded market.

And that's before you get into the practicalities of rearing a litter; I work as breeding scheme supervisor at Hearing Dogs and although sometimes it can be straightforward I also see everything that can and does go wrong. We breed a lot of litters but this year alone we've had 2 bitches needing emergency out of hours caesareans, 4 stillborn puppies, 3 neonatal deaths, 1 death at 8 days old after constant nursing, 2 bitches whose milk failed to come in necessitating round the clock bottle feeding for 2 litters of 7 pups, one severe post-partum infection which meant a very poorly bitch, one case of mastitis which abscessed and burst due to antibiotic resistance, one pup with a severe heart murmur who just had surgery at Cambridge Vet School at 8 weeks old to fix it and one pup with pulmonic stenosis who will need major surgery at 5 or 6 months old to fix it if she makes it that far - and none of that is covered by insurance.

[Rachelre10]

Thank you all for your opinions x